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Panapolic, I'm so glad you came back to your thread! And I read your comment on another thread here in Cats, and it helped me to further understand your situation and feelings.
PS, on further reflection I'm wondering if the "..don't want anymore" in your thread title wasn't what set some folks off from the beginning. I flinched when I read it and it was hard to get past that part.
I don't want to add to the already emotional and heated argument here.
Just want to say I am very impressed with the OP for the honesty and intelligent response.
Isn't it a good thing if we can see various perspectives? After all, this is "cat" forum, not "cat-lover" forum.
Interesting! Here in Cats, I think we often, if not always, run the two right together.
OP:
I reacted poorly to your post because it gave the impression you had no real attachment to your cats after all these years. Owners who are that disengaged are the sort who generally will put their animals down just to save money. I dunno, it made me worry for your cats, and because I'm a bit of a cat lover, I got a little on you about it. I'm sorry if I misinterpreted what you were saying.
Your response later in this thread then just mentions that you love your cats, but get frustrated sometimes over the effort caring for them can sometimes take. This more understandable because I think most pet owners experience a certain level of frustration.
For example, we are preparing to make a big move this year....all the way to Alaska. Our 7 cats are part of the family, and while only two of them are house cats, the other 5 will also need an enclosure to live in, as they have one here in our garage. It's going to be much harder finding a place to rent for our first year (we're buying after that) with these stipulations in place, but we cannot get rid of our cats because they're part of our family. It would sure be easier to move though if we had no pets lol.
For example, we are preparing to make a big move this year....all the way to Alaska. Our 7 cats are part of the family, and while only two of them are house cats, the other 5 will also need an enclosure to live in, as they have one here in our garage. It's going to be much harder finding a place to rent for our first year (we're buying after that) with these stipulations in place, but we cannot get rid of our cats because they're part of our family. It would sure be easier to move though if we had no pets lol.
OK, thanks for the understanding, and next time I'll word the title more carefully.
I do think of cats as sort of my family, but, as I wrote earlier, I've also come to understand they aren't people. This is something I think many don't understand. Of course they're living beings with needs and worthy of compassion, but at the same time I think many cats owners don't understand that we're usually more attached to them than they are to us.
If my cats were transferred to another good caretaker who also looked after their needs, they'd probably mostly forget about me in fairly short order. This is probably true for the vast majority of cats. The truth is we're probably more attached to cats than they are to us. With dogs the feelings are, if not mutual, then at least somewhat more comparable.
OK, thanks for the understanding, and next time I'll word the title more carefully.
I do think of cats as sort of my family, but, as I wrote earlier, I've also come to understand they aren't people. This is something I think many don't understand. Of course they're living beings with needs and worthy of compassion, but at the same time I think many cats owners don't understand that we're usually more attached to them than they are to us.
If my cats were transferred to another good caretaker who also looked after their needs, they'd probably mostly forget about me in fairly short order. This is probably true for the vast majority of cats. The truth is we're probably more attached to cats than they are to us. With dogs the feelings are, if not mutual, then at least somewhat more comparable.
Cats can be very loyal. Cats can also be generally loving animals who will be kind to those that show them kindness. I don't see that as bad.
One of our cats is decidedly MY cat. I am the only one in our whole family who can pick her up and handle her in any way. She is most sociable when I am the only one up and about. I think she senses the fact I'm a true blue cat lady, though. My husband loves cats now thanks to me, but previous to that he had only had dogs. This makes him more nervous in general around certain cats, whilst I have no such compunction.
One thing I don't like at all is when people think it's more okay to disregard cats and their well-being than it is to do the same to dogs. I can't help but notice that the charge of cruelty to dogs usually carries a harsher penalty for the perp than if the victim were a cat. I can't stand cruelty to animals in general.
I'm not a dog person at all, but even so, I had to put up with my husband's two poodles until they finally got so old and decrepit that my husband had them put down. I was never mean to those dogs, but boy, they got on my nerves in the worst way!
One other thing...while your cats might transfer their love to another owner if they were cared for by another, I think they'd certainly remember you if you ever paid them a future visit.
Anyway, I'm glad you will continue to care for them. My brother had two cats live until they were close to 20. He nursed them until the very end, and it tore him apart when they died. I plan to do the same for our cats as well, even if sometimes, I know it would be easier to have no pets. They pay for themselves though every time I'm feeling down and my loving cats come over to me to give love Pets give us their unconditional love, and for that, I am more than happy to pay them back with proper love and care.
but at the same time I think many cats owners don't understand that we're usually more attached to them than they are to us.
You are wrong. Cats become deeply emotionally attached to their humans (if they are treated right), and other animals in the household, include other species, not just each other. The cats brain is organized most like the human brain, of any animal, especially the emotions center. Cats grieve deeply when they lose a beloved companion, human or animal, or they lose their homes.
I do think of cats as sort of my family, but, as I wrote earlier, I've also come to understand they aren't people. This is something I think many don't understand. Of course they're living beings with needs and worthy of compassion, but at the same time I think many cats owners don't understand that we're usually more attached to them than they are to us.
If my cats were transferred to another good caretaker who also looked after their needs, they'd probably mostly forget about me in fairly short order. This is probably true for the vast majority of cats. The truth is we're probably more attached to cats than they are to us. With dogs the feelings are, if not mutual, then at least somewhat more comparable.
You know, I defended you before, and it seems my assumptions were correct. But I'm going to call you out on this, because it's not right in a number of ways.
Let's start with "they aren't people". That much is obviously true, but you're going off the rails as soon as you say this is something many don't understand. The most ardent of cat lovers understands that cats aren't people! What a ridiculous thing to say! Some people may find that they enjoy the company of cats MORE than the company of most people, perhaps. Not everyone enjoys the company of other people very much. But to suggest that any of this translates to equating cats and people is over the top.
"...we're usually more attached to them than they are to us." No, that's actually not true, although you could be forgiven for concluding this by observing some small subset of cats who are more aloof. But even the most aloof cat is very attached to its human caretaker(s). What is true is that with more aloof cats it is difficult to see notable demonstrations of this attachment. My current two cats are generally not aloof like that. They like to get into laps, be very close by all the time, are annoyed by closed doors if we are on the other side of them, etc. They know us both to be caretakers and are upset when just one of us isn't home. My earlier cat Amber was mostly not like this. She was aloof. She didn't ever sit in my lap even though she'd known me her entire life. She was more subtle with her attention, but she still enjoyed being in the same room with us. She missed us when we weren't there and was happy to see us return. These varying behaviors are not actually indicative of a cat's attachment to their human caretakers. It is simply that they have behaviors that vary.
If your cats were transferred to another good caretaker, they would most likely NOT forget about you in short order. And it is not true for the vast majority of cats. Now, younger cats are going to be more adaptable. And there are some other things we could throw into this mix. For example, cats are very routinized and they can be upset by changes in their environment. So, if you left your cats in the same home, with the same furnishings arranged the same way, and someone new was watching them, they would adjust better than a completely new home with the same new person. (This is why a pet sitter to the cats' home is a better choice than a boarding facility.) But they still would not forget quickly and would look for the original caretaker to come back. Cats have good memories, for certain things at least and in certain ways. There are cats I see once or twice a year at family homes, and they are very happy to see me each time. I don't feed them, I don't take care of them in any other way, I don't see them for months, but they remember.
Comparing to dogs. Dogs have thousands of extra years of domestication and specific breeding that guides their behaviors. The outward behavior of the average dog may appear to the average human to display a more mutual feeling of attachment than the outward behavior of the average cat. As I said, one may be forgiven for thinking this based on this casual observation. But dogs are bred specifically to have a goal of pleasing humans, not just to have predictable inoffensive behavior which is all we generally expect of cats. Cats are mostly bred by chance! Only a small portion of house cats are actually purebred and selected for behavior. Often the ones who are purebred are selected more for looks. Selective breeding of dogs goes back thousands of years. Selective breeding of cats? A few hundred or so maybe. None of this actually affects the attachments formed with the human caretakers, though. It only affects behavior. Two separate things.
I can assure you you are wrong if you think your cats aren't attached to you or would forget you in short order after all these years. Older cats would have the most trouble with a new home and new person after a long time in another home. It would disrupt routines that go back years. Which isn't to say it's impossible for them to adjust. But your contention that it would be no big deal to rehome them is wrong. It would be extremely upsetting for them.
I don't understand why can't you just drop them off at a shelter. I would never lose sleep over, or have my comfort level due to some cat. Don't forget it's your life, not the cat's,... live your life happily, if the cat is not bringing you happiness get rid of it, you don't owe any explanation to anyone, nor do you owe anything to that cat.
Well...
You have a bunch of people here who care about their animals (cats as the case may be) to actually talk about them on the internet. Some here have worked in rescue. And believe you me, people who have hearts big enough to work in rescue (which often is a volunteer job) really despise people who say things like this.
Because for an animal to live in a tiny cage for months sucks. For a loving, sweet animal to then be put to sleep because someone got over a desire to have a pet, that sucks too.
Because letting animals be born into a world where they are dependent on people and people don't care, sucks.
We (humans) changed the fundamental nature of our domestic animals. They aren't wild anymore. Because we got involved, we DO have an obligation.
And when you get a pet, you DO have an obligation. And if you don't understand that, then don't get a pet.
I very seriously believe that this concept should be like...base minimum for talking to people in the pet forum. Unless being viewed as something of a soulless monster is what you're after, or you're just here to stir people up.
You are wrong. Cats become deeply emotionally attached to their humans (if they are treated right), and other animals in the household, include other species, not just each other. The cats brain is organized most like the human brain, of any animal, especially the emotions center. Cats grieve deeply when they lose a beloved companion, human or animal, or they lose their homes.
You're making what's called anthropocentric error: You're attributing human characteristics and motivations to something that isn't human. Most cats evolved to be solitary predators; as such, specific social connections aren't as crucial as we're inclined to think.
In evident they do develop a connection with us, but as long as their basic needs of food and shelter are met, it's a connection they make with anyone who provides this. When a dog is taken in by a new owner, it usually takes at least a few weeks for it to get comfortable. With cats, the acceptance of the new owner usually only takes a few days.
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And I read your comment on another thread here in Cats, and it helped me to further understand your situation and feelings.
Pets give us their unconditional love, and for that, I am more than happy to pay them back with proper love and care.
