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Old 05-04-2018, 10:18 PM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
21,812 posts, read 27,202,483 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phaneuf View Post
Be careful what you wish for...

I have to say I love Latin American culture. I grew up in Maine, but got the adventure bug after high school and went to the University of Puerto Rico, Rio Piedras campus for undergraduate (B.S.) studies and studied and socialized there entirely in Spanish. I travel to the Lower Rio Grande Valley (Brownsville area) and just came back from a trip to Southeast Arizona (Nogales, Naco, Patagonia...). I will probably move there when I am independently wealthy (aka "retirement"). I've also traveled to Tamaulipas and Sonora (Mexico). The people in Mexico are among the warmest, friendliest I've ever met.

However, the U.S. does have an immigration problem and a wall might not be a bad idea. Canada gets the cream of the crop from Latin America, the U.S. does not. I've read academic stuff that one reason the divide between rich and poor in this country has grown so is because of the massive influx of "Hispanics" (a term invented by the U.S. Feds). They don't seem to have the upward mobility of previous immigrant waves. They even have characteristics of developing into a caste, especially in California (which has by far the highest poverty rate in the U.S.). Jason Richwine, who did his Harvard PhD thesis on IQ and Immigration, was beat silly by the liberal educated elite because he challenged their belief that IQ is not 100% environmentally determined. They didn't mind ruining his career because he challenged their sacred cows. He found that IQ among "Hispanic" immigrants stalled and actually declined by the 3rd generation. If you take race/ethnicity out of the equation, most geneticists state that IQ is between 40% and 60% inherited. But when race/ethnicity are mentioned, IQ is 100% environmental. That's how the game works. Take race/ethnicity out of the equation again, and social scientists have found a strong correlation between IQ and educational and professional attainment. Put race/ethnicity in, then the problem becomes "structural" or other forms of racism. There are also great disparities of criminality between "Hispanics" and non-"Hispanic" whites, according to Federal and other crime statistics.

I was listening to a woman who owned a B&B in Nogales, AZ. She makes a lot of money boarding pregnant women from Mexico. It's a "long-term investment" she says. They have their baby and when the baby turns 18, s/he can sponsor mommy and daddy, and then the rest of the extended family, to become U.S. citizens. Of course, there are thousands of others who cross the border illegally every week. Their U.S.-born children are automatic citizens and, as such, qualify for welfare. Many of these illegal immigrant parents avail themselves of this benefit for their children. Who can blame them? Free stuff!!!
Well I did say "if I was forced to choose".

Obviously Canada will always have an easier time dealing with this than the U.S.

That said Latinos are pretty much considered model immigrants here in Quebec. Their culture and demeanour are compatible and they learn French easily.
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Old 05-05-2018, 04:09 AM
 
Location: DC area
82 posts, read 49,682 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
Well I did say "if I was forced to choose".

Obviously Canada will always have an easier time dealing with this than the U.S.

That said Latinos are pretty much considered model immigrants here in Quebec. Their culture and demeanour are compatible and they learn French easily.
I definitely see the connection between Latin America and Quebec. I also spent some time living in Montreal and Quebec City in my 20s, and studied at Université Laval for a summer. I grew up in a heavily Catholic, French-speaking, Franco-American (French-Canadian-immigrant-descended) area of Maine (Androscoggin County). Four-fifths of my high school graduating class were from Franco-American families. Nearly everyone's parents spoke French as a first language, but my generation was raised mostly in English.

Even in my own family I could see cultural differences between French Canadians (my dad's family) and Anglo-Americans (my mom is half old-stock Yankee Mainer, and half Scots-Canadian). When my dad's family got together, there was a lot of talking, joviality, joking, and emphasis on passing a good time, while my mom's family's communication was always more measured with lots of pauses and silent spaces. When I was in Puerto Rico, I found that people had similar communication styles as my dad's family. There are other similarities between French Canadians and Latin Americans, too, besides, communication styles.
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Old 05-05-2018, 07:55 AM
 
470 posts, read 168,421 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NJ Brazen_3133 View Post
Why Canada not have more Hispanic Immigrants?

Canada has lots of South Asian, and East Asian, but why not Latin Americans?

Is Canada trying to differentiate itself from America?
We have to differentiate between Québec and Anglo-Canada. Québec has the largest Hispanic population relative to its population, inside Québec there is a significiant Hispanic population, if you exclude Québec from Canada the size of the Hispanic community even becomes much smaller in the rest of Canada.
Spanish is the fourth most often spoken language in Québec after French, English and Arab.
Not a single South Asian or East Asian language is among the six most often spoken languages in Québec. The presence of Hispanic migrants is definitively larger than the ones of South Asian and East Asian migrants. Québec is unique. In Grand Montréal the total number of Spanish speakers is comparable to the total number of Tagalog speakers in Greater Toronto.

Quote:
Originally Posted by fusion2 View Post
I don't think Canada is trying to favour some ethnic groups over others, I think it more has to do with which groups have larger shares of people who are able to meet Canada's immigration requirements. .... In the Latin American world - the U.S in on the mind as a place to immigrate a lot more than Canada. Closer proximity to Latin America, larger population and history play a role in that obviously - the U.S now has a massive Hispanic population and these things tend to attract and multiply - same with Canada and East Asian and South Asian. That all said, the latin American community in cities like Montreal and Toronto aren't exactly insignificant either. There are also large communities of Caribbean and Guyanese immigrants in Canada.
I agree with you that Anglo-Canada isn't trying to favor some ethnic groups over others, it is truly about meeting the requirements. Once again, Québec is an exception.
Québec does favor some ethnic groups over others indirectly; it favors francophone Europeans, Haitians and [North] Africans. It has a clear preference for French-speaking people and this is indirectly reflected in its ethnic composition.

One might argue though, that in Anglo-Canada there is simply no preference for ethnic groups because since English is globally taught unlike French, that knowing English is not directly connected to ethnic groups, as all ethnic groups across the world strive after learning English.
In East Asian and South Asian culture, education and a hard-working-mentality is highly valued unlike in Hispanic culture, that less values it. And since Canada is an icecold pure-capitalist country that prefers education and a hard-working-mentality... Hispanic people are less likely to make it to Canada in comparison to East/South Asians.

You are very right. Geographic proximity plays a big role. Of course, Canada is more distant to Latin America than the US are, and within the US, the southern states have the highest share of Hispanic migrants. Vancouver is the closest North American city to China and has the highest share of Chinese migrants. So yes, geographic proximity plays a big role. Also, Québec is much more distant to East Asia, than is British Columbia.

We shouldn't forget that the size of a population also plays a big role.
China's population is greater than the combined population of North, Central- and South America! China's population is 3x times bigger than the world's entire Spanish-speaking population!
Combine that with Confucius mentality and we will know why there are more Chinese than Hispanics in Canada.


Toronto does not have a significant Hispanic population relative to its population.
Montréal has a fairly large and significant Hispanic population.


Quote:
Originally Posted by payutenyodagimas View Post
Canada requires immigrants to be able to speak and read English..


America requires that too but most latinos don't bother because they just climbed over the fence/border


if they enforce that requirement in America, you bet they wouldn't qualify
Well, Québec does not require immigrants to speak and read English. Maybe that's why it's so popular among Hispanics

As far as I know, Canada has a point system where you can make it without necessarily knowing English. English will give many points and French some bonus points in Anglo-Canada and in Québec it is the opposite.


Also Québec has its own immigration policy and different ways to enter the belle province.
Québec allows to buy immigrant status for rich people without requiring language or working skills, this is popular for a few rich East Asians.

Quote:
Originally Posted by iron_stick View Post
Most Hispanics in the US come from neighboring countries Mexico, Central America, Cuba, mostly. It's a way shorter trip than to have to cross the entire USA to reach Canada. Also, immigrants attract more immigrants. Most Hispanics already known someone at their destination, a relative, a friend etc. Last but not least, Canada's weather is not very appealing to Hispanics used to tropical weather.
True. Chinese migrants in Montréal tend to leave Québec towards the Chinese community of Vancouver and Richmond.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zoisite View Post
With regard to your mention of America I have this to say. Canada doesn't need to try to differentiate itself from America. Canada already is and always has been different from America and it always will be different from America. It's a mistake for you to try to compare Canada and America with each other in the matter of their respective immigration policies and the types of immigrants that are in both countries. There is no comparison. It is what it is.
Well, Québec has their own immigration policy and differentiates itself from the rest of Canada. I don't know whether US states have that right or whether all US states must follow the same immigration policy. As long as Québec will be part of Canada, Canada will always be different than the US and the rest of Canada does indeed not need to try to be different, that's Québec's duty We ensure that Canada does not equal a "little US-America", unlike New Zealand that is a "little Australia".

Last edited by QuebecOpec; 05-05-2018 at 08:10 AM..
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Old 05-05-2018, 08:18 AM
 
Location: Silicon Valley, CA
9,876 posts, read 6,572,161 times
Reputation: 6254
Quote:
Originally Posted by phaneuf View Post
Myth?, even the non-partisan Pew Foundation has documented the magnitude of the phenomenon: Number of babies born in U.S. to unauthorized immigrants declines | Pew Research Center. Fortunately, the *problem* is declining, along with lowered rates of illegal immigration... if the stats are to be believed. Still, an equivalent to the total population of Tulsa, OK comes into the world as anchor babies each year in the US: https://www.citylab.com/life/2015/09...easing/405202/.

I was not aware of Richwine's demise at Heritage Foundation. He must have done something to really **** them off. From what I read of his dissertation, it is sound by contemporary scientific methods. The main problem, from what I can see, is the subject matter.

I've watched videos of J. Philippe Rushton debating with others in public forums. It is funny to see how his detractors (and there are many) try to railroad him by resorting to theatrics, emotionalism, but very little reason. I think he was even being charged at one time for hate crimes in Ontario because of the subject matter his research... not his scientific methodology, but his subject matter. Canada also has lots of sacred cows, taboos...
Nope. Rushton, Jensen, and Arthur Murray are practitioners of what's called "scientific racism" or academic racism, using dubious and questionable methodologies to arrive at a conclusion. And there is a very long history of this type of junk science to justify and support racism in policy.
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Old 05-05-2018, 08:48 AM
 
411 posts, read 1,146,701 times
Reputation: 313
My humble, personal explanation for Hispanic and Latino people not giving too much consideration to Canada: it is cold (both physically and SOUL-wise) and there is not too much culture resonance with the Latin spirit in general (not to mention the extreme Socialism).

Of all provinces and metropolitan area, maybe Montreal or QC in general has a better chance.

Even some European do not find it to their liking - and that's not for the frigid winters reasons alone...
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Old 05-05-2018, 11:06 AM
 
Location: Vancouver
12,499 posts, read 8,671,827 times
Reputation: 7210
Quote:
Originally Posted by QuebecOpec View Post
We have to differentiate between Québec and Anglo-Canada. Québec has the largest Hispanic population relative to its population, inside Québec there is a significiant Hispanic population, if you exclude Québec from Canada the size of the Hispanic community even becomes much smaller in the rest of Canada.
Spanish is the fourth most often spoken language in Québec after French, English and Arab.
Not a single South Asian or East Asian language is among the six most often spoken languages in Québec. The presence of Hispanic migrants is definitively larger than the ones of South Asian and East Asian migrants. Québec is unique. In Grand Montréal the total number of Spanish speakers is comparable to the total number of Tagalog speakers in Greater Toronto.



I agree with you that Anglo-Canada isn't trying to favor some ethnic groups over others, it is truly about meeting the requirements. Once again, Québec is an exception.
Québec does favor some ethnic groups over others indirectly; it favors francophone Europeans, Haitians and [North] Africans. It has a clear preference for French-speaking people and this is indirectly reflected in its ethnic composition.

One might argue though, that in Anglo-Canada there is simply no preference for ethnic groups because since English is globally taught unlike French, that knowing English is not directly connected to ethnic groups, as all ethnic groups across the world strive after learning English.
In East Asian and South Asian culture, education and a hard-working-mentality is highly valued unlike in Hispanic culture, that less values it. And since Canada is an icecold pure-capitalist country that prefers education and a hard-working-mentality... Hispanic people are less likely to make it to Canada in comparison to East/South Asians.

You are very right. Geographic proximity plays a big role. Of course, Canada is more distant to Latin America than the US are, and within the US, the southern states have the highest share of Hispanic migrants. Vancouver is the closest North American city to China and has the highest share of Chinese migrants. So yes, geographic proximity plays a big role. Also, Québec is much more distant to East Asia, than is British Columbia.

We shouldn't forget that the size of a population also plays a big role.
China's population is greater than the combined population of North, Central- and South America! China's population is 3x times bigger than the world's entire Spanish-speaking population!
Combine that with Confucius mentality and we will know why there are more Chinese than Hispanics in Canada.


Toronto does not have a significant Hispanic population relative to its population.
Montréal has a fairly large and significant Hispanic population.




Well, Québec does not require immigrants to speak and read English. Maybe that's why it's so popular among Hispanics

As far as I know, Canada has a point system where you can make it without necessarily knowing English. English will give many points and French some bonus points in Anglo-Canada and in Québec it is the opposite.


Also Québec has its own immigration policy and different ways to enter the belle province.
Québec allows to buy immigrant status for rich people without requiring language or working skills, this is popular for a few rich East Asians.



True. Chinese migrants in Montréal tend to leave Québec towards the Chinese community of Vancouver and Richmond.

Well, Québec has their own immigration policy and differentiates itself from the rest of Canada. I don't know whether US states have that right or whether all US states must follow the same immigration policy. As long as Québec will be part of Canada, Canada will always be different than the US and the rest of Canada does indeed not need to try to be different, that's Québec's duty We ensure that Canada does not equal a "little US-America", unlike New Zealand that is a "little Australia".
Can you post some links, because what I've found so far disputes this. BC alone has 100,000 Latin Americans out of a population of 4.6 million. Quebec has 129,000 Latin Americans out of a population of 8.6 million.

Ontario has always had more than Quebec and BC.

A home abroad: Latin American presence in B.C. | The Source | Volume 18, Issue 02 - June 27

http://worldpopulationreview.com/ter...ec-population/
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Old 05-05-2018, 11:08 AM
BMI
 
Location: Ontario
7,243 posts, read 4,447,063 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
If forced to pick and choose, personally they're one of the immigrant groups I wouldn't mind to see "pour into" Canada.
Not sure about pouring in but I’d like to see a lot more.
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Old 05-05-2018, 12:09 PM
 
470 posts, read 168,421 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Natnasci View Post
Can you post some links, because what I've found so far disputes this. BC alone has 100,000 Latin Americans out of a population of 4.6 million. Quebec has 129,000 Latin Americans out of a population of 8.6 million.

Ontario has always had more than Quebec and BC.

A home abroad: Latin American presence in B.C. | The Source | Volume 18, Issue 02 - June 27

http://worldpopulationreview.com/ter...ec-population/

Of course, I can. I use the following definition for a Hispanic:
A person whose native or everyday language is Spanish.


I never referred to Latin Americans, the category Latin American also includes people from Brazil, a Portugese-speaking multiethnical country of over 200 million inhabitants.

I only refer to Hispanics. This topic is about Hispanics, not Latin Americans, don't forget that.

Here are my official sources from Statistics Canada for Montréal:


Les langues immigrantes au Canada

Here you can clearly see that Spanish is the second-most often spoken immigrant language in Grand Montréal, whereas East/South Asian languages dominate in Vancouver and Toronto. Spanish means Espagnol in French.


Another source for Québec:
Census Profile, 2016 Census - Quebec [Province] and Canada [Country]

32% of all Hispanic migrants of Canada live in Québec. (145 000 of 458 000)
That's more than Québec's population share within Canada, which makes Québec to have a significant Hispanic population.
So, you see, Québec and Montréal are the most Hispanic, while the rest of Canada is much less.
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Old 05-05-2018, 12:36 PM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
21,812 posts, read 27,202,483 times
Reputation: 8567
Quote:
Originally Posted by QuebecOpec View Post
Of course, I can. I use the following definition for a Hispanic:
A person whose native or everyday language is Spanish.


I never referred to Latin Americans, the category Latin American also includes people from Brazil, a Portugese-speaking multiethnical country of over 200 million inhabitants.

I only refer to Hispanics. This topic is about Hispanics, not Latin Americans, don't forget that.

Here are my official sources from Statistics Canada for Montréal:


Les langues immigrantes au Canada

Here you can clearly see that Spanish is the second-most often spoken immigrant language in Grand Montréal, whereas East/South Asian languages dominate in Vancouver and Toronto. Spanish means Espagnol in French.


Another source for Québec:
Census Profile, 2016 Census - Quebec [Province] and Canada [Country]

32% of all Hispanic migrants of Canada live in Québec. (145 000 of 458 000)
That's more than Québec's population share within Canada, which makes Québec to have a significant Hispanic population.
So, you see, Québec and Montréal are the most Hispanic, while the rest of Canada is much less.
For whatever reason, they're also a lot more visible or "audible" in Quebec. This is of course might be due in part to the fact we have fewer immigrants in general compared to the GTA and SW BC.
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Old 05-05-2018, 12:39 PM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
21,812 posts, read 27,202,483 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phaneuf View Post
I definitely see the connection between Latin America and Quebec. I also spent some time living in Montreal and Quebec City in my 20s, and studied at Université Laval for a summer. I grew up in a heavily Catholic, French-speaking, Franco-American (French-Canadian-immigrant-descended) area of Maine (Androscoggin County). Four-fifths of my high school graduating class were from Franco-American families. Nearly everyone's parents spoke French as a first language, but my generation was raised mostly in English.

Even in my own family I could see cultural differences between French Canadians (my dad's family) and Anglo-Americans (my mom is half old-stock Yankee Mainer, and half Scots-Canadian). When my dad's family got together, there was a lot of talking, joviality, joking, and emphasis on passing a good time, while my mom's family's communication was always more measured with lots of pauses and silent spaces. When I was in Puerto Rico, I found that people had similar communication styles as my dad's family. There are other similarities between French Canadians and Latin Americans, too, besides, communication styles.
I had kinda figured out you'd had this type of background and exposure from your posts.

And of course the username "phaneuf" is icing on the cake.
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