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View Poll Results: Is Quebec Independence a Legitimate Movement?
Yes 106 66.67%
No 53 33.33%
Voters: 159. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 01-11-2015, 02:29 PM
 
Location: New York Area
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
Totally ludicrous. Quebec in many ways defines Canada both past and present. Way out of proportion to its share of the population.
And draws a large amount of equalization and other transfer payments.
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Old 01-11-2015, 02:32 PM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
21,960 posts, read 27,390,495 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jbgusa View Post
And draws a large amount of equalization and other transfer payments.
You're really good at sticking to your talking points! How is this related?
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Old 01-11-2015, 02:32 PM
 
Location: Kootenays
110 posts, read 74,752 times
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I voted "no". Certainly Quebec could vote at some future time to leave Canada. I just doubt they would be willing to accept their percentage of the national debt.

Without Quebec assuming their portion of the debt I can't see the Federal government letting them leave.
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Old 01-11-2015, 02:33 PM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jbgusa View Post
What was so bad about pre-1976 Quebec? In places like Montreal signs were in both languages. In places like Quebec City, more unilingual French. And I assume the Townships were more Anglo.

Was that terrible?
I am old enough to remember that era. It wasn't necessarily ''terrible'' but French was most definitely on a downward slide.
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Old 01-11-2015, 02:36 PM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
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Quote:
Originally Posted by awsmith View Post
I voted "no". Certainly Quebec could vote at some future time to leave Canada. I just doubt they would be willing to accept their percentage of the national debt.

Without Quebec assuming their portion of the debt I can't see the Federal government letting them leave.
The PQ I am pretty sure have always said they'd be paying their share of the debt. Of course the percentage would have to be negotiated but they've never said they'd walk away from it.

Not exactly a good message to send to the financiers of the world when you are starting a new country.
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Old 01-11-2015, 02:42 PM
 
Location: New York Area
15,972 posts, read 6,288,059 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
You're really good at sticking to your talking points! How is this related?
I may start a thread on this issue since it is more general.

Prior to WW II countries sought and received independence when they were "ready." This generally meant a self-sustaining economy and some degree of political coherence. Canada was given responsible government, in stages, starting, if I recall correctly, in the late 1830's. Canada achieved dominion status in 1867. Australia received dominion status in 1887, if I recall correctly. Britain was not providing either aid.

Fast forward to independence after WW II. With a few exceptions such as Israel, almost every country has been a basket case. Only India has partially emerged from that status. I have no doubt that Quebec, as an independent country would require assistance either from Canada, the U.S. or the international community. Thus the issue of transfer payments is highly relevant since, as another poster pointed out, Canada would likely insist on Quebec assuming a share of the national debt in exchange for federal assets.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
I am old enough to remember that era. It wasn't necessarily ''terrible'' but French was most definitely on a downward slide.
In which parts of Le Belle Provence? Maybe in Hull (now Gatineau) or the Montreal area. French was quite alive and well when I visited Montreal in November 1976, days after the Parti Quebecois won the election and before they could make changes. The education bill, I believe 101 had passed but I dont' think the sign law came in until 1977.

There was lots of French in Montreal.
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Old 01-11-2015, 02:49 PM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
21,960 posts, read 27,390,495 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jbgusa View Post
The education bill, I believe 101 had passed but I dont' think the sign law came in until 1977.

.
Both the education and sign provisions were part of the same bill, the Charter of the French Language. Known as Bill 101.
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Old 01-11-2015, 02:50 PM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
21,960 posts, read 27,390,495 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jbgusa View Post

There was lots of French in Montreal.
Of course there was lots of French. There were millions of francophones in the Montreal area. But that doesn't mean their language (and by extension the speakers of it in many cases) wasn't often relegated to second-class status.
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Old 01-11-2015, 02:52 PM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
21,960 posts, read 27,390,495 times
Reputation: 8613
Quote:
Originally Posted by jbgusa View Post
I may start a thread on this issue since it is more general.

l.
Go for it. A whole new topic we've never discussed before. Here no elsewhere.

Just reading the most recent comments, and I get all confused. It's like you are Don Cherry masquerading as Francis Fukuyama or something...
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Old 01-11-2015, 02:54 PM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
21,960 posts, read 27,390,495 times
Reputation: 8613
Quote:
Originally Posted by jbgusa View Post

Prior to WW II countries sought and received independence when they were "ready." This generally meant a self-sustaining economy and some degree of political coherence. Canada was given responsible government, in stages, starting, if I recall correctly, in the late 1830's. Canada achieved dominion status in 1867. Australia received dominion status in 1887, if I recall correctly. Britain was not providing either aid.

Fast forward to independence after WW II. With a few exceptions such as Israel, almost every country has been a basket case. Only India has partially emerged from that status. I have no doubt that Quebec, as an independent country would require assistance either from Canada, the U.S. or the international community. Thus the issue of transfer payments is highly relevant since, as another poster pointed out, Canada would likely insist on Quebec assuming a share of the national debt in exchange for federal assets.

.
What an odd reading of history.

Countries for the most didn't and don't seek and receive independence. Countries ''take'' their independence.

The Westminster Statute of 1931 granting de facto independence to British colonies like Canada, Australia, etc. is a pretty unique historical circumstance. It's not the way things normally happen.
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