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I think people often have the wrong idea about why people move to Canada. Sometimes they are coming from something worse. Sometimes they see a financial opportunity for themselves. Sometimes things like 'freedom' enter the picture, but usually when immigrants are thinking of freedom, they, like many born and bred Canadians, consider only the advantages 'freedom' has for themselves.
None of which means immigrants don't make a contribution to Canada but the idea that immigrants are taking a notion of diverse values into the decision to immigrate is not one I have ever come across. Immigrants see something in Canada for themselves first and foremost. In my grandparents case, it was getting the hell out of Dodge, aka the Soviet Union.
I think people often have the wrong idea about why people move to Canada. Sometimes they are coming from something worse. Sometimes they see a financial opportunity for themselves. Sometimes things like 'freedom' enter the picture, but usually when immigrants are thinking of freedom, they, like many born and bred Canadians, consider only the advantages 'freedom' has for themselves.
None of which means immigrants don't make a contribution to Canada but the idea that immigrants are taking a notion of diverse values into the decision to immigrate is not one I have ever come across. Immigrants see something in Canada for themselves first and foremost. In my grandparents case, it was getting the hell out of Dodge, aka the Soviet Union.
This is an excellent point that is almost always overlooked. Even the much-vaunted Canadian value of ''tolerance'' likely doesn't extend much further than the need for assurance that Canada will be tolerant of *them*. Not necessarily of every race, colour, creed or other penchant that exists out there.
Somehow I doubt that there are many immigrants to Canada who choose this country primarily because they want to live among a mix of Asians, blacks, whites, Germans, Arabs, Latinos, Russians, Muslims, aboriginals, francophones, anglophones, gays, eccentrics, conformists, Buddhists, introverts, extroverts, ruralites, urbanites, etc.
Obviously the country is all that, but it's nonetheless human nature to eschew those details and focus on ''me''.
I think people often have the wrong idea about why people move to Canada. Sometimes they are coming from something worse. Sometimes they see a financial opportunity for themselves. Sometimes things like 'freedom' enter the picture, but usually when immigrants are thinking of freedom, they, like many born and bred Canadians, consider only the advantages 'freedom' has for themselves.
None of which means immigrants don't make a contribution to Canada but the idea that immigrants are taking a notion of diverse values into the decision to immigrate is not one I have ever come across. Immigrants see something in Canada for themselves first and foremost. In my grandparents case, it was getting the hell out of Dodge, aka the Soviet Union.
Exactly this!
Were I to have chosen to move elsewhere it would have been based solely upon what would have been in my and my spouse's best interests at the time.
I would never even attempt to float the balloon it would be because of some ethereal or intangible concept.
I am more than safe in putting forth the assumption EVERYONE who immigrated to Canada did so for their own reasons of personal advantage. This country is what it is due to those early and continuing immigrants.
This is an excellent point that is almost always overlooked. Even the much-vaunted Canadian value of ''tolerance'' likely doesn't extend much further than the need for assurance that Canada will be tolerant of *them*. Not necessarily of every race, colour, creed or other penchant that exists out there.
Somehow I doubt that there are many immigrants to Canada who choose this country primarily because they want to live among a mix of Asians, blacks, whites, Germans, Arabs, Latinos, Russians, Muslims, aboriginals, francophones, anglophones, gays, eccentrics, conformists, Buddhists, introverts, extroverts, ruralites, urbanites, etc.
Obviously the country is all that, but it's nonetheless human nature to eschew those details and focus on ''me''.
Yep.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BruSan
Exactly this!
Were I to have chosen to move elsewhere it would have been based solely upon what would have been in my and my spouse's best interests at the time.
I would never even attempt to float the balloon it would be because of some ethereal or intangible concept.
I am more than safe in putting forth the assumption EVERYONE who immigrated to Canada did so for their own reasons of personal advantage. This country is what it is due to those early and continuing immigrants.
Yep.
I have lived in a couple of different places and if I ever have the opportunity to do so again, it will certainly be because there is something in it for me. Maybe it's a culture I have always been interested in and would like to take a first hand look at, or maybe just for warmer weather which is looking more and more appealing since it looks like an early winter has set in for Manitoba.
My views could not be more diametrically opposed to those of people like Ann Coulter but I am not sure I view it as a positive thing that she not be allowed to speak at a university which is supposed to be a place where different ideas are exchanged and debated.
I mean, it's not as if she was practising hate speech or anything.
She certainly dances around it. To cover herself, she will say it's a joke. For example.
"We need somebody to put rat poisoning in Justice Stevens' creme brulee. That's just a joke, for you in the media."
"We need to execute people like (John Walker Lindh) in order to physically intimidate liberals."
"We just want Jews to be perfected, as they say." --arguing that it would be better if we were all Christian
"I don't really like to think of it as a murder. It was terminating Tiller in the 203rd trimester. ... I am personally opposed to shooting abortionists, but I don't want to impose my moral values on others." --on the murder of Kansas abortion doctor George Tiller, FOX News interview, June 22, 2009
I don’t know why you moved to Canada. I am sure you would be much happier living in country which is much more liberal (pun intended) with respect to free speech rights. Our society has a right to decide what we want in the way of laws.
I personally don't know any Canadians that feel their right to free speech is being infringed because of our hate speech laws. In fact, the opposite. People I know seem to agree that hate speech laws make sense. It protects all of us, since we are all part of some identifiable group.
Canada, as you say, has that right to decide what we think best for Canada. I welcome criticism though, since i see it as a chance to educate those, who have incorrect assumptions.
Sometimes it is futile I admit, but maybe Wanderer may learn something.
She certainly dances around it. To cover herself, she will say it's a joke. For example.
"We need somebody to put rat poisoning in Justice Stevens' creme brulee. That's just a joke, for you in the media."
"We need to execute people like (John Walker Lindh) in order to physically intimidate liberals."
"We just want Jews to be perfected, as they say." --arguing that it would be better if we were all Christian
"I don't really like to think of it as a murder. It was terminating Tiller in the 203rd trimester. ... I am personally opposed to shooting abortionists, but I don't want to impose my moral values on others." --on the murder of Kansas abortion doctor George Tiller, FOX News interview, June 22, 2009
There's a lot of ugly stuff out there that people are still allowed to say.
There's a lot of ugly stuff out there that people are still allowed to say.
Of course, but joking about killing someone, or the death of someone, is the really, really ugly.
Her comment about Jews is also particularly insulting. Although I don't believe it falls into the category of hate speech, the undertone is there.
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