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Funny, I had the same experience in high school with a kid from Calgary. I went several weeks with no clue that he was "foreign" until one day he mentioned having to update his green card (or something along those lines) for work. I was so confused. Why would an American need a green card!? In another more recent case, I befriended a guy who weeks later turned out to be from Oakville, Ontario. I hadn't the slightest inkling that he was supposed to be "foreign" either. The significant thing about this case is that I had lived in Canada.
So when I read these threads about the similarities between Canadians and Americans, my mind is already made up. I would call English Canadians essentially the same group of people, but with a different self-perception of who they think they are and want to be. They are constantly indoctrinated from childhood to think of themselves as Canadians, and in school they learn the moral virtues of Canadians compared to the decadence of Americans. In a similar fashion, Americans are raised to believe that freedom and equality set Americans apart. In reality, these values are heavily overexaggerated on both sides of the border, and blur the reality of Canadians and Americans sharing a common culture. In practice, English Canadians possess a localized version of American culture, much like that which exists in Texas, New England, the deep South, or the Mid-Atlantic.
I agree, but I don't think there is anything wrong with them thinking of those things as Canadian virtues or culture, really American culture is pretty ambiguous, the same is true with Canadian culture. We are both countries founded and heavily influenced by immigrant cultures, and mostly the same immigrant cultures. Both countries cultures will continue to evolve over time, always maintaining differences, but for the most part being similar.
Another example I could use, my brother works for the Air Force in the air defense for North America, not actually apart of NORAD, but they work with them a lot, in his department there are Canadians, Australians, and British. It's easy to tell the Australians and British apart, but you can't tell the Canadians apart from the Americans. Again, get in some deep long conversations and differences will come up, but they are small differences.
lol, yeah, it probably is a stereotype, btw, what's yinz? The rest I get though, but Ya'll is definitely regional and not a national word. ....
A little bit of trivia for you, both words are of Scots-Irish origin, brought to North America by Scots-Irish immigrants:
Yinz is one of the most common slang terms in the Pittsburgh dialect (a.k.a. Pittsburghese), particularly amongst those who were born and raised in the area. The origins of this word date back to the Scots-Irish settlers in the Ohio Valley region, who combined the words "you ones" into you’uns, which eventually became youns, then yunz, and eventually yinz. So it commonly refers to the collective "you" as in "Where yinz going?"
Y'all is a phrase originating in the Scots language brought to Ireland by Scottish farmers and was then brought to the American South by Scots-Irish immigrants primarily from Northern Ireland. The word filtered down to slaves and their descendants, and became a feature of African American vernacular English. African Americans moved to the northern cities and brought this word with them.
It's easy to tell the Australians and British apart, but you can't tell the Canadians apart from the Americans. Again, get in some deep long conversations and differences will come up, but they are small differences.
No, there's an easier way. Insult them to their face. A Canadian will probably say "Excuse me??". An American will let their jaw drop wide enough for a blue whale to fit in their mouth.
I agree, but I don't think there is anything wrong with them thinking of those things as Canadian virtues or culture, really American culture is pretty ambiguous, the same is true with Canadian culture. We are both countries founded and heavily influenced by immigrant cultures, and mostly the same immigrant cultures. Both countries cultures will continue to evolve over time, always maintaining differences, but for the most part being similar.
Another example I could use, my brother works for the Air Force in the air defense for North America, not actually apart of NORAD, but they work with them a lot, in his department there are Canadians, Australians, and British. It's easy to tell the Australians and British apart, but you can't tell the Canadians apart from the Americans. Again, get in some deep long conversations and differences will come up, but they are small differences.
I generally agree with your views.. There are alot of similarities.. What irks me though is when some think that just because those similarities are there, automatically makes us just another Texas or New England just because we border a larger country with a more dominant culture.. We are indeed a separate people and even within our own borders there's differences.. For some of us, there is even a pride in being identified as Canadian though when reading in the Canadian forums - its hard to see with some posters. I think it would become clear to them once they actually drive other Canadians away with divisive talk. Even though Americans are diverse and there are many regions, one thing I do admire about the present day U.S is there seems to be a common and united pride in being American first.. I don't see it to the same degree in Canada.
I would call English Canadians essentially the same group of people, but with a different self-perception of who they think they are and want to be. They are constantly indoctrinated from childhood to think of themselves as Canadians, and in school they learn the moral virtues of Canadians compared to the decadence of Americans. In a similar fashion, Americans are raised to believe that freedom and equality set Americans apart. In reality, these values are heavily overexaggerated on both sides of the border, and blur the reality of Canadians and Americans sharing a common culture. In practice, English Canadians possess a localized version of American culture, much like that which exists in Texas, New England, the deep South, or the Mid-Atlantic.
Hey Nat, are you saying you just didn't have cablevision until 1974 at your house? Because it was available in Vancouver before that. I think you're quite a bit younger than me so maybe it's a bit before your time? but Vancouver had the beginnings of cablevision by 1958 and in 1962 was when Vancouver Cablevision Ltd. became a big deal in the Vancouver Greater Metro area. At that time I visited Vancouver every summer and I remember seeing American broadcasts on cablevision in Vancouver in the mid 1960's, one of my favorite shows was Star Trek which first aired in 1966 and was an immediate big hit.
"Originally Posted by Natnasci View Post
Even though " Cablevision " arrived in the 6o's we didn't get it until about 1974 or so"
One thing to take into account was access. Cable just didn't appear everywhere overnight. Sort of like when the internet started, many places could not even get access.
Even though Cable was started in the early 60's it took ten years for the cable to be laid so that most everyone could subscribe to it.
"Cablevision companies started wiring the Lower Mainland for cable TV. The Lower Mainland was divided up into 8 different cable companies. Vancouver, Richmond and South Burnaby were served by Vancouver Cablevision. Western Cablevision served New Westminster, Surrey and Langley. It took over 10 years to lay cable throughout the area. Its attraction was quality reception of American stations. Here is the early cable TV line-up: The listings in “Italics” are for Western Cablevision if different from Vancouver Cablevision"
I don't know the reason why we didn't get it until 1974, whether it had just become available, or my parents thought we watched enough TV ?
There was no interest in getting US stations in our household, which seemed to be the main reason people got cable...not JUST because they were US, but because some people wanted more stations.
I don't believe the U.S is even close to being as racially mosaic and accepting as us. We have so many non white ethnicities that we easily live amongst and we all get along. No one gets alienated. It's honestly a beautiful thing. Ontario is becoming so ethnically and racially diverse it's unreal.
The United States has yet to get to this point. You may not be as "racist" as you were 60 years ago but your sure as Hell are not nearly as integrated as you would like to believe. I do not view America as a racist society but it has some things to overcome and attitudes to dispel before you guys reach our point.
Funny, I had the same experience in high school with a kid from Calgary. I went several weeks with no clue that he was "foreign" until one day he mentioned having to update his green card (or something along those lines) for work. I was so confused. Why would an American need a green card!? In another more recent case, I befriended a guy who weeks later turned out to be from Oakville, Ontario. I hadn't the slightest inkling that he was supposed to be "foreign" either. The significant thing about this case is that I had lived in Canada.
So when I read these threads about the similarities between Canadians and Americans, my mind is already made up. I would call English Canadians essentially the same group of people, but with a different self-perception of who they think they are and want to be. They are constantly indoctrinated from childhood to think of themselves as Canadians, and in school they learn the moral virtues of Canadians compared to the decadence of Americans. In a similar fashion, Americans are raised to believe that freedom and equality set Americans apart. In reality, these values are heavily overexaggerated on both sides of the border, and blur the reality of Canadians and Americans sharing a common culture. In practice, English Canadians possess a localized version of American culture, much like that which exists in Texas, New England, the deep South, or the Mid-Atlantic.
We do say that Alberta is our most American province, for a reason. It wouldn't surprise me that you didn't pick up he was Canadian, not be because he didn't have any telling signs, but because you just didn't pick up on them. Another Canadian might have, but it may be more difficult than say someone from another province.
"In practice, English Canadians possess a localized version of American culture, much like that which exists in Texas, New England, the deep South, or the Mid-Atlantic"
I can't really identify with that and think its a bit too simplistic.. I don't identify with being a localized American culture like Texas. It is more like a localized English Canadian culture than localized American English Culture.. Its almost as though, since the U.S is bigger we are just another different version of it - i don't jive with that and I think most Canadians wouldn't either. Its mostly semantics but we have to be careful connecting English Canadian culture with English American culture just because the U.S is larger.. How about just different english regions with various cultures within the Canamerican landscape. Why should we acquiesce to being just another different American culture..
l
Canadian look at the US, especially the midwest and see us as backwards and you don't want to admit that most of your country is similar. But in reality, the midwest is not backwards at all, Iowa and Minnesota have led the way in many politically progressive ways. The US is more conservative then Canada, but I wouldn't say Canada is extremely more progressive or liberal. The US has regions more progressive then anywhere in Canada. The US and Canada are both very diverse countries, but I stick to my belief that the majority of our people share a common culture.
Absolutely! As a Canadian from multicultural Southern Ontario (I never knew anything else), I've always considered myself pretty liberal on most issues. But I've known many Americans who are considerably more liberal on many issues than I am.
I have to disagree with you about (part of) the Midwest. After having grown up primarily in Southern Ontario and Montreal, I found aspects of Michigan less "progressive," for lack of a better word, but certainly no less "progressive" than some parts of Canada.
What you say about Iowa and Minnesota is true, though. Those states have among the most highly educated populations in North America and high rates of civic engagement (as does New Hampshire. Hence the reason why Presidential campaigns start with the Iowa caucuses and the New Hampshire primaries).
Last edited by newdixiegirl; 01-01-2015 at 03:11 PM..
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