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Old 10-29-2010, 02:59 PM
 
Location: Summerville
7,934 posts, read 9,538,547 times
Reputation: 1262

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Quote:
Originally Posted by pvjd View Post
Being a democrat or liberal does not make you a "commie", that is what is being sold to bully people into believing that you are not American unless you are a republican or tea bagger.
Calling Americans who believe that we are Taxed Enough Already (TEA) tea baggers is better than calling liberal who want to push their socialistic agenda on us commies?
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Old 10-29-2010, 03:13 PM
 
435 posts, read 478,153 times
Reputation: 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by Techgeek View Post
You certainly have a right to your opinion. My question is why do you feel that way about this particular citizen? Is it because she, a private citizen, is exercising her Constitutionally guaranteed right to free speech or because you happen to disagree with her?

Read back over my posts for the last few days for a description of the the rights that had been violated. I don't feel like repeating myself.

What constitution are you reading? Amendment 10 says:

"The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people."

There is nothing in the Constitution about secession so it's the state's right to choose.

It would, and eventually did, require a constitutional amendment. This requires 3/4 of the states to ratify it. The North didn't have the votes.

Yes there is and the reason is, because the North won. Prior to the Civil War this was in question.

The Confederacy did leave without a war. They seceded, formed a government and began operating as their own nation. The war was fought because the Union wanted to force the Confederacy back in.
First nothing wrong with disagreement. The right to be offended is also part of our freedom. I certainly won't do business with her or try to have any association with her.

If a president allows states to seceded from the Union without doing anything, he/she will be committing treason. No president will do that even today, and we all know who fired the first shot. We were forced... blah blah blah...Do you know Japanese still believe they were forced to bomb Pearl harbor because of oil and material embargos US imposed on her.
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Old 10-29-2010, 03:20 PM
 
435 posts, read 478,153 times
Reputation: 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by OleTomCat View Post
That is the same thing you are trumpeting as the great thing the north did to the south during the war of northern aggression, now who is disregarding history?

I guess that means GOD isn't on the side of Saddam or anyone else that the US steam rolls over with it's great military might either?
Tom, hint: We haven't won in Iraq nor Afghanistan. Do you think GOD is on Saddam's side? Also, we are not really fighting with Saddam in both Iraq and Afghanistan now, aren't we. Who are we fighting? We are fighting with an ideology...and we might just run out of bullets for it.
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Old 10-29-2010, 05:28 PM
 
Location: Goose Creek, SC
870 posts, read 996,509 times
Reputation: 389
Quote:
Originally Posted by JimmyCh View Post
First nothing wrong with disagreement. The right to be offended is also part of our freedom. I certainly won't do business with her or try to have any association with her.
Fair enough, but I am disagreeing with you right now and there is a whole slew of names I could be calling you as a result but I am restraining myself in the spirit of having a reasonable debate. I guess that is the difference between people like me and people like you. I will state my opinions and support those opinions with facts. You will state your opinion and attempt to marginalize your opponent by using childish schoolyard tactics such as name calling.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JimmyCh View Post
If a president allows states to seceded from the Union without doing anything, he/she will be committing treason. No president will do that even today,
How would it be treason? Maybe if the government fails a state or group of states to the point that they feel it necessary to secede it could be reasoned that the government committed treason or something close to it but I don't see how allowing secession could be considered treason.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JimmyCh View Post
and we all know who fired the first shot. We were forced... blah blah blah...Do you know Japanese still believe they were forced to bomb Pearl harbor because of oil and material embargos US imposed on her.
Here is the difference.

Japan had been involved in a brutal war of conquest on mainland Asia for over a decade and was interfering with American trade with China. The embargoes were designed to force an end to Japanese hostilities against China. The Japanese knew that the American Pacific Fleet was the only force in the entire Ocean capable of giving them a good fight and there were American fleet positions near the routes Japan needed to use to conquer their empire (Philippines etc). Their attack on Pearl Harbor was a preemptive strike to give them time to conquer everything they wanted to conquer.

The Confederates, on the other hand, had no interest in conquering anything-especially not the Union. They had requested that Union forces leave Confederate soil and, in most cases, those requests were granted. Ft Sumter in Charleston harbor was one of only a very few cases in which the Union did not comply. The fort was virtually unassailable when fully staffed, provisioned and supplied and would have provided an excellent launching point for a Union attack on Charleston. The Confederates simply fired on a ship attempting to resupply the fort and the Union inflated that attack into a justification for war. Had the Union surrendered the fort as it had done in so many other cases, the war could have been avoided altogether.
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Old 10-29-2010, 05:59 PM
 
435 posts, read 478,153 times
Reputation: 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by Techgeek View Post
Fair enough, but I am disagreeing with you right now and there is a whole slew of names I could be calling you as a result but I am restraining myself in the spirit of having a reasonable debate. I guess that is the difference between people like me and people like you. I will state my opinions and support those opinions with facts. You will state your opinion and attempt to marginalize your opponent by using childish schoolyard tactics such as name calling.
I didn't call your name. I am not discussing the flag problem with her. I am discussing with you. Unless you are actually the flag person. I didn't even call you childish. I simply said "that makes her an @sshole." I didn't say techgeek is childish or an @sshole. So I don't get the name calling part. The house owner of the flag in question is a she fyi.

If an American president lost half of the US territory and don't start a war...you tell me it is treason or not.
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Old 10-29-2010, 08:49 PM
 
Location: Summerville
7,934 posts, read 9,538,547 times
Reputation: 1262
Quote:
Originally Posted by JimmyCh View Post
Tom, hint: We haven't won in Iraq nor Afghanistan. Do you think GOD is on Saddam's side? Also, we are not really fighting with Saddam in both Iraq and Afghanistan now, aren't we. Who are we fighting? We are fighting with an ideology...and we might just run out of bullets for it.
Never said we were fighting Saddam in both Iraq and Afghanistan, first he was never in charge of Afghanistan, second he is now dead so I think he lost....
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Old 10-29-2010, 08:53 PM
 
Location: Summerville
7,934 posts, read 9,538,547 times
Reputation: 1262
Quote:
Originally Posted by JimmyCh View Post
I didn't call your name. I am not discussing the flag problem with her. I am discussing with you. Unless you are actually the flag person. I didn't even call you childish. I simply said "that makes her an @sshole." I didn't say techgeek is childish or an @sshole. So I don't get the name calling part. The house owner of the flag in question is a she fyi.

If an American president lost half of the US territory and don't start a war...you tell me it is treason or not.
How is that treason, before the war of Northern aggression the southern states formed a separate and sovereign government and asked that all hostile troops leave it's soil, this request was not adhered to and the shots were fired...
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Old 10-29-2010, 11:13 PM
 
949 posts, read 1,782,553 times
Reputation: 633
Quote:
Originally Posted by OleTomCat View Post
Calling Americans who believe that we are Taxed Enough Already (TEA) tea baggers is better than calling liberal who want to push their socialistic agenda on us commies?
There are very few democrats or liberals who would identify themselves as being communist, and I believe most rational people understand that. I see and hear a lot of rhetoric, but it is classless to call somebody that they aren't. Our president is not a communist, nor are the people identify with and support him. That is rhetoric, and it is meant to provoke a response from voters.
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Old 10-30-2010, 01:10 AM
 
Location: Summerville
7,934 posts, read 9,538,547 times
Reputation: 1262
Quote:
Originally Posted by pvjd View Post
There are very few democrats or liberals who would identify themselves as being communist, and I believe most rational people understand that. I see and hear a lot of rhetoric, but it is classless to call somebody that they aren't. Our president is not a communist, nor are the people identify with and support him. That is rhetoric, and it is meant to provoke a response from voters.
And it is not just as classless to call a TEA party member a tea bagger?

If you actually know what it means you would think so(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tea_bag_%28sexual_act%29)....

The president's agenda is socialistic, straight out of 'The Rules for Radicals'...
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Old 10-30-2010, 09:51 AM
 
435 posts, read 478,153 times
Reputation: 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by OleTomCat View Post
How is that treason, before the war of Northern aggression the southern states formed a separate and sovereign government and asked that all hostile troops leave it's soil, this request was not adhered to and the shots were fired...
Treason is on the President if he/she does nothing. A US president who does nothing and allows half of the US states to secede is treasonous and probably committed high crime. South knew it would start a war, and yes, South was aggressive TRYING to force a peace treaty but didn't come out as planned.

Btw, you just answer your own question. Clearly, God is not on Saddam's side, but I can tell you, it might not be on ours either.
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