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View Poll Results: Is Quebec Independence a Legitimate Movement?
Yes 106 66.67%
No 53 33.33%
Voters: 159. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 03-22-2015, 11:08 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
Thanks for coming back to the discussion as opposed to doing a drive-by as many so often do.

Quebec separatists and also non-separatist nationalists are, as you say, trying to build a society on the "cosmpolitan" model (your choice of words, and a decent one).

In a sense, they are trying to build their own version of the American melting pot, only one that functions in French and also takes mostly French Canadian and international Francophonie cultural cues, as opposed to Anglo-American/Anglosphere ones.
Actually that doesn't sound like a bad idea at all. I'd be very interested to see this come to fruitation - as the anglo-dominated culture in North America can be a bit dull at times.
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Old 03-22-2015, 12:33 PM
 
Location: South Jersey
13,365 posts, read 7,044,164 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
Thanks for coming back to the discussion as opposed to doing a drive-by as many so often do.

Quebec separatists and also non-separatist nationalists are, as you say, trying to build a society on the "cosmpolitan" model (your choice of words, and a decent one).

In a sense, they are trying to build their own version of the American melting pot, only one that functions in French and also takes mostly French Canadian and international Francophonie cultural cues, as opposed to Anglo-American/Anglosphere ones.
Quote:
Originally Posted by bostonkid123 View Post
Actually that doesn't sound like a bad idea at all. I'd be very interested to see this come to fruitation - as the anglo-dominated culture in North America can be a bit dull at times.
French is already the majority (and official) language in Quebec. Quebecois culture is the predominant one. What you're saying makes no sense to me because Quebec already is French; it's just trying to stay that way. I agree with you about "Anglo culture," but I don't agree with that particular term. I see it as an increasingly bland & globalized monoculture. Quebec would be far less unique with this melting pot proposal; its only significant difference from the USA would be language.

It's a good idea to understand all nationalist movements as fundamentally consisting of efforts to preserve a nation's distinctiveness. In Quebec's case, that would obviously include the French language. But I don't consider mainstream Quebec separatism to be a nationalist movement because that's all it really hopes to achieve. Acajack's assessment (which I see as the correct one) is that Quebec separatism basically wants to make Quebec into something it traditionally isn't, just as long as the French language is maintained. I would imagine many Quebecois may disagree with that aim simply because it's not far-reaching enough.
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Old 03-22-2015, 01:53 PM
 
2,566 posts, read 2,186,748 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by snj90 View Post
French is already the majority (and official) language in Quebec. Quebecois culture is the predominant one. What you're saying makes no sense to me because Quebec already is French; it's just trying to stay that way. I agree with you about "Anglo culture," but I don't agree with that particular term. I see it as an increasingly bland & globalized monoculture. Quebec would be far less unique with this melting pot proposal; its only significant difference from the USA would be language.

It's a good idea to understand all nationalist movements as fundamentally consisting of efforts to preserve a nation's distinctiveness. In Quebec's case, that would obviously include the French language. But I don't consider mainstream Quebec separatism to be a nationalist movement because that's all it really hopes to achieve. Acajack's assessment (which I see as the correct one) is that Quebec separatism basically wants to make Quebec into something it traditionally isn't, just as long as the French language is maintained. I would imagine many Quebecois may disagree with that aim simply because it's not far-reaching enough.
For God's sake it was just an idea/proposal/suggestion posted on an online forum. Taking it way too seriously.
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Old 03-23-2015, 08:41 AM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
21,961 posts, read 27,403,107 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by snj90 View Post
French is already the majority (and official) language in Quebec. Quebecois culture is the predominant one. What you're saying makes no sense to me because Quebec already is French; it's just trying to stay that way. I agree with you about "Anglo culture," but I don't agree with that particular term. I see it as an increasingly bland & globalized monoculture. Quebec would be far less unique with this melting pot proposal; its only significant difference from the USA would be language.

It's a good idea to understand all nationalist movements as fundamentally consisting of efforts to preserve a nation's distinctiveness. In Quebec's case, that would obviously include the French language. But I don't consider mainstream Quebec separatism to be a nationalist movement because that's all it really hopes to achieve. Acajack's assessment (which I see as the correct one) is that Quebec separatism basically wants to make Quebec into something it traditionally isn't, just as long as the French language is maintained. I would imagine many Quebecois may disagree with that aim simply because it's not far-reaching enough.
It's interesting you would say that because this idea is not something you hear very often. People who voice this concern are seen as being part of the tin-foil hat crowd. In spite of what some people say in Anglo-Canada, Québécois people really want to embrace modernity and be open to the world. They just want to do it on their terms. Whether or not they are misguided and that this will lead to the downfall of the culture is a matter of debate but they certainly don't see why Quebec (independent or not) can't be some kind of new world francophone version of the U.S. or Brazil, with a strong base (original) culture and language augmented and enriched by that of newcomers.

That said, you should not underestimate the importance of language. It does make a difference in cultural cues and Quebec is not simply like the rest of North American except that everything is in French.

To me this is a powerful factor that makes the vision shared by most Québécois at least reasonably realistic. If not a certainty.
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Old 03-23-2015, 08:48 AM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bostonkid123 View Post
Actually that doesn't sound like a bad idea at all. I'd be very interested to see this come to fruitation.
It might not be obvious to people outside the province, but Quebec is already maybe 80% of the way there.
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Old 03-23-2015, 08:49 AM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
21,961 posts, read 27,403,107 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bostonkid123 View Post
- as the anglo-dominated culture in North America can be a bit dull at times.
I don't think anglo culture is dull, but certainly our land mass could use some more authentic cultural diversity.
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Old 03-27-2015, 10:19 PM
 
Location: Montreal
359 posts, read 264,945 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
I don't think anglo culture is dull, but certainly our land mass could use some more authentic cultural diversity.
It already has it. We can keep Quebec culture virile while reaping the benefits of Canada. Anglo Canadian culture is hardly extantm much less so than Quebec culture. There is no rush.
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Old 03-27-2015, 11:18 PM
 
2,566 posts, read 2,186,748 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PBeauchamp View Post
It already has it. We can keep Quebec culture virile while reaping the benefits of Canada. Anglo Canadian culture is hardly extantm much less so than Quebec culture. There is no rush.
I don't get why you bother repeating yourself, as you'll win no friends from either side. All of ROC will see people like you as blood-sucking parasites. I mean, you openly broadcast your intentions to suck the blood of rest of us until it's dry - you think we will just let you do it? Lol. At the same time, Quebecois separatists will also see people like you as nothing more than mercenary opportunists who are only in this for your own personal gains with no sense of honor or courage to actually stand up for what you believe in.

There is a very ancient Chinese idiom describing people of your ilk: "Eating inside while wanting to go outside."
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Old 03-27-2015, 11:20 PM
 
Location: Earth
4,534 posts, read 3,113,291 times
Reputation: 3373
They spoke English when I visited
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Old 03-28-2015, 04:44 AM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
21,961 posts, read 27,403,107 times
Reputation: 8613
Quote:
Originally Posted by bostonkid123 View Post
I don't get why you bother repeating yourself, as you'll win no friends from either side. All of ROC will see people like you as blood-sucking parasites. I mean, you openly broadcast your intentions to suck the blood of rest of us until it's dry - you think we will just let you do it? Lol. At the same time, Quebecois separatists will also see people like you as nothing more than mercenary opportunists who are only in this for your own personal gains with no sense of honor or courage to actually stand up for what you believe in.

There is a very ancient Chinese idiom describing people of your ilk: "Eating inside while wanting to go outside."
His attitude serves neither the federalists nor the sovereignists.
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