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Old 08-29-2016, 07:30 AM
 
1,300 posts, read 828,892 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by klmrocks View Post
As a first generation Canadian living in Toronto I got to admit I really don't know all that much about aboriginal issues or history. Sure we learned tid bits in school, but most of what I do know as an adult comes from watching tv, news clips or documentaries.

This mornging I got another gentle reminder that there is still so much I ( and possible many other Canadians) don't know and should know.

Downie praised for putting Trudeau on spot about indigenous issues

For anyone wanting to know more about Aboriginal Canadian history, culture and current issues what would suggest they see, read, watch or visit in Canada? If you are an Aboriginal Canadian reading this what would you want other Canadians or people around the world to know about your culture?
From the article:

Quote:
ďItís going to take us 100 years to figure out what the hell went on up there but it isnít cool, and everybody knows that. Itís really, really bad. But weíre going to figure it out. Youíre going to figure it out,Ē
I disagree with that part so much. To me the answer as to why so many natives are so messed up and doing poorly is so damn easy and simple to understand. Namely many of them live TOO DAMN FAR FROM CIVILIZATION. This isn't about 'ignoring' natives, its about them living so far in the middle of nowhere that its extremely difficult if not impossible to give them the proper support to improve their lives and it really doesn't help that many natives are doing a very poor job of raising their kids in those areas.

What I've never understood is why don't these remote communities that take so much money and resources to barely keep alive, why don't they simply move close to a nearby town or city and then build a new community there? That way you could give them a brand new home and hook them up to all the infrastructure that's needed to live decently and also place them much, MUCH closer to social services, hospitals, pollce, firefighters etc that they're all lacking or missing right now because they choose to continue to live in nowheresville.

Not only would this move be better for them in quality of life, but it would be better for Canadians in that it probably would've saved us billions of dollars by now if they had moved years ago. I can't understand why natives aren't smart enough to have done this decades ago where moving benefits them so much compared to living in remote places and then getting angry that Canadians aren't doing enough to support their STUPID DECISION of continuing to torture themselves by living in squalor and letting social and crime problems fester and grow unabated.

In fact the only people who would be sad at such a move would be the people who get paid to supply these remote communities and native leaders who need to keep their people angry and oppressed so that they can continue to ask for more handouts from Canadians while they themselves live comfortable lives in big houses with all the money they pocket.
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Old 08-29-2016, 01:06 PM
 
Location: Toronto
6,754 posts, read 3,777,986 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Max Sterling View Post
From the article:



I disagree with that part so much. To me the answer as to why so many natives are so messed up and doing poorly is so damn easy and simple to understand. Namely many of them live TOO DAMN FAR FROM CIVILIZATION. This isn't about 'ignoring' natives, its about them living so far in the middle of nowhere that its extremely difficult if not impossible to give them the proper support to improve their lives and it really doesn't help that many natives are doing a very poor job of raising their kids in those areas.



What I've never understood is why don't these remote communities that take so much money and resources to barely keep alive, why don't they simply move close to a nearby town or city and then build a new community there? That way you could give them a brand new home and hook them up to all the infrastructure that's needed to live decently and also place them much, MUCH closer to social services, hospitals, pollce, firefighters etc that they're all lacking or missing right now because they choose to continue to live in nowheresville.



Not only would this move be better for them in quality of life, but it would be better for Canadians in that it probably would've saved us billions of dollars by now if they had moved years ago. I can't understand why natives aren't smart enough to have done this decades ago where moving benefits them so much compared to living in remote places and then getting angry that Canadians aren't doing enough to support their STUPID DECISION of continuing to torture themselves by living in squalor and letting social and crime problems fester and grow unabated.



In fact the only people who would be sad at such a move would be the people who get paid to supply these remote communities and native leaders who need to keep their people angry and oppressed so that they can continue to ask for more handouts from Canadians while they themselves live comfortable lives in big houses with all the money they pocket.
This is the thing about "handouts" .... well technically they are not handouts. I did not exactly understand the until a few years about when I came across some information that was never presented to be this way.

This country and land belonged to the Aboriginal people. They signed treaties... legal contracts to all the others "most of us" to stay on their land. Most of what they are getting ... if not all is not a handout. This was the agreement. So in short calling it a handout means that we "the other" are not holding up our end of the bargain. If I made an agreement with you and you were not holding up your end of the agreement .. I would not be happy about it.

I have no idea why anyone would want to live in the middle of no where... but they were living in the middle of no where when they signed the treaties ... so too bad. There were deals made... if you agree to do something without thinking it threw why should the other party suffer. Treaties were signed and just because they are not convenient now how can they be fairly broken? Is it ever legal in Canada to sign a contract and they fail to follow threw with the contract without consequences?

I equate this to someone agreeing to give me an apple for my banana .. then eating the centre and throwing the peel back saying I did not realize I could not eat the entire thing ... sorry I want my apple back now. A deal is a deal!!!

If you look at the back and white contractual facts it 100% seems like these people were cheated.

These people are not getting handouts what they are getting is part of an agreement that was made a long time ago. The version of events you hear greatly impacts your views on the situation. Canadian society does not really go around spreading the word about why Aborginal people get what they get, which is dishonest and does make it seem like they are getting handouts... when technically they are not getting handouts at all.
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Old 08-29-2016, 01:09 PM
 
Location: Toronto
6,754 posts, read 3,777,986 times
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Default .... :)!

Quote:
Originally Posted by daynet View Post
Try googling aboriginal newspapers/radio stations in your area.

I'm in an off-island burb of Montreal, and can read The Eastern Door online.

Kahnawake Radio K103

Their Friday night radio bingo is very popular. I don't play, but I know a lot of people who do.

There's also APTN television network.

Actually I have been watching Mohawk Girls ... it is like the Aborignal Canadian version of the TV Girls or Sex in the City. If you like either of these shows you might like Mohawk Girls.

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Old 09-01-2016, 09:40 PM
 
1,300 posts, read 828,892 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by klmrocks View Post
This country and land belonged to the Aboriginal people. They signed treaties... legal contracts to all the others "most of us" to stay on their land. Most of what they are getting ... if not all is not a handout. This was the agreement. So in short calling it a handout means that we "the other" are not holding up our end of the bargain. If I made an agreement with you and you were not holding up your end of the agreement .. I would not be happy about it.
Whether you call it a handout or not, the point is Canadians have been giving natives boatloads of money for decades now with very little results and improvements to their quality of life except for native leaders many of whom are living very comfortably while their people continue to live in squalor. Drastic changes need to be made on how the money we give them is spent and we can't continue to blindly giving them loads of money year after year and letting them do whatever they want with it because clearly they SUCK with money management.

Quote:
I have no idea why anyone would want to live in the middle of no where... but they were living in the middle of no where when they signed the treaties ... so too bad. There were deals made... if you agree to do something without thinking it threw why should the other party suffer. Treaties were signed and just because they are not convenient now how can they be fairly broken? Is it ever legal in Canada to sign a contract and they fail to follow threw with the contract without consequences?
Well maybe its time now to change things up and take the natives out from hicksville nowhere and move them near civilized society where as I said previously we can actually get them help in a timely fashion and give them all new homes and basic infrastructure where they can live much more comfortably than they are now.

And also so many of the social problems that natives have these days could be solved so much more easily if they lived near a major city or town. For example this 'national inquiry' on missing native women that we're spending hundreds of millions of dollars on or all the drug and alcohol use that's going on in their communities maybe the simple answer is native kids living in super remote areas GET BORED and either turn to drugs and alcohol and/or they often run away from their homes to go somewhere that's more interesting. Maybe if native people lived closer to civilization, their children wouldn't have to run away to find something fun to do and instead just do what most normal kids do, namely go out and have a good time and then come home.

The bottom line is before we do anything else, our first priority should be to move the natives off the reserves and near civilization and then go from there. It might cost a fair bit of money, but in the long run it will be much cheaper and it will give many natives something they've never had, namely an actual decent home with running water and electricity etc. Something that native leaders have been completely incompetent and/or unwilling and incapable of doing for all these years.
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Old 09-02-2016, 04:48 PM
 
494 posts, read 336,219 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Max Sterling View Post
Whether you call it a handout or not, the point is Canadians have been giving natives boatloads of money for decades now with very little results and improvements to their quality of life except for native leaders many of whom are living very comfortably while their people continue to live in squalor. Drastic changes need to be made on how the money we give them is spent and we can't continue to blindly giving them loads of money year after year and letting them do whatever they want with it because clearly they SUCK with money management.

Well maybe its time now to change things up and take the natives out from hicksville nowhere and move them near civilized society where as I said previously we can actually get them help in a timely fashion and give them all new homes and basic infrastructure where they can live much more comfortably than they are now.

And also so many of the social problems that natives have these days could be solved so much more easily if they lived near a major city or town. For example this 'national inquiry' on missing native women that we're spending hundreds of millions of dollars on or all the drug and alcohol use that's going on in their communities maybe the simple answer is native kids living in super remote areas GET BORED and either turn to drugs and alcohol and/or they often run away from their homes to go somewhere that's more interesting. Maybe if native people lived closer to civilization, their children wouldn't have to run away to find something fun to do and instead just do what most normal kids do, namely go out and have a good time and then come home.

The bottom line is before we do anything else, our first priority should be to move the natives off the reserves and near civilization and then go from there. It might cost a fair bit of money, but in the long run it will be much cheaper and it will give many natives something they've never had, namely an actual decent home with running water and electricity etc. Something that native leaders have been completely incompetent and/or unwilling and incapable of doing for all these years.
Very much agreed. It's just too far out in too harsh conditions in some cases, and services cannot meet the demand. Additionally, I would say the omnipresent almost idealization of the lack of opportunities, as well as the disconnectedness from the rest of society, hyper imposes a degree of hopelessness. How do you escape? Where do you escape? Can you escape? Those are the type of questions I'd imagine the you eventually face, and most of the time cannot overcome. Ultimately, it becomes ingrained like the cycle of poverty they speak of. However, in addition to that here, you have a failed infrastructure that even discourage a basic sense of human self-worth. Add onto that what is perhaps a mixed feeling of gratitude and disdain for some of the"services" given by the government, along with knowing they are being mismanaged by your own people, and you have a recipe for what we know as tragic Aboriginal Canada. ~

They are "given" much and yet often are treated like second class citizens as a results.
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Old 09-24-2016, 04:58 PM
 
Location: Toronto
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I went to the Pow Wow at the Brampton Fair Grounds today. I am 100% glad I went. Interesting experience. No Indian Bread though ( I will have to check that out another time). This is the first one they have had at this location. There were several interesting guest speakers from several of the Ontario First Nations communities. Who knew there is a who lot of different things going on outside of Toronto too ( though you totally need a car to get to them).
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Old 09-25-2016, 11:40 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by klmrocks View Post
I get that idea to some extent ... but honestly I don't think at least when I was in school we where told the whole story. Ex one side of the story. I think certain places in Canada there is more exposer to Aborignal people and culture. In Toronto I dont really see or meet a lot of Aborignal people and when I do this sounds horrible to say, but I am being honest they are homeless or alcoholic/drug addicts or people with severe mental and physcial health issues (this also has to do with what I do for a living... so this is a likely biasis there).

New Credit Pow Wow - Three Fires Homecoming Pow Wow and Traditional Gathering

On a side note OMG ... you really seem to take huge offense to a lot of the stuff I say. In sincerity it is not actually meant with bad intentions. I am not looking down on anyone ... or trying to be mean spirited. I idea and information seeking.

There is this event in Mississuage I am considering going to this weekend...


Anyone ever been to a pow wow? I read the section on etiquette... seems a bit intimidating.
Does anyone remember the Kellogg cereal boxes that had stories about indian tribes on the back? The one that I have never forgotten is about the Iroquois scalping people from other tribes. Having been over exposed to the horrors of WW1 and WW 2 at a tender age, that was a whole new concept for me. Who, as a child, walked by a bar and saw carloads of children, only to learn that their parents were from the nearby reserve and the children typically waited for hours in the car until the parents emerged. Who arrived at school to find a deceased aboriginal person lying on the ground outside the school doors? How do these facts influence perceptions, and how can those perceptions be reversed?

Children across the country played cowboys and indians, where it was more fun to dress up as an indian. Dress up outfits were widely available in the Hudson Bay tourist section.

There's no question that a huge percentage of the Canadian population was completely ignorant of how residential schools could be responsible for problems in the aboriginal population 2-6 generations later. How could it have been predicted? Children, grandchildren, and great grandchildren from holocaust survivors do not suffer the same problems, so there are additional factors. It seems like a long, messy problem that will never be resolved when money is perceived as a significant factor in the solution.
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Old 09-25-2016, 12:08 PM
 
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Originally Posted by klmrocks View Post
I went to the Pow Wow at the Brampton Fair Grounds today. I am 100% glad I went. Interesting experience. No Indian Bread though ( I will have to check that out another time). This is the first one they have had at this location. There were several interesting guest speakers from several of the Ontario First Nations communities. Who knew there is a who lot of different things going on outside of Toronto too ( though you totally need a car to get to them).
Canada is a multi-cultural country, and it is important to recognize and celebrate the origins of those cultures. Personally, I don't care for aboriginal music. Some people can't stand the sound of bagpipes, I love them. Aboriginal music is something that simply grates on me, so I would never attend another aboriginal event with that music. As a child, my family attended the International Food Festival. At the time it was an indoor event that was typically attended by other first generation Canadians. Today, international food festivals and cultural events are celebrated year round and are enjoyed nationally, regardless of when participants became Canadian.

Native Americans (aboriginal) are of the Mongoloid race, also prevalent in the Asia. Europeans were the next settlers. Should we celebrate the first settlers, the first two settlers, the first five settlers? What about mixed race European (Caucasian)/Aboriginal (Mongoloid) descendants of the first two groups of settlers? Clearly that is no longer purely an aboriginal culture, but is it any less important? Museums in Montreal have dedicated sections for the cross cultural innovations from European/Aboriginal mixed race culture, which interestingly documents the introduction of new techniques and methods to the aboriginal culture. On the one hand, it seems that European influence on aboriginal culture is perceived as a negative, but on the other hand, who wants to live in a teepee when you can have a house?
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Old 09-26-2016, 11:20 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Lieneke View Post
True. I was surprised to learn that North American aboriginals are racially classified as mongoloid, but when you think about it in the context of physical characteristics, it makes sense. Still, major innovations in construction, planning, social order, law, and etcetera came out of Europe.
I think a lot of times we (I'm speaking of "us" white people) just focus too much on ethnicity. Focus should be on cultural differences... I've been thinking lately about how incredibly tough it is for anyone moving from a rural reserve to a big city in Canada. The culture shock has to be immense. Do we really understand what people migrating to cities from reserves really go through? I don't think we're close to fathoming how different, and how difficult, the transition is for many of them.
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Old 09-26-2016, 06:09 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Ottawa2011 View Post
I think a lot of times we (I'm speaking of "us" white people) just focus too much on ethnicity. Focus should be on cultural differences... I've been thinking lately about how incredibly tough it is for anyone moving from a rural reserve to a big city in Canada. The culture shock has to be immense. Do we really understand what people migrating to cities from reserves really go through? I don't think we're close to fathoming how different, and how difficult, the transition is for many of them.
I think that anyone who moves to a new place, even a similar place within the same country, finds that it takes about a year to settle in. Earlier this week someone from Syria asked me why a purchase made on credit had not appeared on the account a week after the purchase was made. All these things are new and strange, but it doesn't take long to understand. I don't think we can assume that race has anything to do with adjusting to change - it's challenging for everyone.
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