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Old 09-13-2019, 01:52 PM
 
Location: Montreal
488 posts, read 300,308 times
Reputation: 384

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zoisite View Post
Going by that, Canada taken as a whole does not qualify as a single nation since it has too much diversity of people, politics, religions, ethnicities, languages and cultures. It is too much of everything else on planet Earth for there to be a correct definition of what Canada is. It is like a separate little planet on its own populated by many nations. A mini-Earth, a new world called Canada. Perhaps we will have to invent a new word to describe Canada's state of being. Under the circumstances I think Canada is doing pretty good then and everyone is making efforts to try to all get along well with each other, (except for the self-centered malcontented dissidents who want to call all the shots and rule our little world, of course).

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While Canada is diverse, let's keep it in the realm of reality. A mini-Earth?

You are exaggerating the diversity of Canada, and protraying Canada as a paragon of virtue and civilization.

Especially considering much of that diversity appears as an (often) voluntary segregation.

I.E. Anglo Canadians in North York aren't carousing on reservations with their first nations peers and can't (and usually won't) communicate with Quebecois unless someone learns/switches to a foreign language.

Many of these cultures, including many immigrant cultures, stay effectively separate and day to day life, and a chunk of the others are just assimilating to anglo Canadian or francophone culture rather than infusing their traits into Canada.

In many cases, these immigrant groups simply happen to live in Canada, and use it as a second-round draft pick to the U.S. That's just the reality of it.

The result is that eating shwarma or listening to Latin music still haven't become "Canadian" things, although they are things that exist in Canada.

The stance that Canada is actually the world's most diverse country with no real central or defining identity; the "every culture is my culture" stance; it is effectively an announcement that Canada has no culture.

And furthermore, it is an announcement that Canadians have lost faith in and abandoned what was once a Canadian set of values (anglo/franco cooperation, strong political/military affiliation with the British, a conservative society as opposed to the rebels to the south).

The replacement for that the old set of Canadian values is a rosy-the-rainbow portrayal of Canada as an exemplar of multiculturalism, diversity, acceptance, and peace, when in reality anglo Canada is simply passively dying and being replaced with something new.
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Old 09-13-2019, 01:52 PM
 
Location: British Columbia ☀️ ♥ 🍁 ♥ ☀️
7,718 posts, read 6,847,338 times
Reputation: 15368
Aha! I have it. We shall be called New United Nations of Earth. Nunoe!


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Old 09-13-2019, 02:11 PM
 
Location: British Columbia ☀️ ♥ 🍁 ♥ ☀️
7,718 posts, read 6,847,338 times
Reputation: 15368
Quote:
Originally Posted by PBeauchamp View Post


While Canada is diverse, let's keep it in the realm of reality. A mini-Earth?.......
Yada yada....

Sorry sweetie but you are barking up the wrong tree and wasting your efforts on me with your monopolistic pontifications. I prefer my rainbow reality and you prefer yours and I can't take yours seriously any more than you can take mine. We have a stalemate. We'll just have to agree to disagree.
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Old 09-13-2019, 02:12 PM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
22,395 posts, read 27,866,286 times
Reputation: 8762
Quote:
Originally Posted by PBeauchamp View Post
While Canada is diverse, let's keep it in the realm of reality. A mini-Earth?

You are exaggerating the diversity of Canada, and protraying Canada as a paragon of virtue and civilization.

Especially considering much of that diversity appears as an (often) voluntary segregation.

I.E. Anglo Canadians in North York aren't carousing on reservations with their first nations peers and can't (and usually won't) communicate with Quebecois unless someone learns/switches to a foreign language.

Many of these cultures, including many immigrant cultures, stay effectively separate and day to day life, and a chunk of the others are just assimilating to anglo Canadian or francophone culture rather than infusing their traits into Canada.

In many cases, these immigrant groups simply happen to live in Canada, and use it as a second-round draft pick to the U.S. That's just the reality of it.

The result is that eating shwarma or listening to Latin music still haven't become "Canadian" things, although they are things that exist in Canada.

The stance that Canada is actually the world's most diverse country with no real central or defining identity; the "every culture is my culture" stance; it is effectively an announcement that Canada has no culture.

And furthermore, it is an announcement that Canadians have lost faith in and abandoned what was once a Canadian set of values (anglo/franco cooperation, strong political/military affiliation with the British, a conservative society as opposed to the rebels to the south).

The replacement for that the old set of Canadian values is a rosy-the-rainbow portrayal of Canada as an exemplar of multiculturalism, diversity, acceptance, and peace, when in reality anglo Canada is simply passively dying and being replaced with something new.
Yes, with the exception of groups that wilfully and doggedly choose isolation, I don't think it has yet been clearly demonstrated that any of the immigrant cultures, beyond something like cuisine*, has anything resembling a long-term multi-generational staying power in Canada like the anglophone, francophone and indigenous have clearly shown they possess.


*And even with cuisine, you don't need a functioning culturally distinctive community in order to maintain or implant the cuisine. Plenty of places in Canada have Thai restaurants (for example) in spite of not having any Thai community to speak of.
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Old 09-13-2019, 02:20 PM
 
Location: Montreal
488 posts, read 300,308 times
Reputation: 384
Quote:
Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
Yes, with the exception of groups that wilfully and doggedly choose isolation, I don't think it has yet been clearly demonstrated that any of the immigrant cultures, beyond something like cuisine*, has anything resembling a long-term multi-generational staying power in Canada like the anglophone, francophone and indigenous have clearly shown they possess.
Well said.

Acajack, in your opinion, do you think that Quebec does a better job of this, of making immigrants part of the "nation", than the ROC?
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Old 09-13-2019, 02:50 PM
 
34,967 posts, read 42,210,593 times
Reputation: 30327
Quote:
Originally Posted by PBeauchamp View Post
That sounds like a marvelous plan.

Will you continue living in the independent Republic of Quebec, or will you move to Canada upon independence?

Actually, I'm thinking we should be called the Republic of Canada.
A separate Quebec doesnt inspire confidence in any rights afforded to the Anglo culture ,the reigning separatist government would put the wooden stake in whatever remained of the Anglo culture here in Quebec, so i know you'll miss me but i'll be on that 401 westbound
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Old 09-14-2019, 05:57 AM
 
34,967 posts, read 42,210,593 times
Reputation: 30327
Quote:
Originally Posted by PBeauchamp View Post
Well said.

Acajack, in your opinion, do you think that Quebec does a better job of this, of making immigrants part of the "nation", than the ROC?
IMO Quebec does very little to cultivate diversity with Bill101 and language police, if you want to come to Quebec you better be trying your best to be French,bills 21 and bill 9 ensure that uniformaty is achieved, in the ROC if you want to wear a religious symbol there no problem you can also speak or post signs in any language you want without language police telling you to put your sign in a language we deem fit or we will give you a big fine.
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Old 09-18-2019, 08:49 PM
 
Location: Montreal
488 posts, read 300,308 times
Reputation: 384
Quote:
Originally Posted by jambo101 View Post
IMO Quebec does very little to cultivate diversity with Bill101 and language police, if you want to come to Quebec you better be trying your best to be French,bills 21 and bill 9 ensure that uniformaty is achieved, in the ROC if you want to wear a religious symbol there no problem you can also speak or post signs in any language you want without language police telling you to put your sign in a language we deem fit or we will give you a big fine.
Good evening, Jambo101, I hope you are well.

There are several themes of irony that run through your post.

But I have a lot to do tonight, so let's focus on one in particular.

Bill 21, the law regarding religious symbols, will impact Catholics far more than Muslims.

Bill 21 also wouldn't apply to Jagmeet Singh as you have so frequently flustered.

It seems that you may have misunderstood how Bill 21 works.

Yet above all, this was Quebec's decision to make, as it is our culture and our nation.

How it concerns the rest of Canada isn't our problem.
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Old 09-23-2019, 07:15 AM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
22,395 posts, read 27,866,286 times
Reputation: 8762
Quote:
Originally Posted by PBeauchamp View Post
Well said.

Acajack, in your opinion, do you think that Quebec does a better job of this, of making immigrants part of the "nation", than the ROC?
Well, we don't integrate all of them - a chunk of them do "opt out" of integrating which even includes the linguistic aspect that is essential to functioning in everyday society harmoniously, something that is basically impossible for immigrants to do in the ROC. Even people from France, Haiti and the Congo learn English well if they move to a place like Ottawa, and in some cases their French actually lapses badly.


But those that Quebec does integrate (and their numbers are increasing) are often more deeply integrated than immigrants to the ROC, I'd say. That's probably because there is more tangible stuff to integrate to.


People who observe the ROC (from both the inside and the outside, like Quebecers) often assume that there is a high degree of integration of immigrants simply because there is 100% linguistic buy-in from them.


I used to think that too but I have come to believe that it's often a false impression.
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Old Today, 03:29 PM
 
Location: Prachatitz, Bohemia
2 posts
Reputation: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
Yes, with the exception of groups that wilfully and doggedly choose isolation, I don't think it has yet been clearly demonstrated that any of the immigrant cultures, beyond something like cuisine*, has anything resembling a long-term multi-generational staying power in Canada like the anglophone, francophone and indigenous have clearly shown they possess.


*And even with cuisine, you don't need a functioning culturally distinctive community in order to maintain or implant the cuisine. Plenty of places in Canada have Thai restaurants (for example) in spite of not having any Thai community to speak of.
How do Muslims react to the fagization of Canada by Trudeau. Will intependent Quebec be a fagized country, too?

oooooh Canada!
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