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Old 10-23-2016, 08:15 AM
 
Location: Taipei
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Well if you don't like it just don't go in there? I don't really see what's the big deal here. It's not like independent coffee shops are MIA in Canada.
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Old 10-23-2016, 10:50 AM
 
Location: Canada
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Greysholic View Post
Well if you don't like it just don't go in there? I don't really see what's the big deal here. It's not like independent coffee shops are MIA in Canada.
Exactly.
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Old 10-23-2016, 11:18 AM
 
10,847 posts, read 11,253,275 times
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Originally Posted by Greysholic View Post
Well if you don't like it just don't go in there? I don't really see what's the big deal here. It's not like independent coffee shops are MIA in Canada.
Apparently you can't see things beyond "how does that affect with ME". If it doesn't, then it is fine.

Of course I don't go. I usually flatly refuse any suggestion about meeting at starbucks too.

Last edited by botticelli; 10-23-2016 at 11:41 AM..
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Old 10-23-2016, 11:24 AM
 
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Originally Posted by 514gal View Post
Whenever I'm in Italy I just drink so much espresso because of this. If you're not in a tourist area you can get coffee for less than a Euro and it is way better than anything you will ever get at a Starbucks. Here in Montreal there are loads of Starbucks, especially in the downtown core. In my opinion it is excessive but then again I'm not a fan of Starbucks. I would much rather support independent coffee shops that serve superior coffee.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Douglas Dakota View Post
Not really surprising. In Italy or France, you can get a better Coffee for $1 at every corner, why should one go to a Hipsterish Starbucks place to pay $4. Starbucks is only successful where there is no real coffee culture and few traditional alternatives.

Good coffee, from my experience, never comes from any "chain". It comes from the Italian cafe next door.
These are exactly what I was talking about.

Starbucks is not "coffee culture". The word itself is an insult to coffee culture. It is like Lipton tea bags are not "tea culture". Starbucks is about Americanization and corporate culture. Like McDonald's, it takes away culture if at all.

Last edited by botticelli; 10-23-2016 at 11:38 AM..
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Old 10-23-2016, 11:27 AM
 
10,847 posts, read 11,253,275 times
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Originally Posted by Natnasci View Post
If you are still in Lyon, then you are incorrect. There are at least four. However that really doesn't matter. It doesn't mean anything.
Hi Nat, I am not in Lyon. Lyon, a French city of Vancouver's size, France's gastronomy capital, has 7 starbucks as far as I know, 100 fewer than Vancouver.

Also: geography is not the reason here. Otherwise you can't explain why France has 97 and Britain has 800. It is about

1) bad taste about coffee
2) how Americanized (I mean it in the most negative way).
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Old 10-23-2016, 11:36 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Ottawa2011 View Post
It doesn't surprise me... there are I think three of them, that are within easy walking distance of me in downtown Ottawa, and a couple more if I walk a bit further (20 + minutes)... plus there are other Tim Horton's shops, and Bridgehead Coffee, and a couple other indie places.

Canadians really drink a lot off coffee. There was an international ranking that came out not long ago, and I think we're number 2 or 3 worldwide for coffee consumption... the Netherlands was #1.
on the surface apparently so.

However, such rankings are probably measured in quantity (kg per year). We all know the Italians usually have a tiny espresso while Americans/Canadians have their giant grandes "Cafe Americano". It is like Sushi and Sashimi are precious special occasion food in Japan, while in Canada and America they come most frequently in the form of "all you can eat buffet" style, which is almost unheard of in Japan.

Last edited by botticelli; 10-23-2016 at 12:03 PM..
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Old 10-23-2016, 11:49 AM
 
Location: Taipei
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Originally Posted by botticelli View Post
Apparently you can see things beyond "how does that affect with ME". If it doesn't, then it is fine.
No, this is not a problem of "how does that affect ME". Issues like pollution or corruption are, but not people's taste on coffee.

This is more of a problem of "how does that affect ANYONE AT ALL" apart from perhaps tax evasion and the impoverished kids working at coffee farms in banana republics such is Ivory Coast or Colombia, but tbqh many independent coffee shops probably import their coffee beans from those places as well, there isn't really any easy solution to that.


And you said it yourself, places with less coffee culture would have more Starbucks, and now Starbucks is regarded as a token pick for sugary drinks. What's supposed to be done? Develop a coffee culture in like 3 months and replace all the Starbucks shops with them? I don't think so.
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Old 10-23-2016, 12:03 PM
 
10,847 posts, read 11,253,275 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Greysholic View Post
No, this is not a problem of "how does that affect ME". Issues like pollution or corruption are, but not people's taste on coffee.

This is more of a problem of "how does that affect ANYONE AT ALL" apart from perhaps tax evasion and the impoverished kids working at coffee farms in banana republics such is Ivory Coast or Colombia, but tbqh many independent coffee shops probably import their coffee beans from those places as well, there isn't really any easy solution to that.


And you said it yourself, places with less coffee culture would have more Starbucks, and now Starbucks is regarded as a token pick for sugary drinks. What's supposed to be done? Develop a coffee culture in like 3 months and replace all the Starbucks shops with them? I don't think so.
but this "take it all from America" (which Canada already does in every area: clothing brands, fast food, music, TV) is not going to help anything either. What is a Canadian thing to do? very little.

I don't mind it, but the excessive number of it IS a problem due to a variety of reasons. For example, a predominant chain largely prevents local business from making it at all (same applies for Tim Horton's). And kids are brainwashed into believe starbucks = coffee.
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Old 10-23-2016, 01:23 PM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
21,937 posts, read 27,326,583 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by botticelli View Post
but this "take it all from America" (which Canada already does in every area: clothing brands, fast food, music, TV) is not going to help anything either. What is a Canadian thing to do? very little.

I don't mind it, but the excessive number of it IS a problem due to a variety of reasons. For example, a predominant chain largely prevents local business from making it at all (same applies for Tim Horton's). And kids are brainwashed into believe starbucks = coffee.
It only really bugs me when Canadians are very adamant that most Canadians don't do this, when it's so obvious to everyone that it is true.
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Old 10-23-2016, 01:37 PM
 
3,153 posts, read 2,070,170 times
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I have to completely agree with Botticelli....Northamerica does not know anything about coffee, Starbucks is literally garbage, dirty water....in Italy we used to call American coffee "Octopus water" or "Squid water", "black water"...

I'm ashamed if even only one Starbucks open in Italy....well I understand in international airport to serve the average Northamerican that does not understand anyithing about food in general....Americans and Canadians also call "coffee" huge cups with pseudo milk shakes in it...

It is shocking that on average, I did eat better food in big Australian cities than American cities....
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