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Old 04-09-2015, 08:17 AM
 
Location: Canada
170 posts, read 137,160 times
Reputation: 221

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
I don't see the anglophones of Canada as "masters". I see them as equals and partners.

Maybe that's the difference between you (and a few others) and me.
That is not what the Thibodeau types show by their actions. They persistently put francophones in the role of the helpless minority that needs to rely on government generosity to make French "equal";. We all know French is not equal in Canada, it hasn't been since 1763, and never will be. The government can force some outlandish language rules on people but they can never make French truly equal because it is spoken unilingually by about 10-15% of the population and dropping.

It is frankly sad that French needs to hide behind a complex set of language laws that apparently are never enough and now stretching into federal territory just to survive. The only way to truly save French and Quebec is through independence. The rest is just delaying. Pauline Marois and PKP as flawed as they may be deserve a pat on the back for having a shred of backbone that has been lost by so many francophones who prefer to mortgage their future for a the chance to maintain the facade of their equality that no one buys into except for them and a few sheep in Ontario.
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Old 04-09-2015, 08:22 AM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
21,937 posts, read 27,338,144 times
Reputation: 8602
Quote:
Originally Posted by MattCassidy View Post
That is not what the Thibodeau types show by their actions. They persistently put francophones in the role of the helpless minority that needs to rely on government generosity to make French "equal";. .
To me, he is more like a simple Canadian citizen who wants the law to be respected.
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Old 04-09-2015, 02:17 PM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
21,937 posts, read 27,338,144 times
Reputation: 8602
Quote:
Originally Posted by MattCassidy View Post
No. Outside of Quebec Chinese is more important than French. The only reason we have this is because of the demands of Quebec. No Quebec, and no language mess.
Not true at all about Chinese.

Outside Quebec, Chinese language speakers and francophones are about the same in number: about 1 million.

But "Chinese" is split up into Mandarin and Cantonese, which are not mutually intelligible when spoken.

Assuming you want to provide service in either Mandarin or Cantonese or French, French will by far allow you to serve more Canadians. Especially given the fact the intergenerational retention rate for French is much higher than for any Chinese language.

Regardless, it's still an absurd argument.

Imagine a Swiss German arguing that Somali is more important in their country than French or Italian.

Wouldn't most people around the world think he's a bit of a dimwit?

You've actually provided another example of why many people outside Canada are now less unanimous in their siding with the "anglo" side of the Great Canadian Debate than they used to be.

That's what happens when you put on a tin foil hat and start spouting inanities. People will start calling you on it - even some who were your allies at one point.

You guys should watch that. Seriously.
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Old 04-09-2015, 02:32 PM
 
Location: Canada
170 posts, read 137,160 times
Reputation: 221
Quote:
Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
Not true at all about Chinese.

Outside Quebec, Chinese language speakers and francophones are about the same in number: about 1 million.

But "Chinese" is split up into Mandarin and Cantonese, which are not mutually intelligible when spoken.

Assuming you want to provide service in either Mandarin or Cantonese or French, French will by far allow you to serve more Canadians. Especially given the fact the intergenerational retention rate for French is much higher than for any Chinese language.

Regardless, it's still an absurd argument.

Imagine a Swiss German arguing that Somali is more important in their country than French or Italian.

Wouldn't most people around the world think he's a bit of a dimwit?

You've actually provided another example of why many people outside Canada are now less unanimous in their siding with the "anglo" side of the Great Canadian Debate than they used to be.

That's what happens when you put on a tin foil hat and start spouting inanities. People will start calling you on it - even some who were your allies at one point.

You guys should watch that. Seriously.
I am on the "franco" side. I support language laws and independence. What more do I need to do? I speak French with a 100% perfect accent. Actually if I met you on the street and spoke French you would have no idea that I am an "anglophone" think Brian Mulroney.

If some Americans are starting to support Quebec independence, what is the difference between me doing it and them doing it? I don't see outsiders supporting forcing French on places like Ottawa that are 1% unilingual French speaking, I see them supporting independence.

Last edited by MattCassidy; 04-09-2015 at 02:43 PM..
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Old 04-09-2015, 02:37 PM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
21,937 posts, read 27,338,144 times
Reputation: 8602
Quote:
Originally Posted by MattCassidy View Post
I am on the "franco" side. I support language laws and independence. What more do I need to do? I speak French with a 100% perfect accent. Actually if I met you on the street and spoke French you would have no idea that I am an "anglophone" think Brian Mulroney.

If some Americans are starting to support Quebec independence, what is the difference between me doing it and them doing it? I don't see outsiders supporting forcing French on places like Ottawa that are 1% unilingual French speaking, I see them supporting independence.
I want to believe you but you exaggerate too much to make your points...
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Old 04-09-2015, 02:47 PM
 
Location: Canada
170 posts, read 137,160 times
Reputation: 221
Quote:
Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
I want to believe you but you exaggerate too much to make your points...
Believe what you want. Read my post history, I'm all for independence and I support language laws. Do I support demanding more and more language laws when the current set is enough? No. In that case just get independence already. Do I support branding anyone "anti-Quebec" who disagrees with zealous legislation? No, I think there is a limit. I am convinced Quebec should get independence because there is no other route I see that can pull us out of the quagmire and get us back on a road to progress. I am not one of those guys who wants to see an independent Quebec because I'm tired of hearing about it, I am for independence because it is the best and probably the only route for Quebec to take.
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Old 04-09-2015, 02:58 PM
 
34,365 posts, read 41,446,089 times
Reputation: 29853
Quote:
Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
To me, he is more like a simple Canadian citizen who wants the law to be respected.
Sounds to me like a contrary control freak who wants the world to bow down and acknowledge the delusional self-styled grandeur and magnificence of his Frenchness
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Old 04-10-2015, 09:07 AM
 
Location: Virginia (From Sweden)
105 posts, read 74,408 times
Reputation: 155
Quote:
Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
Just to show how there is a double-standard on this issue.

Guys like the Tim Hortons customer are routinely portrayed as victims and even heroes by many people, but someone like Michel Thibodeau gets roundly portrayed as an a55hole and his name gets dragged through the mud all across the country (and especially in the Ottawa area where he lives), for complaining about something that is actually legally guaranteed in Canada. (Which is not the case for Tim Hortons service in Laval or buying a métro ticket in Montreal.)

Air Canada's 'biggest mistake' - Macleans.ca
This gentleman looks like a hero to me. He is standing up for his lawful rights in the situation he is in. Good for him.
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Old 04-10-2015, 01:29 PM
 
34,365 posts, read 41,446,089 times
Reputation: 29853
I asked my cousins wife about the incident as she has been a flight attendant for Air Canada for the last 35 years, I was curious about having the police called on the guy. Evidently Air Canada has a zero tolerance policy about disruptive passengers, this guy was boisterous enough in his actions that he spooked some fellow passengers thus the cop was a mandatory procedure on his arrival,She also added that theres no way in hell that flight attendant wasnt functionally bilingual on that route, She also says Air Canada has no license with 7up the drink in question was a Sprite.
This guys subsequent filing of some 100 complaints over the death of French language services against the federal, provincial and Ottawa municipal governments points to an obsessive compulsive nature that goes far beyond being just a normal citizen wishing some minor point of law be respected.
Sounds like a nut bar to me, some one likely to go off the deep end.
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Old 04-10-2015, 01:30 PM
 
1,316 posts, read 2,032,062 times
Reputation: 1132
Quote:
Originally Posted by Anders Karlsson View Post
This gentleman looks like a hero to me. He is standing up for his lawful rights in the situation he is in. Good for him.
And yet another supposedly foreign national mysteriously turns up on City-Data and within the first handful of posts he puts on its various forums, he somehow finds himself in some Quebec-oriented threads on the Canada forum, singing the praises of Canada's francophones, Quebec, and the Quebecois. Pure coincidence, I'm sure.
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