Declawed and allowed out - insane!

[=^..^=]

Originally Posted by CSD610

I have responded to your words, like it or not there are others who have an opinion about Cats, Shelters, Rescues and Veterinary medicine that is contrary to what YOU THINK IS RIGHT.

And I have stated more than once that I don't speak for other areas of this huge country or other countries.... just my experiences where I lived and live now.

I never stated people did not give a "hoot" about cats, it is your attitude toward others who do not believe exactly as you do about taking care of cats that is the issue.

Keep believing that ALL of the animals who are rescued are taken care of properly and never killed. It is not the truth everywhere but you keep on believing it.

See, you're doing it again. You read into posts what isn't there and twist what's said so it fits your agenda.

[CSD610]

Originally Posted by =^..^=

And I have stated more than once that I don't speak for other areas of this huge country or other countries.... just my experiences where I lived and live now.




See, you're doing it again. You read into posts what isn't there and twist what's said so it fits your agenda.

That's a laugh...........

Next........

[Miller88]

Originally Posted by =^..^=

He caught them INSIDE your home?

Yes. The joys of a pre-civil war era house :S

We didn't allow him outside (after a few weeks, he realized we were his family and didn't want to leave). At least twice a week, there would be a mouse at the bottom of the stairs waiting for us. We'd praise him and give him turkey or cheese (poor guy had kidney failure, so anything he would eat would be good).

He only weighed 5 pounds.

I think he got rid of them, or they moved elsewhere. The Ragdoll and Snowshoe do not catch anything at their house.

[greg42]

Originally Posted by HOF4256

"Dr. Internet", in a "declawing" thread/discussion - have to respectfully ask this question, then.

You can bring it back to a declawing discussion if you like. What I saw was an implication that most vets are out to *********, regardless of the original topic of the thread. My objective was to point out just how ridiculous a position that is.

Originally Posted by HOF4256

Why are there days where you make multiple threads asking for advice regarding the same cat? (Don't misinterpret -- it's good that you do; the info may even help others as well, beings this forum's public.)

Days? Heh. I think there was one time a few weeks ago that I did that, could possibly be the only time since I don't start too many threads overall; I mainly do replies. I ask for experiences, which could be construed as advice and is often given as such, but I always take that info in along with info from other sources. Also one of those threads was kind of a rant. I always hope that things I write/instigate/whatever on here will help others in some way. I purposely continued to update the one thread with my own additional experiences and findings in case they helped.

Originally Posted by HOF4256

But your vet & his/her Techs can't help you with all those questions/issues, at all?

At all? Heck no that's not the case. Get plenty of suggestions from them. But getting a few other experiences? Why not? What I said is you have to parse all this info, and in the midst of what seems like a crisis trying to do that can send you right over the edge.

Originally Posted by HOF4256

And you've maintained that you have a wonderful vet -- which is priceless.

I like the vet, yes. If you're saying "priceless" as in "what a hypocrite" then I can only say you have a different measure of what is a wonderful vet than I do. Otherwise, yes, it's not just priceless but critical to have a vet you can trust. The point of my remarks in this thread was to head off all this BS that some huge majority of vets are untrustworthy and only out for your money.

Originally Posted by HOF4256

To answer your other question, the Vets I would avoid like the plague are ones who declaw (and sell -- oops, "prescribe" -- cereal to diabetic & blocking obligate carnivores.)

Same as I wouldn't go shop @ at a store which sells puppies, or patronise a mechanic caught putting sugar in peoples' gas tanks.

You are describing issues of ethics though rather than competence, with the possible exception of the food. (BTW, sugar in the tank is mostly a myth. Not a sure fire way to damage anything.) It is a matter of how hard of a line you want to draw on those things. You want to take a hard absolute line on those things? That's fine. Here's mine though:

This vet, I don't really know if he declaws. I never asked, never heard, don't have his opinion. My cat scratches him regularly, and he shrugs it off. In terms of food, he has never pushed food or other particular products on us, though he does in fact sell some things including some of the "prescription" food. And, in fact, I'm buying some, because it's a heckuva lot easier to just put Hill's a/d through the syringe than it is to doctor something else to do it. There's a lot of crap going on. There's some corn in the a/d food. Go ahead and shoot me now. As for everything else as we have gone through crisis of cat not eating, he has returned my calls always, given me reassurance that has always been correct, listened to my suggestions (some of which is info garnered from Dr Internet) and so on. Seems to be pretty good. I'm not going to toss him by the wayside because I find out he declaws cats if people ask (though I would be rather surprised) or because he sells inappropriate food.

I responded to this thread because I saw the line ""How many vets would put their client's cats before MONEY?" That statement did not appear to be couched in terms of declawing; it comes up all the time in general and we've all seen that before, the sentiment that vets are out to screw us (which, if you think that, I can't figure out how you can have a pet). If you want to restrict it to declawing, the answer is still "Most of them" though I'm sure it is fewer of them overall.

[=^..^=]

Originally Posted by Miller88

Yes. The joys of a pre-civil war era house :S

We didn't allow him outside (after a few weeks, he realized we were his family and didn't want to leave). At least twice a week, there would be a mouse at the bottom of the stairs waiting for us. We'd praise him and give him turkey or cheese (poor guy had kidney failure, so anything he would eat would be good).

He only weighed 5 pounds.

I think he got rid of them, or they moved elsewhere. The Ragdoll and Snowshoe do not catch anything at their house.

Oh, those really old homes. I get that. Mice or rats seem to come with them. My Aunt in NY lived in an old toll house in the mountains. It was built in the early 1800s or late 1700s. No one knows the exact age of the house. It took them awhile to get rid of the RATS in the cellar. They needed the space to store their root crops and home-canned goods. I was too young to remember how they accomplished that. I know they had cats. They always had and still have a few cats. My cousin still lives in that old house - with her dad, now in his 90s, and two cats.

[Pamina333]

Originally Posted by greg42

I like the vet, yes. If you're saying "priceless" as in "what a hypocrite" then I can only say you have a different measure of what is a wonderful vet than I do. Otherwise, yes, it's not just priceless but critical to have a vet you can trust.
.

Oh no, meant it literally. B precisely! (Feel the same about my MD & Dentist.)

Originally Posted by greg42

The point of my remarks in this thread was to head off all this BS that some huge majority of vets are untrustworthy and only out for your money.
.

I guess it depends on location, and demographics, and who owns what in a particular area. To sum it up, I'm pretty much screwed. In our own experiences, found that it was more inexperience (and the pressure to sell) than untrustworthiness. Vets ARE in it for the love of animals, but they can't control policies when they're just getting their feet in the door.

Originally Posted by greg42

.... the sentiment that vets are out to screw us (which, if you think that, I can't figure out how you can have a pet).

Counting the days till relocating to a more progressive, less provincial area. In the meantime, no pets for the first time in 50 years but still staying on top of information for any future pets. Aside from the wonderful Veterinarians who have online resopurces (DRs Pierson, Hodgkins & their contemporaries), it's virtually impossible to sift through all the Conglomerate-Sponsored "studies" and propoganda online for the whole story/truth, so I hit the Encyclopedia & read up on everything I could absorb, regarding cats & dogs (& Ferrets).

Not just "sentiment", learned the hard way. (See above). Were spoiled with the best of the best of veterinarians for so many decades that will NEVER get over the guilt of not heeding alllll the red flags in new location. 4 dead animals to show for it. Long, drawn out (preventable) deaths. I didn't use common sense -- conditioned to trust trumped it -- so I get to live with it.

[Pamina333]

Best anecdote I can think of is this: (It's a personal anecdote, so if people take offense -- can skip it.)

Sister-in-law has gout. When she was first diagnosed, she was given medications which alleviated the symptoms, but she kept on eating gravy, drinking favorite beer and eating scallops. I tried giving her the heads-up about uric acid & that she could consider cutting out the foods which exasperate gout, and printed pages from a hospital, listing some foods/liquids.

She brushed it off and gout got worse, so she went back to DR. for stronger medication. This time, they had the printout to give her.

I gave major kudos to her Doctor & his staff, for Medical Professionals (ALL of them) have bigger fish to fry in their careers than to try to be nutrition experts, and they took the time out of their already cramped schedule to go beyond that which medical professionals study & practice.

Can't find better examples regarding the "education" factor than Diabetic cats and blocking cats being "prescribed" kibble & carb-laden foods. IMO, It IS a big deal because it's not isolated. It's so extremely common.

SiL's Doctor wouldn't be allowed to "prescribe" foods containing high uric acid content to people with Gout symptoms. No MD would. What would happen if he tried?

Goal is to defend Veterinarians, if anything. it's the policies, and conglomerates which have them by the horns, that's creating all these common health epidemics in pets -- and creating some distrust among people who look into the information whether via Encyclopedia or seeking other unbiased resources such as Veterinarians who have furthered their education/honed expertise, for the facts.

I guess someone would have to go through the experience of, or knowing people with Diabetic and/or blocked pets to relate. IMO , it IS a matter of -- if all the facts aren't available/provided, time to refer to someone/thing who has them, and will provide ALL viable options.

Drs. Elizabeth Hodgkins & Lisa Pierson should be household names! It's the reasons behind why they aren't which is the biggest issue, IMO.

[nancy thereader]

Please let me remind you that the CATS forum is a forum for Cats & the people who love and care for them. It is even a place for members to debate practices and ideas about cat care (even declawing ).

It is not, however, a place to post if you resent "cat people" and dislike them. Please refrain from posting here if you have nothing to add to the conversation.

Thank you.

[Delahanty]

Don't get me started on declawing. That said, not taking extra precautions to ensure they won't get out if they are declawed is tops in irresponsibility.