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Old 01-06-2017, 09:04 PM
 
Location: Canada
5,765 posts, read 4,184,735 times
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Asking why upper Canada hasn't been developed is like asking why all parts of the Amazon hasn't been developed.

Canada doesn't have the population (or maybe I should say a population of people who would even want to live up there) or the money to develop it. We are already in huge debt and taxed to death. It is hard enough to govern what is already developed.

Man has screwed up so much of this natural world. Why would we want to go up there, build cities or factories, or filthy oil refineries, or fisheries making more of our fish stock dwindle, make more pollution, push what animals live up there to extinction because of encroachment on their land, and take our only pristine land away?

I think the person who wrote the article is an idiot who lives in a bubble, IMO.
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Old 01-07-2017, 02:01 AM
 
Location: British Columbia ☀️ ♥ 🍁 ♥ ☀️
7,281 posts, read 6,604,283 times
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And that ^ about sums it up in a nutshell.

.
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Old 01-07-2017, 03:06 AM
 
10,847 posts, read 11,281,099 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zoisite View Post
And that ^ about sums it up in a nutshell.
Only the first half. The "screwing up nature" part is pure BS. If he loves nature that much, he should not be living in a city typing these words on a computer using modern technology.

also, Canadians are not "Taxed to death". Among developed countries, tax burden in Canada is average.
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Old 01-07-2017, 06:57 AM
 
Location: Canada
5,765 posts, read 4,184,735 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by botticelli View Post
Only the first half. The "screwing up nature" part is pure BS. If he loves nature that much, he should not be living in a city typing these words on a computer using modern technology.

also, Canadians are not "Taxed to death". Among developed countries, tax burden in Canada is average.
First of all, I am a she, not a he, thanks.

Screwing up nature is BS? I love nature. Sure I live in a city surrounded by a LOT of natural areas. Should I be living in a TeePee rubbing sticks together to start a fire? Your comment is stretching it.

When we go camping, we try our best not to leave a footprint. When I see that fools have left garbage even in remote areas, it is sickening. We seem to have to pick up other people's garbage each trip into the bush.
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Old 01-07-2017, 03:22 PM
 
3,072 posts, read 4,283,814 times
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Interesting thread, it's easy to see who has never lived in a northern area, particularly around native populations (no, Ft Mac does not count, a town comprised of high income white people and foreign service workers). A large proportion of these native populations deal with fundamental changes to behaviour from FAS (brain wiring off at birth). We're not just talking about suburban Edmonton alcoholic, but people who have sustained lifelong brain damage/alcohol addiction and social conditioning towards alcohol (along with other mental health issues). You've also got educated whites who move for the income supplement and access to professional jobs. It's very complicated and the reality is that a solution doesn't exist.

I recently attended a reconciliation seminar and the speaker said they hope to reverse this in 80 generations. It seems a realistic assessment. Throwing money at it isn't a solution. She said it will have to come from themselves as they heal from colonialism.
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Old 01-07-2017, 03:33 PM
 
5,097 posts, read 2,492,944 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aliss2 View Post
Interesting thread, it's easy to see who has never lived in a northern area, particularly around native populations (no, Ft Mac does not count, a town comprised of high income white people and foreign service workers). A large proportion of these native populations deal with fundamental changes to behaviour from FAS (brain wiring off at birth). We're not just talking about suburban Edmonton alcoholic, but people who have sustained lifelong brain damage/alcohol addiction and social conditioning towards alcohol (along with other mental health issues). You've also got educated whites who move for the income supplement and access to professional jobs. It's very complicated and the reality is that a solution doesn't exist.

I recently attended a reconciliation seminar and the speaker said they hope to reverse this in 80 generations. It seems a realistic assessment. Throwing money at it isn't a solution. She said it will have to come from themselves as they heal from colonialism.
I know this is not what the aboriginal community wants to hear, but it's time to stop blaming 'colonialism' and life experience that happened to previous generations in another century.

Change has to come from within, and it has to happen today, not in 80 generations. I'm first generation Canadian and I am my own person. I have retained some customs that I was raised with, but my children are completely Canadian retaining none of my parents customs. That's three generations to make a complete change, not 80. I do not blame my parents for teaching me their language first, and English second, even though it made me a weirdo around other children for a year while I learned English. Regardless of who my parents were, or how they suffered during WW2, I do not wear their scars. That's my choice, and it should be the choice of every new generation.
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Old 01-07-2017, 05:29 PM
 
5,097 posts, read 2,492,944 times
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What's happening in the aboriginal community that youth see gloom rather than opportunity. What is their parent's generation doing that so interferes with a normal, happy, healthy upbringing with what ever cultural practices they want?

Canadian education was rejected but money was accepted to develop education internally and within the aboriginal community. That education seems to be missing the 'wellness' concept.

It seems that today's aboriginal youth are well educated in how to make it clear that they are owed something because something bad happened in the last century to their ancestors. I really want to say 'newsflash!', but that would be inappropriate. Europeans suffered during WW1 and WW2, and during many wars prior to those two. They pick up, and move on. Other countries were colonized with agriculture, education, city planning, and economics. Indonesia, Cuba, and South Africa are a few examples. I would say that Cuba has been most successful in retaining a rich culture from diverse ethnicities. There is no lingering reflective blame, and societies are better for it. Indonesia and South Africa have struggled more with oppression. Canada does not oppress any one based on religion, ethnicity, or nationality.
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Old 01-07-2017, 07:54 PM
 
3,072 posts, read 4,283,814 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lieneke View Post
I know this is not what the aboriginal community wants to hear, but it's time to stop blaming 'colonialism' and life experience that happened to previous generations in another century.

Change has to come from within, and it has to happen today, not in 80 generations. I'm first generation Canadian and I am my own person. I have retained some customs that I was raised with, but my children are completely Canadian retaining none of my parents customs. That's three generations to make a complete change, not 80. I do not blame my parents for teaching me their language first, and English second, even though it made me a weirdo around other children for a year while I learned English. Regardless of who my parents were, or how they suffered during WW2, I do not wear their scars. That's my choice, and it should be the choice of every new generation.
I am also a 1st generation Canadian (my mother came as a refugee) but our experience is completely different than the experience of what northern Aboriginals are more often born into. Completely different, almost polar opposites. We came from parents who worked hard at lower wages because of the light at the end of the tunnel. There is no light for many northern Aboriginals. Suicide rates are sky high, depression is the norm, food scarcity is real. I live in North myself.

"It needs to happen now". It won't. And that is something they themselves recognize. White Canadians cannot bandage this for them. They know that. But again, that's colonialism - telling them what's best for them instead of accepting a long-term healing process (standard in Aboriginal culture). It reminds me of methadone or a gastric bypass - just fix it! Now!

I work in a large organization with strong Aboriginal ties. I'm wondering how many here have sat down and just talked to an Aboriginal Canadian about this? Cared to hear their side? Ask them what they need? Or again, are you just telling them what's best? Aboriginal populations outside Canada aren't healing from this either. Or do you read articles and just assume what life is like for them?

Last edited by aliss2; 01-07-2017 at 08:02 PM..
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Old 01-08-2017, 12:42 AM
 
Location: In transition
10,138 posts, read 11,902,696 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aliss2 View Post
I am also a 1st generation Canadian (my mother came as a refugee) but our experience is completely different than the experience of what northern Aboriginals are more often born into. Completely different, almost polar opposites. We came from parents who worked hard at lower wages because of the light at the end of the tunnel. There is no light for many northern Aboriginals. Suicide rates are sky high, depression is the norm, food scarcity is real. I live in North myself.

"It needs to happen now". It won't. And that is something they themselves recognize. White Canadians cannot bandage this for them. They know that. But again, that's colonialism - telling them what's best for them instead of accepting a long-term healing process (standard in Aboriginal culture). It reminds me of methadone or a gastric bypass - just fix it! Now!

I work in a large organization with strong Aboriginal ties. I'm wondering how many here have sat down and just talked to an Aboriginal Canadian about this? Cared to hear their side? Ask them what they need? Or again, are you just telling them what's best? Aboriginal populations outside Canada aren't healing from this either. Or do you read articles and just assume what life is like for them?
I work with Aboriginal Canadians too and totally agree with this.
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Old 01-08-2017, 03:43 AM
 
2,216 posts, read 1,130,442 times
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Northern Canada is about 6 times as massive as Alaska
But Alaska has ~750k people compared to ~150k people in the three Canadian territories
Maybe there will be better uses if the US possess these territories.
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