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Old 09-09-2015, 02:03 PM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
21,937 posts, read 27,326,583 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Natnasci View Post
Funny, that's now how my friends who immigrated here from various parts of the world feel, even my US friends.

I think the highlighted statement is more a reflection of you.
I'd say it's raised often enough by enough different people (in contrast to most any other country, where it's never raised at all) for it to be a "thing".

At the very least, the reality is likely somewhere in between the two diametrically opposed views we usually have on here.
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Old 09-09-2015, 02:14 PM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
21,937 posts, read 27,326,583 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by edwardsyzzurphands View Post
While I agree to a certain extent and had some of the same observations when I landed in Canada myself, I do think "something" happens to immigrants than changes them once they end up in Canada. So in my view there is some type of Canadian culture at play that detaches you from your original home culture, unless you make a hell of an effort to hold onto it.

When I immigrated to Toronto I noticed a huge difference between the folks from my home country who had been in the area for at least a few years vs the ones who just arrived (FOB) like myself. The way you speak changes, the dialect changes, the food changes, the music you listen to changes, what you watch on TV changes, your outlook changes, the sports you watch changes and of course the same happened to me.

So while it may be difficult for all of us to define, there is some type of Canadian culture that influences people in a real way.
Out of curiosity, how much of that would you say was basically a shift to the generic North American culture (that you could have taken on anywhere in the U.S. as well) and how much of it was actually (reasonably) specific to Canada*?

*The latter does exist IMO, at least to some degree.
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Old 09-09-2015, 03:52 PM
 
Location: Vancouver
12,672 posts, read 8,740,385 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
Out of curiosity, how much of that would you say was basically a shift to the generic North American culture (that you could have taken on anywhere in the U.S. as well) and how much of it was actually (reasonably) specific to Canada*?

*The latter does exist IMO, at least to some degree.
I'm going to take a wild guess, but things like politics, getting to know our parliamentary system ( learning what a " riding " is as a small example ).
Getting to understand our institutions including educational ones. A whole new slew of of acronyms and terms, like EI, OAS, CPP etc. Mandated holiday time. Maternity/Paternity leave etc.
I'm many of these things make an American arriving in Canada feel that they aren't in Kansas anymore. ( sorry couldn't resits )

However I'm curious about his answer...of course it's only one story.
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Old 09-09-2015, 04:47 PM
 
Location: London, UK
3,458 posts, read 4,004,613 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
Out of curiosity, how much of that would you say was basically a shift to the generic North American culture (that you could have taken on anywhere in the U.S. as well) and how much of it was actually (reasonably) specific to Canada*?

*The latter does exist IMO, at least to some degree.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Natnasci View Post
I'm going to take a wild guess, but things like politics, getting to know our parliamentary system ( learning what a " riding " is as a small example ).
Getting to understand our institutions including educational ones. A whole new slew of of acronyms and terms, like EI, OAS, CPP etc. Mandated holiday time. Maternity/Paternity leave etc.
I'm many of these things make an American arriving in Canada feel that they aren't in Kansas anymore. ( sorry couldn't resits )

However I'm curious about his answer...of course it's only one story.
Just to address Nat's part first, the adjustment politically was not that difficult. I am originally from a constitutional monarchy, so learning about government terminology and structure was not a huge adustment. The terms and policies obviously differed, but I was a kid when I landed, so much of that was not of major importance to me.

The education system was a huge adjustment though. We were accustomed to a system that is strictly modeled after the British System and begin formal schooling at the age of 2.5. So needless to say we had to take a step or two back when we moved to Toronto as the system was not as formal or advanced based on our age group.

So to tie this into Acajack's question I was more thinking culturally, but struggle to really say how much of it was generic Canamerican culture or something that was distinctly Canadian. Of course there are obvious things like sports (I had to switch from speaking about soccer and cricket to hockey), eating a different less spicy and more bland type of food (no offense), adjusting to political leanings that were socially more liberal than my home country and learning a new way of speaking as Canadians use certain terms that are unique to them and not anyone else.

There are also less obvious things like a different style of humour that even younger ones develop.

The others are basically what I imagine all immigrants go through when moving to a new country, which is adapting ones culture to make it more palatable to the general populous. I suppose that is what Fusion was speaking about earlier when he was saying that Canadian or Toronto culture is a mash up of all other cultures and in my view that is true. Once immigrants come to Canada we adjust our culture so much (to varying degrees) that it really becomes unrecognizable to people who never left the country of origin. I dont say this in a bad way because cultures change and that is the way it has been throughout history. So while it may be watered down to some its vibrant and uniquely Canadian to others.

But that last paragraph is a whole other topic I suppose.
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Old 09-09-2015, 06:46 PM
 
Location: The High Seas
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Nanaimo. Really hard to tell apart.
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Old 09-09-2015, 08:07 PM
 
Location: Toronto
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
I am an sports boards from time to time and there is a pretty strong "hockey sucks!" crowd on there that claims the "New Toronto" (whatever that means) has moved past hockey and will become a basketball/soccer town in the near future. Hockey is just so passé. I am not even sure if this mindset is related to the woes of the Leafs, and it seems more to be about hockey being an "old-fashioned" sport and basketball and soccer being seen as more contemporary and cosmopolitan.
I really don't know as I'm not a huge sports follower.. I would certainly say the youth following of Basketball (A Canadian invented it as you know - Mr Naismith) and Soccer has definitely ballooned over the last few years but Toronto is such a huge hockey town.. In sports boards perhaps people are venting frustrations but they're all talk - The Leafs are the most valuable franchise in Hockey and Toronto is still a huge hockey town - and for an added dig AJ - The Hockey Hall of Fame - right here in the T.Dot

Howdya like dem apples.....
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Old 09-09-2015, 08:09 PM
 
Location: Toronto
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Quote:
Originally Posted by botticelli View Post
I have explained many times it is a matter of not having anything to be assimilated to.
Let me ask you something Botti - since you are so dismissive of anything Canadian about our culture and society as a whole and part of the camp that promulgates this constant narrative that Canada is just a proxy culture of the U.S than wouldn't you still have 'something' to assimilate to? Unless of course, you have something against U.S culture???
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Old 09-09-2015, 08:22 PM
 
Location: Toronto
12,581 posts, read 11,130,951 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by johnathanc View Post
This is a good point, differences are just that, differences. Toronto is not dominated by one particular culture but is an amalgamation of many cultures. Many cultures choose just do their own thing since they are relatively new and numerous, but established Anglo circles still run the show. End of the day, multiculturalism and the mainstream mindset of living life the way you choose is still very much a defining characteristic. It may not be terribly unique or resonate with everyone but it is what it is and there are many positive aspects to this, but some negative ones as well.

After living in the US, I know people can choose to live as they choose as well (and many do choose to stay in enclaves) but there was more pressure to be mainstream American, and in some ways it was easier for immigrants to integrate quicker, and many do. Quebec reminds more of Europe in the sense that there is a strong interest in preserving old traditions. Relatives of mine only drink wine and eat food 95% of the time from their region of France for example, and don't necessarily subscribe to the philosophy that newcomers should not adopt French ways. It's a very different way of thinking as they feel strongly about what they see as diluting their culture. Canada is part of the new world and is a very young country with a changing population that it handles differently, and probably more progressively that many European nations.

While I agree that more can be done to embrace unique Canadian content, we must remember that Canadians and Americans come from the same origins of people who inhabited the same land around the same time and grew up beside each other on the same block. An large overlap of interests and tastes is to be expected. We are essentially siblings from the same family, similar personality traits in many ways, but still have different ideas/thoughts in other areas. It is what it is, interesting or not so much to some.
I always enjoy reading your posts and getting your perspective johnathanc.. You're like Bimbam - you don't post much but when you do they always make up for it and this one to me is no exception!
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Old 09-09-2015, 09:09 PM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
21,937 posts, read 27,326,583 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fusion2 View Post
I really don't know as I'm not a huge sports follower.. I would certainly say the youth following of Basketball (A Canadian invented it as you know - Mr Naismith) and Soccer has definitely ballooned over the last few years but Toronto is such a huge hockey town.. In sports boards perhaps people are venting frustrations but they're all talk - The Leafs are the most valuable franchise in Hockey and Toronto is still a huge hockey town - and for an added dig AJ - The Hockey Hall of Fame - right here in the T.Dot

Howdya like dem apples.....
Oh I know that hockey is still the most popular sport in Toronto. It's just that the hostility against it and cockiness of some of the other sports' supporters is always a bit surprising.
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Old 09-10-2015, 11:25 AM
 
Location: London, UK
3,458 posts, read 4,004,613 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
Oh I know that hockey is still the most popular sport in Toronto. It's just that the hostility against it and cockiness of some of the other sports' supporters is always a bit surprising.
Those are typically new supporters who are trying to overcompensate for not being life long followers. New Soccer fans are the worst at this and do the same in the US. It seems like they think that putting down another sport elevates their new found love to a higher tier.

There is nothing wrong with Hockey remaining the dominant sport that brings people together in Canada. Why on earth would these people want it to be soccer? The Men's program is terrible and the Women's is under supported/funded and had a mediocre World Cup showing. Hockey on the other hand is what Canadians do better than anyone else and have cemented that further in recent years.

Its odd to me that people act this way too, but please be assured that life long fans of these outsider sports like soccer are not the ones beating their chest. Those fans appreciate athletes no matter what they play.
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