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Old 06-14-2016, 11:13 AM
 
Location: Vancouver
12,716 posts, read 8,800,036 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
They may not be perfect but it's still way down from the peaks.


For example, of the biggest cities in the U.S., Chicago is likely the most problematic when it comes to shootings and murders, and its homicide total is still about half of what it was in the 1970s.
Not disagreeing, but what does it mean? Violent crime is going down in a lot of countries. It's not like the US is doing something special and their violent crime, mass murders etc are still way ahead of countries most would like to compare themselves with.

On a side note, I thought this was an interesting article.


I bought an AR-15 semi-automatic rifle in Philly in 7 minutes
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Old 06-14-2016, 11:18 AM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
21,967 posts, read 27,436,169 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Natnasci View Post
Not disagreeing, but what does it mean? Violent crime is going down in a lot of countries. It's not like the US is doing something special and their violent crime, mass murders etc are still way ahead of countries most would like to compare themselves with.

No it's not necessarily that the U.S. is doing "better".


But it does inform the discussion, especially when people claim that things are "worse than ever".
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Old 06-14-2016, 11:39 AM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
21,967 posts, read 27,436,169 times
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On the other hand, since Canada has been largely spared the most intense of this type of stuff, I am not sure that people in this country can fully grasp the anxiety that comes from being constantly bombarded with news of repeated incidents of this nature.


Just right now there is news of an armed hostage situation at a Walmart in Amarillo, Texas.


Stress levels are also quite high in Europe. It did not make many headlines in most of North America but yesterday this happened outside Paris:


French cop killer threatened Euro 2016 in Facebook video, source says - CNN.com


People are really starting to get on edge. We would be too if this were happening all around us.
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Old 06-14-2016, 11:50 AM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
21,967 posts, read 27,436,169 times
Reputation: 8626
In other news, a 16 year old girl was stabbed and seriously injured in the city of Rennes in NW France this afternoon. She was waiting for the bus on the way home from school. Her assailant was saying he wanted to commit a sacrifice for Ramadan. (He had mental issues apparently.) Luckily the girl is expected to survive.


Can't find a link in English for this.
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Old 06-14-2016, 12:03 PM
 
10,847 posts, read 11,300,838 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by censusdata View Post
American here to provide some perspective.

To understand today's American gun culture you have to go back in time and reconstruct how we got here and why we're so different from other 1st world former British colonies like Canada and Australia.

Many immigrants to the USA have historically been people fleeing persecution in their home country. Examples include religious Presbyterians from Ulster, Irish starving from English domination, capitalist from China, non Shias from Iran, non communists from Cuba, etc. From these people we inherit a distrust of govt, at best viewing it as a necessary evil. I know in Scotland the natives were banned from having weapons by the English, who would then attack the unarmed people. I believe the 2nd amendment exist because the Founding Fathers wanted people to be able to overthrow govt if it became tyrannical. In addition to fear of govt Americans also tend to be tribal and afraid of other Americans. Fear of Black Americans was instilled to legitimize the brutal treatment of slaves. There has also been fear of new immigrant groups.

Another issue is that America is great mostly because of military success. Canada is successful because you're good at cooperating with other people. America is great because of violence. There are bumper stickers that say "God, guns, and guts made America great". Our history of violence is celebrated, from tv Westerns to movies about snipers. Gun culture is just another way of "celebrating".

Currently American society is very divided and many people have little confidence in the federal govt to protect them. We've always had lots of small scale gun violence (mostly drug dealers killing each other) but 9/11 and terrorist attacks make people feel afraid, thus any restrictions on any gun is going to be difficult. I think 49% of us would be at least assault rifles like the AR 15 tomorrow but majority wins.
Well, I know for a fact that most Chinese didn't move to the US to avoid persecution of their home country or out of distrust of the government. They moved to make more money. Even those who moved under refugee status, 99% of them only use politics as an excuse.


But I agree the US has its gun problems due to its own history. We understand that. I just hope the US and Americans can take "culture and history" into consideration when judging other countries who do things differently and avoid throwing cheap accusation around. It doesn't seem possible for the US, does it.
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Old 06-14-2016, 12:08 PM
 
Location: Toronto
12,581 posts, read 11,176,078 times
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News from the land of unicorns and rainbows:

Gay Vancouver Man attacked on his way to a vigil for the Orlando victims. As the gentleman said at the end of the video, this stuff happens regularly and isn't covered by the media...

https://ca.news.yahoo.com/ugly-incid...015655866.html
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Old 06-14-2016, 12:18 PM
 
18,357 posts, read 10,426,450 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fusion2 View Post
I can't understand why generalized homophobia in any society matters little or generalized racism matters little. If we don't get at the heart of the social issues that are probably creating a fertile environment for problems than yes, these things will continue to happen. Not just in terms of random shootings, mass shootings but all facets of society - top to bottom. Sorry Bru - we have a lot of work to do when it comes to integrating all our members into it healthily. There is still an unhealthy dose of unacceptance in this country. It may not be as bad as our friends south of us - but we got problems and all too often we don't like to talk about them. Its far easier just to throw our superior gun laws around or that we have less pronounced income inequality or that we are more civil and polite.

I think guns are the easy way out of the discussion personally.
My statement taken in the context to which it was posted was intended to convey that the reasons for the shooting are less relevant than the FACT they will continue.

Ascertaining the reason why has been accomplished so many times already and still nothing of import has been done to prevent the next one.

Bigotry still flourishes.
Homophobia still flourishes.
Racism still flourishes.
Mental illness still flourishes.
Proliferation of firearms still flourishing.

As long as any one of the drivers is still present the vehicle of firearms will continue to be used to get the result desired. When no address other than the usual lip service is given to all of them; the one will get used in a linear fashion along with their growth.

More and worse is coming!
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Old 06-14-2016, 12:23 PM
 
Location: Toronto
12,581 posts, read 11,176,078 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BruSan View Post
My statement taken in the context to which it was posted was intended to convey that the reasons for the shooting are less relevant than the FACT they will continue.

Ascertaining the reason why has been accomplished so many times already and still nothing of import has been done to prevent the next one.

Bigotry still flourishes.
Homophobia still flourishes.
Racism still flourishes.
Mental illness still flourishes.
Proliferation of firearms still flourishing.

As long as any one of the drivers is still present the vehicle of firearms will continue to be used to get the result desired. When no address other than the usual lip service is given to all of them; the one will get used in a linear fashion along with their growth.

More and worse is coming!
I get they'll continue but this doesn't mean we shouldn't have discussions about them. It doesn't mean we shouldn't have more robust anti-discrimination policies in our schools. It doesn't mean we shouldn't look at how we treat other people, including our own family members. There are things as a society we can do and part of that is have a conversation about it instead of sweeping it under the rug simply because these issues will in some form or another always be here. If we took that approach we'd never have social/institutional or legal progress. Awareness, education, integration and discussion can drive change!
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Old 06-14-2016, 01:15 PM
 
10,847 posts, read 11,300,838 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
No it's not necessarily that the U.S. is doing "better".


But it does inform the discussion, especially when people claim that things are "worse than ever".
while homicide rate is in decline, it does feel mass shooting involving large numbers of random victims (not targeted ones/gang members) are on the rise in the past couple of years. Or is it because the press talks about it more often?
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Old 06-14-2016, 01:50 PM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
21,967 posts, read 27,436,169 times
Reputation: 8626
Quote:
Originally Posted by botticelli View Post
while homicide rate is in decline, it does feel mass shooting involving large numbers of random victims (not targeted ones/gang members) are on the rise in the past couple of years. Or is it because the press talks about it more often?

Well, I have zero stats on this but my sneaking suspicion is that there might be more people like this getting shot these days than were getting shot in the 70s and 80s. (I won't post a picture of what a typical shooting victim from the 70s and 80s probably looked like.)




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