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Old 06-21-2019, 11:31 AM
 
Location: Vancouver
18,494 posts, read 15,380,201 times
Reputation: 11930

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Quote:
Originally Posted by KerrTown View Post
Note to Canadians and other developed countries with a national single-payer healthcare system: Lots of corporate propaganda is published by PR departments of the for-profit healthcare industries, namely pharmaceuticals, hospitals, and health insurance companies that create scare tactics or distortions of fact to Americans. They will demean, slander, etc. your countries and health care systems to keep their dominance in America!

I've heard that people are "dying from rationing in Canada", "poor medical care in the U.K.", "high prices in Australia/New Zealand", and "lack of availability in Europe". If my NHS nurse aunt heard that she was incompetent by the U.S. propaganda, she would be outraged!
As Chevy stated, we are well aware of the propaganda swallowed up by some Americans.

I've mentioned this before, but I think one of the reasons Canadians get their backs up with some of the misinformation out there about our system, is that IF these people really believe that crap, what must they think of us?

Do they honestly believe Canadians would put up with people dying because of lack of care? That we are so uncaring that we would deny a child care because the hospital said no?

Canadians are vigilant in watching what happens to our respective provincial systems. Politicians who mess with it get major flack, like in Ontario right now.

In all of these claims made by this folks, there is always red flags. The stories don't add up. Like people mysteriously knowing that 50 percent of the patients waiting in the waiting room are Canadians. Did they take a poll? Or claiming a certain hospital refused care, so they had to choose another one...one story that claimed this gave the name of the second hospital. Trouble was, that hospital does not exist.

Most of the stories are second hand, or more. It's " I heard from my uncles old girlfriends brother, that his friends sister who lives in Canada had to wait 3 years to see a doctor.

Chevy mentioned a lot of the claims, and I have to agree, but one other major one is that they believe the government is directly involved in the doctor patient relationship. They are not.

That sort of thing.
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Old 06-21-2019, 11:55 AM
 
22,923 posts, read 15,377,500 times
Reputation: 16962
Quote:
Originally Posted by Natnasci View Post
As Chevy stated, we are well aware of the propaganda swallowed up by some Americans.

I've mentioned this before, but I think one of the reasons Canadians get their backs up with some of the misinformation out there about our system, is that IF these people really believe that crap, what must they think of us?

Do they honestly believe Canadians would put up with people dying because of lack of care? That we are so uncaring that we would deny a child care because the hospital said no?

Canadians are vigilant in watching what happens to our respective provincial systems. Politicians who mess with it get major flack, like in Ontario right now.

In all of these claims made by this folks, there is always red flags. The stories don't add up. Like people mysteriously knowing that 50 percent of the patients waiting in the waiting room are Canadians. Did they take a poll? Or claiming a certain hospital refused care, so they had to choose another one...one story that claimed this gave the name of the second hospital. Trouble was, that hospital does not exist.

Most of the stories are second hand, or more. It's " I heard from my uncles old girlfriends brother, that his friends sister who lives in Canada had to wait 3 years to see a doctor.

Chevy mentioned a lot of the claims, and I have to agree, but one other major one is that they believe the government is directly involved in the doctor patient relationship. They are not.

That sort of thing.
Get the feeling you're trying to teach physics to grade two students?

What exactly would our motivation be for continually attempting to educate Americans about the erroneous nonsense they're fed by their various entities, all of them having vested interests?

Are we all lying through our teeth with the only possible reason being our "pride" while ignoring our supposed plight of dying without complaint?

How stupid would all of us be not to jump on the bandwagon if indeed our healthcare was experiencing every negative these fools believe. We would be remiss if we didn't add our voices to those Americans describing the horrors of our system, if indeed they were a reality.

We do not have a dog in their hunt for a better healthcare system. For some reason they seem to think we're trying to sell them something. What other reason could they have for thinking all of our attempts to correct the misinformation they're fed is for any reason other than altruism. It's not like we will lose anything from their continued suffering and it's not like we will gain anything if they change for the better.

I don't get their clinging to the nonsense they're fed about ours when they aren't being forced to accept it's duplication even if they go to a single payer system of their own.

Last edited by BruSan; 06-21-2019 at 12:14 PM..
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Old 06-21-2019, 03:56 PM
 
Location: Vancouver
18,494 posts, read 15,380,201 times
Reputation: 11930
Quote:
Originally Posted by BruSan View Post
Get the feeling you're trying to teach physics to grade two students?

What exactly would our motivation be for continually attempting to educate Americans about the erroneous nonsense they're fed by their various entities, all of them having vested interests?

Are we all lying through our teeth with the only possible reason being our "pride" while ignoring our supposed plight of dying without complaint?

How stupid would all of us be not to jump on the bandwagon if indeed our healthcare was experiencing every negative these fools believe. We would be remiss if we didn't add our voices to those Americans describing the horrors of our system, if indeed they were a reality.

We do not have a dog in their hunt for a better healthcare system. For some reason they seem to think we're trying to sell them something. What other reason could they have for thinking all of our attempts to correct the misinformation they're fed is for any reason other than altruism. It's not like we will lose anything from their continued suffering and it's not like we will gain anything if they change for the better.

I don't get their clinging to the nonsense they're fed about ours when they aren't being forced to accept it's duplication even if they go to a single payer system of their own.
Exactly. Any failings of our system are duly noted in the press and by citizens complaining to Health Districts etc.

Some seem to think they have a " gotcha " moment when they point out a failing, as if we were stating that our system is perfect. Varying opinions abound, but it is safe to say the VAST majority of Canadians prefer our system and are continually looking on how to improve it, not dismantle it. That says something.

As for not having a dog in the hunt, not me personally, but by a degree of separation. Friends and family in the US who want a better system.

I suppose another reason we jump to correct the misinformation, heck lies, about our system is to try and do a service to those who are so misinformed, that they are acting against their best interests. That they have templates of all kinds of UHC around the world, and can create something that works for them.
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Old 06-21-2019, 03:57 PM
 
Location: Toronto, ON
2,339 posts, read 2,057,627 times
Reputation: 1650
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ruth4Truth View Post
Because busloads of diabetics from the US have been going to Canada for affordable insulin, and because there are websites based in Canada, that market drugs to Americans, at much more affordable prices. It may only be certain drugs that are cheaper.
Insulin is inherently an inexpensive drug to make, about $2.00 a vial. In the US system everybody takes a cut before the customer gets it... and they end up paying 10x what it costs here, and probably anywhere.
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Old 10-08-2019, 07:49 AM
 
Location: Somewhere flat in Mississippi
10,062 posts, read 12,726,267 times
Reputation: 7168
But would Canadians want American to reimport drugs from them?
https://reason.com/2019/10/08/cheap-...rom-canada-eh/
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Old 10-08-2019, 11:27 AM
 
Location: Vancouver
18,494 posts, read 15,380,201 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mouldy Old Schmo View Post
But would Canadians want American to reimport drugs from them?
https://reason.com/2019/10/08/cheap-...rom-canada-eh/
Reimport?

The article itself seems a bit vague on what percentage is actually " reimported ". It seems to want to lump in Canadian made prescriptions as being reimported just because the drug exists in the US. Kind of like saying a Russian Vodka is being " reimported " since you have vodka in the US.

"The "importation" Azar was referring to, sometimes called "reimportation" or "parallel trade," involves importing drugs to the U.S. that are already available here..."

I would like to know what percentage of drugs would actually be reimported BACK to the US.

The article seems to be ignoring the fact that many drugs are made in Canada and around the world. It's is also fear mongering the old adage that if pharmaceuticals don't make a lot of money, R&D will suffer. Again ignoring the fact that R&D isn't done solely by big Pharma and exists quite well in countries with UHC that include prescriptions.

https://www.ic.gc.ca/eic/site/lsg-pd...h_hn01703.html

However to answer your question Mouldy, my guess is that the majority will say no, especially since it would put are own system under strain, and even threaten it. Perhaps that is even the plan.

Why should Canada pay for the US's missteps in dealing with their OWN healthcare issues.
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Old 10-08-2019, 01:38 PM
 
22,923 posts, read 15,377,500 times
Reputation: 16962
We've received our order from our American friends for supplies of Extra Strength Voltaren and Nasonex to carry down to them.

The Voltaren is available over the counter here whereas it requires a script in Florida. The three 100G tubes we're taking down cost us $19.99 per tube so when they receive them, they'll be getting them for slightly under $15 per tube with exchange factored.

The Nasonex is "free" to me through my pension provided pharma coverage and I no longer use it as I haven't had an allergy symptom for years now so I keep getting my refills (I'm bad, I know) and "donate" them to those who are desperate for them down there.

Other Canadians we know are similarly petitioned to be "drug mules" for Americans suffering from larger costs.

Now having talked about the pharmaceuticals a bit …. ask me what I think when I see a case of 24 Molsen Canadian on sale for $15 U.S. at the local Walmart or Sam's Club when I'm paying over $50 for that in the wonderful Ontario government monopoly "Brewer's Extortion Stores".
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Old 10-08-2019, 04:00 PM
 
Location: Vancouver
18,494 posts, read 15,380,201 times
Reputation: 11930
Quote:
Originally Posted by BruSan View Post
We've received our order from our American friends for supplies of Extra Strength Voltaren and Nasonex to carry down to them.

The Voltaren is available over the counter here whereas it requires a script in Florida. The three 100G tubes we're taking down cost us $19.99 per tube so when they receive them, they'll be getting them for slightly under $15 per tube with exchange factored.

The Nasonex is "free" to me through my pension provided pharma coverage and I no longer use it as I haven't had an allergy symptom for years now so I keep getting my refills (I'm bad, I know) and "donate" them to those who are desperate for them down there.

Other Canadians we know are similarly petitioned to be "drug mules" for Americans suffering from larger costs.

Now having talked about the pharmaceuticals a bit …. ask me what I think when I see a case of 24 Molsen Canadian on sale for $15 U.S. at the local Walmart or Sam's Club when I'm paying over $50 for that in the wonderful Ontario government monopoly "Brewer's Extortion Stores".
That's quite a bit more than we pay in BC...still not cheap, but you can get 24 cans of Molson Canadian for around $37.00 before taxes and deposit on the cans.

Prices vary in the US a lot as well for the liquor I buy. I don't really drink hard liquor, and try to stay away from major brewers beers. In a grocery store in Eugene Oregon, six packs of craft beer were selling for $11 to $13 USD for six. Not a bargain for me. They did have a Unibroue La Fin du monde from Quebec which was a nice surprise to see, but at $10 USD for a 750 ml bottle, it was twice, after conversion, of what I would pay here.

The other thing that, well at least in Washington, Oregon and California, is that the quality of wine I drink at home, isn't any cheaper in those states. They do sometimes have better sales that here, but overall I was still paying a lot, especially when you factor in the exchange.

From my understanding, hard liquor is still quite a bit cheaper in the US.

Eugene



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Old 10-08-2019, 07:09 PM
 
22,923 posts, read 15,377,500 times
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I like the variety of available outlets in the U.S. instead of the government having a lock on the sales of beer and hard liquor as it's handled in Ontario.

Wine is and has been available in grocery stores now but the rest is handled by a monopolistic tax sucking monster.
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Old 10-08-2019, 07:35 PM
 
Location: Vancouver
18,494 posts, read 15,380,201 times
Reputation: 11930
Quote:
Originally Posted by BruSan View Post
I like the variety of available outlets in the U.S. instead of the government having a lock on the sales of beer and hard liquor as it's handled in Ontario.

Wine is and has been available in grocery stores now but the rest is handled by a monopolistic tax sucking monster.
When I'm in Toronto, the beer stores seem odd, harkening back to the days when liquor had to be sold over the counter.

Things are a bit looser here in BC. Lots of private wine shops, plenty of private liquor stores and there are no special beer stores, it's just sold in the liquor stores and off sales at pubs. It is legal to sell wine in grocery stores as well, but it's up to each city to allow it. For some reason Vancouver doesn't, but other communities do.

Back on topic. What about non-prescription drugs? IMO they are getting more expensive here.
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