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Old 03-27-2018, 09:16 AM
 
Location: Hougary, Texberta
8,593 posts, read 11,077,046 times
Reputation: 10306

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zoisite View Post
I don't know whether or not you understand that there is no actual liquid oil in the ground in Alberta.
...sooo close. Only about 400,000+ barrels a day, say for the last nearly 100 years. Why let facts stand in the way of unfounded hysteria. That doesn't include gas or gas liquids either.

Light crude oil continues to account for the largest share of Alberta’s conventional production, at an estimated 53.3 per cent in 2017, but is expected to decline over the forecast period as the share of heavier crude oil increases.


https://www.aer.ca/data-and-publicat...oil-production


Any other things you care to demonstrate your lack of knowledge on?
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Old 03-27-2018, 09:23 AM
 
Location: Hougary, Texberta
8,593 posts, read 11,077,046 times
Reputation: 10306
Quote:
Originally Posted by Natnasci View Post

Alberta has all their economic fish in one oily basket. They seem desperate because they are.
At least they have a basket. Unless heroin and street people are upcoming industries. I mean besides logging, mining and fishing, which have been shown to have zero environmental impact.
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Old 03-27-2018, 10:23 AM
 
Location: Vancouver
12,688 posts, read 8,753,261 times
Reputation: 7304
Quote:
Originally Posted by mikeyyc View Post
At least they have a basket. Unless heroin and street people are upcoming industries. I mean besides logging, mining and fishing, which have been shown to have zero environmental impact.
Alberta should be rolling in money. It isn't. How could such a oil rich province be in such dire straits now?

Your slag on drug addicts and street people means?? If there weren't drug addicts and street people in most of the world, you might have a point, or even if there weren't in Alberta..but you know there are. It's also kind of cruel to use people who are having real life issue as fodder to make a point about industry.

As for other industries. Sure, but it's a bit of a false equivalency, since logging and fishing CAN be sustainable. Mining not so much. Also people have been VERY vocal about those industries about not being as sustainable as they should be.

Also, what good is a basket if it's empty?

The other difference is BC's mining, fishing and logging industries have never threatened Alberta's environment.

Being from Alberta, I think your automatic defence mechanism kicked in. Which is understandable.

Last edited by Natnasci; 03-27-2018 at 10:32 AM..
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Old 03-27-2018, 10:27 AM
 
Location: British Columbia ♥ 🍁 ♥
7,241 posts, read 6,581,911 times
Reputation: 14207
Quote:
Originally Posted by mikeyyc View Post
...sooo close. Only about 400,000+ barrels a day, say for the last nearly 100 years. Why let facts stand in the way of unfounded hysteria. That doesn't include gas or gas liquids either.

Light crude oil continues to account for the largest share of Alberta’s conventional production, at an estimated 53.3 per cent in 2017, but is expected to decline over the forecast period as the share of heavier crude oil increases.

https://www.aer.ca/data-and-publicat...oil-production

Any other things you care to demonstrate your lack of knowledge on?

Mike, I learn something new every day and now I've just learned something new because of you .... I did not know there were oil wells drilled in Alberta, I though it all came from that huge ugly blemish of sands out there in the middle of the hell zone. So I'll pass on sharing any more knowledge except for something else I learned today (thanks to you Mike) that was shocking and even more disheartening to me.

Apparently there are over 400,000 oil and gas wells that have been drilled over pretty much every part of Alberta, (see the maps) - both active (300,000) and inactive (100,000) - and now they are all leaking methane into the air. Ain't that sweet?

https://globalnews.ca/news/2301432/m...and-gas-wells/

'Artificial magma' technology used to suppress Alberta oil and gas well leaks | CBC News

.
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Old 03-27-2018, 10:38 AM
 
Location: Hougary, Texberta
8,593 posts, read 11,077,046 times
Reputation: 10306
Quote:
Originally Posted by Natnasci View Post
Alberta should be rolling in money. It isn't. How could such a oil rich province be in such dire straits now?

Your slag on drug addicts and street people means?? If there weren't drug addicts and street people in most of the world, you might have a point, or even if there weren't in Alberta..but you know there are. It's also kind of cruel to use people who are having real life issue as fodder to make a point about industry.

As for other industries. Sure, but it's a bit of a false equivalency, since logging and fishing CAN be renewable. Mining not so much.

Also, what good is a basket if it's empty?

The other difference is BC's mining, fishing and logging industries have never threatened Alberta's environment.

Being from Alberta, I think your automatic defence mechanism kicked in. Which is understandable.
Well fishing has pretty much collapsed due to overfishing, and the Pine Beetle is doing a fine job of killing logging, if stupid tariffs didn't do much of the work first. This has nothing to do about the environment, it's about $$. BC wants more cash at the head of the pipeline. No one That and NIMBY's who don't realize that a pipeline has been there for nearly 70 years, and is due for an upgrade.


Alberta would be rolling in money if successive Governments didn't spend it like drunken sailors on shore leave. When Klein left power, Alberta had zero debt and a massive budget surplus.
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Old 03-27-2018, 10:48 AM
 
Location: Hougary, Texberta
8,593 posts, read 11,077,046 times
Reputation: 10306
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zoisite View Post
Mike, I learn something new every day and now I've just learned something new because of you .... I did not know there were oil wells drilled in Alberta, I though it all came from that huge ugly blemish of sands out there in the middle of the hell zone. So I'll pass on sharing any more knowledge except for something else I learned today (thanks to you Mike) that was shocking and even more disheartening to me.

Apparently there are over 400,000 oil and gas wells that have been drilled over pretty much every part of Alberta, (see the maps) - both active (300,000) and inactive (100,000) - and now they are all leaking methane into the air. Ain't that sweet?

https://globalnews.ca/news/2301432/m...and-gas-wells/

'Artificial magma' technology used to suppress Alberta oil and gas well leaks | CBC News

.
Have you ever been to a working mine? That's what they look like. It doesn't matter if it's oilsands, coal, copper or anything else. Dirt has to be moved. I mean it's not delightful like a pulp mill belching cancer causing dioxins and stench in every small town and river in BC, but hey, we all can't live in an ivory tower.


I swear, some people have no idea or willingness to understand how industry works. Whether it's from how your sausage is made, to the fuel that runs your car or heats your home.


That's ok, at least Alberta has a plan. BC just exempted their LNG venting from control and then fudges the numbers.
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Old 03-27-2018, 10:55 AM
 
Location: Vancouver
12,688 posts, read 8,753,261 times
Reputation: 7304
Quote:
Originally Posted by mikeyyc View Post
Well fishing has pretty much collapsed due to overfishing, and the Pine Beetle is doing a fine job of killing logging, if stupid tariffs didn't do much of the work first. This has nothing to do about the environment, it's about $$. BC wants more cash at the head of the pipeline. No one That and NIMBY's who don't realize that a pipeline has been there for nearly 70 years, and is due for an upgrade.


Alberta would be rolling in money if successive Governments didn't spend it like drunken sailors on shore leave. When Klein left power, Alberta had zero debt and a massive budget surplus.
Not sure how the Pine Beetle is BC's fault. It's no ones fault. It's nature. However if you look at the history of the pine beetle, you will see that there were outbreaks in Alberta before BC. Granted, the infestation in BC grew larger and did move eastward...but blaming BC for that, is like blaming BC for earthquakes.

This has everything to do with the environment, at least for the majority of people against it.

Sorry, but the comment about a pipeline needing an upgrade is totally off the mark. This is a NEW pipe line designed to hold contents that have never crossed the province before.

However, as I said before, it's so much the pipeline that causes concern, it's the increased tanker traffic. Seven times more going passed my front door.

I really don't care why Alberta has no money, it doesn't. My question was rhetorical. The fact is, Alberta is desperate, and acting it.

Read the whole thread. I'm getting the impression you haven't since your comment about upgrading the pipeline.
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Old 03-27-2018, 11:09 AM
 
Location: Hougary, Texberta
8,593 posts, read 11,077,046 times
Reputation: 10306
Quote:
Originally Posted by Natnasci View Post
Not sure how the Pine Beetle is BC's fault. It's no ones fault. It's nature. However if you look at the history of the pine beetle, you will see that there were outbreaks in Alberta before BC. Granted, the infestation in BC grew larger and did move eastward...but blaming BC for that, is like blaming BC for earthquakes.

This has everything to do with the environment, at least for the majority of people against it.

Sorry, but the comment about a pipeline needing an upgrade is totally off the mark. This is a NEW pipe line designed to hold contents that have never crossed the province before.

However, as I said before, it's so much the pipeline that causes concern, it's the increased tanker traffic. Seven times more going passed my front door.

I really don't care why Alberta has no money, it doesn't. My question was rhetorical. The fact is, Alberta is desperate, and acting it.

Read the whole thread. I'm getting the impression you haven't since your comment about upgrading the pipeline.
I wasn't blaming anyone for the pine beetle. Just that it's decimating industry and forests equally. I know it's a new pipeline. Also there was a desire to not run one through the lower mainland, however it was killed by land claims and probably a desire not to ruin the scenic beauty of the aluminum smelters.

Alberta has lots of revenue, just they're more like other provinces now in that they're spending well beyond their means. NDP will do that for you. Alberta has $42B in debt, compared to BC's $66B, but they're still spending like it's free money and Notley is trying hard to catch up.
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Old 03-27-2018, 11:10 AM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
21,947 posts, read 27,348,673 times
Reputation: 8603
Quote:
Originally Posted by Natnasci View Post

I really don't care why Alberta has no money, it doesn't. My question was rhetorical. The fact is, Alberta is desperate, and acting it.

.

I am not sure that Alberta can be said to have no money, but if that's true a huge part of that is related to the fact that it leaves potential billions on the table by being the only province without a sales tax.


I realize that there are political and even psychological reasons why no Alberta government has wanted to touch that, but it's still a choice that Albertans willingly make.
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Old 03-27-2018, 12:54 PM
 
Location: British Columbia ♥ 🍁 ♥
7,241 posts, read 6,581,911 times
Reputation: 14207
Quote:
Originally Posted by mikeyyc View Post
Have you ever been to a working mine? That's what they look like. It doesn't matter if it's oilsands, coal, copper or anything else. Dirt has to be moved. I mean it's not delightful like a pulp mill belching cancer causing dioxins and stench in every small town and river in BC, but hey, we all can't live in an ivory tower.

I swear, some people have no idea or willingness to understand how industry works. Whether it's from how your sausage is made, to the fuel that runs your car or heats your home.

That's ok, at least Alberta has a plan. BC just exempted their LNG venting from control and then fudges the numbers.

There's a total of 37 pulp and paper mills in BC and most of them are in big towns and cities. The majority of them are right in Vancouver and the lower mainland region. There is no noticeable stench to speak of and if there is a stench anywhere it's certainly not like the fecal stench of methane emanating from every square mile of an entire province leaking methane from 400,000 man made holes in the ground.


.
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