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Frankly, SIL saying that unless you do the bag care you should just stay home to me sends up even more Red Flags. But perhaps, she is just being manipulating rather than it being something else.
But, if you go during the day, at least you will see MIL in person to evaluate if she has declined since your last visit. Maybe you and hubby could visit a few nursing homes by yourself while you are in town (in case of an emergency where you have to do something ASAP).
I know that I have mentioned it several times, but, please have hubby ask more details about the bags. Maybe SIL or MIL will be honest with him.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Briolat21
I realize that we (all not 102 year olds) think that MIL should just suck it up and let a man see her naked and change her ostomy bag.
I would.
My mother (who died at 81) allowed a male aide to assist her and change her.
But 102 is OLD.
It is born in 1913 old. It is literally from a completely different era.
Which doesn't mean they can't change and adapt, but that it may not be as remotely psychologically easy as many people on this board seem to suggest.
Which doesn't mean there's a good solution for this situation (MIL only wants to be cared for by WOMEN, there are no WOMEN available if SIL goes on vacation)..
but it does mean that its entirely possible that its not a nefarious situation. Just a sad reality that while times have changed considerably around people's expectations of gender privacy, this woman's strongly held personal preferences have not.
I can really understand that a 102 year old woman would not want a random male unknown to her, such as a male HHCA hired for the week, to provide personal care but even a 102 year woman should realize that her son, who she gave birth to, raised into adulthood, and has known & loved and has known & loved her almost 60 years fits into a different category.
And, what does MIL do when she is in the hospital or at a doctor's visit refuse to let a male nurse/aide/doctor care for her?
I have only had contact with a few very elderly relatives and friends of my parents in their 90s to 101 and what I observed of their reaction to personal care was different. Of course, they are/were modest at times when modesty was needed but having had so many doctors & hospital & rehab visits with dozens and dozens of different nurses, aides, doctors over their last few years they handled those types of things with much more matter of factness than many younger people. On more than one occasion when I visited an elderly person in the hospital or rehab or in a nursing home and an aide/nurse/doctor came to check or wash a usually covered part of their body or even change an adult diaper and the aide/nurse/doctor asked me to leave the room the elderly person just "waved it off" and said something to me like "Oh, stay. It isn't any big deal" (full discloser/it never involved changing a colostomy bag/ and I usually looked away to private privacy to my relative or friend).
I can see that my last post was not as clear as it could have been. I meant more that SIL cancelling her vacation plans, and saying that it was only because of the colostomy bag changing raises more Red Flags. Maybe it is just because MIL is extremely private or maybe it is because SIL does not trust her brother and the OP and does not want to leave them in charge of their mother's care. Or maybe MIL is far sicker than SIL let's on and SIL is seriously concerned that she will die while she is gone. OR maybe SIL is worried that her brother will take Mom to the doctor while she is gone or talk with an elder care advisor or put her in a nursing home. Or ???
Frankly, I think something is up with SIL cancelling her vacation. Maybe she just wants to play the martyr and be able to tell her friends "I cared for my mother for NINE YEARS and my selfish brother would not even give me a break to go on one vacation" or maybe Mom is more seriously ill or has bed sores or something. Or maybe SIL is just so angry with her brother, even though she continues to refuse money & refuse help, that she is trying to make him & the OP feel guilty. Or, maybe it is just that MIL does not want her son, or a HHCA/stranger, to see her being naked. Or maybe something completely different.
OP, maybe I missed it in your posts, but has your SIL gone on any vacations after MIL had her colostomy bag? If yes, WHO changed the bag then? If this surgery was very recent maybe MIL had a bad experience in the hospital or rehab center with a male nurse or male doctor or male aide who was insensitive.
As with everyone else on C-D I'm just giving my opinions and suggestions from what I have experienced in life. Someone else may have had dramatically different experiences. Everyone can learn from everyone else.
Last edited by germaine2626; 07-04-2015 at 08:27 AM..
I can really understand that a 102 year old woman would not want a random male unknown to her, such as a male HHCA hired for the week, to provide personal care but even a 102 year woman should realize that her son, who she gave birth to, raised into adulthood, and has known & loved and has known & loved her almost 60 years fits into a different category.
And, what does MIL do when she is in the hospital or at a doctor's visit refuse to let a male nurse/aide/doctor care for her? <snip> .
My father was 87 when he fell and had to be hospitalized. He absolutely refused to have a female nurse help him in the bathroom. I was standing outside the room and heard her yelling "But I'm a nurse !". Dad locked the door. I was outside the door because I knew there was no way my father would allow me to assist him but I was hoping he would allow a nurse to help. No way.
BTW, I'd rather die than have my sons provide "personal" care. I'd let a male aide help me, but not my sons.
SIL has gone on a few vacations in the 9 years but each time she took my MIL along. She has taken several overnight trips because my MIL can go about 2 days without bag changing. My MIL is 102 (103 at the end of the summer), my SiL is 75, my DH is 66. My MIL doesn't want to go on vacation anymore.
My MIL lets male doctors and attendents assist her when in the hospital. She is in the hospital 2-3 times a year when her "heart acts up."
SIL desparately wants a vacation and we are willing to provide all needed help (my MIL is a total delight and of great mental state, just needs physical help) except the care of the colonoscopy bag. Quite frequently my MIL has a "blowout" and everything leaks and MIL needs help with getting cleaned up. This is the big problem.
My SIL also refuses to apply for Medicaid home health assistance because she insists they tried this briefly and when home health assistance is engaged that a case manager is assigned and their decisions as far as equipment for the colonoscopy is inferior to what they have learned works best and bag failure (with all the humiliation for her mom) becomes a daily problem.
Quote:
Originally Posted by WorldKlas
SIL has gone on a few vacations in the 9 years but each time she took my MIL along. She has taken several overnight trips because
my MIL can go about 2 days without bag changing. My MIL is 102 (103 at the end of the summer), my SiL is 75, my DH is 66. My MIL doesn't want to go on vacation anymore.
Hmmm, it is only a guess, but I would have to wonder if going two entire days between bag changes could be part of the problem of blow-outs and leaks.
Of course, everyone is different but I remember that my hubby usually changed his colostomy bag twice a day (and maybe even three times some days). He was working full time, plus active in many community activities so it was very important that he not have "leaks" while away from home. Of course, maybe my hubby's experience/equipment was different and most people change their bags far less often than he did.
Is it possible that SIL is changing the bag so rarely to save money? Would buying more bags be helpful?
Quote:
Originally Posted by WorldKlas
SIL desparately wants a vacation and we are willing to provide all needed help (my MIL is a total delight and of great mental state, just needs physical help) except the care of the colonoscopy bag.
Quite frequently my MIL has a "blowout" and everything leaks and MIL needs help with getting cleaned up. This is the big problem.
My MIL refuses having a "stranger" or a man help her.
My SIL also refuses to apply for Medicaid home health assistance because she insists they tried this briefly and when home health assistance is engaged that a case manager is assigned and their decisions as far as equipment for the colonoscopy is inferior to what they have learned works best and bag failure (with all the humiliation for her mom) becomes a daily problem.
Quote:
Originally Posted by WorldKlas
My MIL lets male doctors and attendents assist her when in the hospital. She is in the hospital 2-3 times a year when her "heart acts up."
Hmmm, so when MIL is in the hospital men and "strangers" can help her, but she won't allow a trained Home Care Aide or Nurse or anyone one else help her in her home?
Thank you for updating. I hope that you have a wonderful time with MIL & SIL.
I can see that my last post was not as clear as it could have been. I meant more that SIL cancelling her vacation plans, and saying that it was only because of the colostomy bag changing raises more Red Flags. Maybe it is just because MIL is extremely private or maybe it is because SIL does not trust her brother and the OP and does not want to leave them in charge of their mother's care. Or maybe MIL is far sicker than SIL let's on and SIL is seriously concerned that she will die while she is gone. OR maybe SIL is worried that her brother will take Mom to the doctor while she is gone or talk with an elder care advisor or put her in a nursing home. Or ???
Frankly, I think something is up with SIL cancelling her vacation. Maybe she just wants to play the martyr and be able to tell her friends "I cared for my mother for NINE YEARS and my selfish brother would not even give me a break to go on one vacation" or maybe Mom is more seriously ill or has bed sores or something. Or maybe SIL is just so angry with her brother, even though she continues to refuse money & refuse help, that she is trying to make him & the OP feel guilty. Or, maybe it is just that MIL does not want her son, or a HHCA/stranger, to see her being naked. Or maybe something completely different.
Or maybe SIL is a control freak, made worse by increasing age, and doesn't want anyone else making decisions or "interfering" with how her mother is cared for.
Or maybe SIL is a control freak, made worse by increasing age, and doesn't want anyone else making decisions or "interfering" with how her mother is cared for.
Well, maybe after taking care of her Mom for years.... Alone.... she may be the expert and have good reason to not want an uninvolved brother and judgmental SIL telling her what's "best" for everyone. And her Mom certainly seems happy about her care.
It's always lovely when family flies in for these helpful visits. So helpful, I'm sure.....
Well, maybe after taking care of her Mom for years.... Alone.... she may be the expert and have good reason to not want an uninvolved brother and judgmental SIL telling her what's "best" for everyone. And her Mom certainly seems happy about her care.
It's always lovely when family flies in for these helpful visits. So helpful, I'm sure.....
Why do you keep attacking me? Please point out my judgemental comments.
Well, maybe after taking care of her Mom for years.... Alone.... she may be the expert and have good reason to not want an uninvolved brother and judgmental SIL telling her what's "best" for everyone. And her Mom certainly seems happy about her care.
It's always lovely when family flies in for these helpful visits. So helpful, I'm sure.....
I haven't found WorldKlas judgemental in her posts. I disagree with your interpretation of her her posts.
Why do you keep attacking me? Please point out my judgemental comments.
I am just calling them like I see them.
There was no reason for you to shame your SIL by revealing details about her tragic life.... in explicit detail. They were not relevant to your initial question at all. They were filled with judgment. You painted her in a horrible light with not so subtle implications about everything from her parenting skills to her financial failures, dead husband, drug addicted daughter and then aren't even ashamed about admitted to giving her only $100 a month in your attempts to control her for not using Medicaid home health services. You say it clearly, and explicitly. In one post you practically call her a saint for the good care she has given your MIL .... then in another you imply she is a mess in every single aspect of her life..... I can only imagine what it has been like for your poor sister to ask for help from you and your husband. And I love how this is said from 600 miles away, which you have made clear is a very big distance to have to cross for you to generously help out, particularly considering your serious cat allergy.
I feel for your SIL. I really do. In your initial posts, you said she did use Medicaid home services in the past and it did not go well. Perhaps that is also the reason she doesn't want to do it. Have you tried to solve the problems that made it fail the first time? Do you even understand what these are? Do you understand how hard it can be to manage home health workers? Do you know how poorly the Medicaid workers are paid? Less then $10 per hour in most states. So it can be very challenging to find good help through Medicaid, as the workers tend to be transient, unreliable, poorly trained, and they are no fans of dealing with ostomy bags either. For my father's one homecare worker that came only 4 hours per week, I wound up having to spend almost the entire time there anyway just to guide her, keep her working, clean up problems and make sure she didn't take advantage of my father. In the end it was more problems than help and we let her go. I suspect SIL had a lot of problems too....
But what really makes me sad about this situation is the sense of shame you paint over this small request. To change an ostomy bag. For you to express such disgust, which I am sure is clear to your SIL and your MIL and your husband..... did you every think how that makes them feel?
Again I say... you and your husband have no idea how lucky you have it. I feel no empathy here. No real empathy.
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