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...At this point I see some relief with my husband since he reached out to the Social Worker yesterday. If anything else, even if his mother cannot understand the importance of getting help right now, whether that be in the form of Hospice or letting us do more, at least my husband has a 3rd party, a neutral outlet, that has experience with this involved. Hopefully, in time, it can help us all (especially the three of them) work towards making this a more caring environment where everyone can support each other so that FIL last weeks/months can be the best as possible in this situation. He is going to talk to his Mom this afternoon about his call and to see if she would be willing to at least talk to them. Just praying that she is a little receptive to this. She needs the relief and FIL needs the extra care!
As this thread has evolved and more information has come to light, I can see why you are torn. But it does appear now that your husband has become more involved personally and perhaps things will swing in a different direction, especially if the social worker can somehow convince your MIL that providing your FIL with adequate end-of-life care and assistance when needed really does benefit everyone involved.
Dealing with aging parents is never easy and unfortunately, many are unaware of the resources that are available to them. Some view it as charity, some view it as intrusion, some view it as a blessing. I think your pointing out their limited education here is key. That would account for the MIL wanting to do things her way. But the problem with informing your FIL is still present and for anything to happen regarding hospice, he has to be informed.
To that end, I am hoping that a social worker will get involved and at least discuss this with your MIL so that they can have the discussion with your FIL and a plan of care can be implemented. This alone may alleviate some of the stress that is taking its toll. Please let us know how the discussion goes.
Not to go into all the details but could you sit there and watch the supposed caregiver forcing the man to drink while he still had a mouthful in his mouth and her saying things like "NiXXer, drink this I don't want it to go to waste"! There is so much (things I don't even want to type out) that it is just too difficult to even go into and IT IS TEARING ME UP INSIDE!!
I am so sorry you are going through this.
I could not watch it either. I would have to either tell off my MIL or tell my husband why I can't take it anymore, and stop going over there. There is wrong & right, and what she is doing is wrong.
Probably the worst advice I have ever seen on here. And that says a lot.
That's funny; I was thinking the same thing about your advice. And with far better reason, I would say.
Quote:
Originally Posted by seain dublin
First off it matters because the MIL is the wife of this man, the OP is a DIL, it's not her place to say something. It's not her father, it's not her husband.
I don't agree. I agree that it matters to the extent that it needs to be considered, but I do not agree that it matters enough to make the difference.
The central issue here is a simple one. The man is dying, and is begging his family to tell him what his condition, his prognosis, and his treatment plan are. They are looking him right in the eye and lying to his face. He has an absolute right to know these things, and nobody has the right to not tell him - the fact that his wife is married to him does not change a thing. Wife or not, she has no right to withhold the truth from a dying man.
And if she doesn't have the right, she certainly doesn't have the right to ask others to help her lie. Once she drags other people into the conspiracy, she is making it their business. When she asked the daughter in law to lie to the father in law, she dragged the daughter in law into the middle of it, and at that point, it is her place to say something. In fact, in my opinion she has not just the right but a moral obligation - but as I said earlier, that's a decision only she can make for herself.
Quote:
Originally Posted by seain dublin
But to tell some to cause a huge rift that could last a lifetime, is not smart Albert. The family is going through enough right now without adding to the mix.
Real easy for you to sit their and give foolish advice when you're not the one whose family is going to suffer the consequences.
Which is exactly why I said a couple of times that I was speaking only for myself, and that the OP would have to make her decisions based on what she truly believed - in her heart - was the best thing to do in her particular situation. From reading her subsequent posts, I've gained a good deal of insight into her circumstances and why she's handling it the way she is, and along with that insight, I've gained a considerable respect for the woman. The more I read from her, the more I admire her. Even though I would still handle it differently than she is, I can't fault her or criticize anything about the way she is trying to navigate this horrendous tragedy. I can scarcely imagine how painful and stressful it must be for her, and I wish her the best in steering this circus to a worthy conclusion.
But you're right about one thing - yes, it is easy for me to take the position I'm defending here. Because this is an absolute no-brainer. To me, the fact that a dying man is being lied to about his condition by everyone he thinks loves him is so utterly despicable and indefensible I'm literally aghast that anyone can even consider excusing it. He has only a short time left on this earth, and his opportunity to spend that remaining time as he sees fit is being stolen from him by his own family - the very people he ought to be able to rely on more than anyone at a time like this.
To me, that man's right to know his condition is infinitely more important to me than whether or not some lying, immoral cowards will be angry at me. But apparently, it's more important to you not to rock the boat or ruffle any feathers. That's your prerogative, but I'll just say that I like my priorities a hell of a lot more than I like yours. I find mine much easier to live with.
the central issue here is a simple one. The man is dying, and is begging his family to tell him what his condition, his prognosis, and his treatment plan are. They are looking him right in the eye and lying to his face. He has an absolute right to know these things, and nobody has the right to not tell him - the fact that his wife is married to him does not change a thing. Wife or not, she has no right to withhold the truth from a dying man.
And if she doesn't have the right, she certainly doesn't have the right to ask others to help her lie. Once she drags other people into the conspiracy, she is making it their business. When she asked the daughter in law to lie to the father in law, she dragged the daughter in law into the middle of it, and at that point, it is her place to say something. In fact, in my opinion she has not just the right but a moral obligation - but as i said earlier, that's a decision only she can make for herself.
But you're right about one thing - yes, it is easy for me to take the position i'm defending here. Because this is an absolute no-brainer. To me, the fact that a dying man is being lied to about his condition by everyone he thinks loves him is so utterly despicable and indefensible i'm literally aghast that anyone can even consider excusing it. He has only a short time left on this earth, and his opportunity to spend that remaining time as he sees fit is being stolen from him by his own family - the very people he ought to be able to rely on more than anyone at a time like this.
To me, that man's right to know his condition is infinitely more important to me than whether or not some lying, immoral cowards will be angry at me. But apparently, it's more important to you not to rock the boat or ruffle any feathers. That's your prerogative, but i'll just say that i like my priorities a hell of a lot more than i like yours. I find mine much easier to live with.
Thank you all for your input and especially for the words of support!
My husband told his mother yesterday about his call to the Social Worker and like expected she was furious (she even threw something at him)! She told him he didn't have a right to do that and that she doesn't need or want anyone telling her how to care for her husband and doesn't want those people in her home.
However after a very long talk with her and really being honest about how he feels she finally agreed to at least talking with the Social Worker. He is hoping they can do that today so that maybe by Monday they can have someone come to the home and talk to them all and work out a plan for all the issues.
She also knows now that the oldest may not be coming as originally expected for a visit (he had told us he would come for 1-2 weeks) and I think she was really hoping to have him here. She told my husband that she can't count on anyone else and is so mad. So I think that also played into her being at least a little receptive to exploring this next stage.
Again thanks for all your posts! I haven't been able to talk to friends about all of this because my friends are also my husband's friends so I haven't really had an outlet except for one of my brothers. So I'm thankful for this forum and the people here!
I'm glad your husband is at least doing something to alleviate this situation. It is probably better that your MIL thinks she can't count on anyone else at this point.
One thing I have not heard is anything from the OP indicating that the mother-in-law claims that her husband has said all along that he would not want to know if he has a terminal prognosis. Just the contrary, it sounds as though he wants to know his prognosis and treatment plan, and he has every right to know that and to make his own decisions. For instance, regardless of his wife's wishes, he could choose to accept or reject hospice care, but only if he knows the facts, so he has the right to know the facts.
A month ago you received a prognosis of 2-3 months to live, so the mother-in-law's decision has burned through one of those months and he could have 1-2 months (or even less) left. If you agree that he has the right to determine what to do with his last month or two of life then you also have to agree that he has the right to know the true facts.
I'm glad your husband is at least doing something to alleviate this situation. It is probably better that your MIL thinks she can't count on anyone else at this point.
I think you are so right on this! Because not only hearing that the oldest really had no set plans to come home my husband also told her yesterday that it's getting harder and harder for him to come over under the current circumstances and that even if she doesn't want outside support he does in order to continue.
I think you are so right on this! Because not only hearing that the oldest really had no set plans to come home my husband also told her yesterday that it's getting harder and harder for him to come over under the current circumstances and that even if she doesn't want outside support he does in order to continue.
One thing I have not heard is anything from the OP indicating that the mother-in-law claims that her husband has said all along that he would not want to know if he has a terminal prognosis. Just the contrary, it sounds as though he wants to know his prognosis and treatment plan, and he has every right to know that and to make his own decisions. For instance, regardless of his wife's wishes, he could choose to accept or reject hospice care, but only if he knows the facts, so he has the right to know the facts.
A month ago you received a prognosis of 2-3 months to live, so the mother-in-law's decision has burned through one of those months and he could have 1-2 months (or even less) left. If you agree that he has the right to determine what to do with his last month or two of life then you also have to agree that he has the right to know the true facts.
If his wife won't tell him his son should.
My husband told the Social Worker about this. She was the same one that came in after the Oncologist gave the prognosis.
Thankfully the medical center FIL received care from is huge and has a whole network of resources under one umbrella that coordinate with each other. So we're hoping that with their help this can be one of the first things that is resolved. Because yes, I agree, the clock is ticking and no, not once has FIL or MIL ever said that he would never want to know.
MIL definitely has been in denial and that was probably one of the reasons why she didn't want to say anything. Every time she sees him move his legs a bit (or some other little thing) she says he's getting better and stronger. She also didn't want it known because she didn't want all sorts of people (extended family, friends, church members etc.) coming over. DH told her again yesterday that she will see Dad have good days and bad days but that he still has terminal cancer that can no longer be treated and that unfortunately death is imminent so they cannot deny it anymore.
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