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Exactly Moneill. I think a lot depends on where you are in life, what your needs in life are, and what you are used to. We're not big shoppers so the lack of retail doesn't bother us - we use the bank, shop at Publix, and the use the UPS store and pharmacy. We're renting now, so lack of a hardware store doesn't bother us, but yes, that would be a missing link if we bought here.
We also use the library quite a bit, our vet is here, our dentist, our dermatologist, eye doctor, and my PCP was here until I switched (there are 2 practices on the island).
For us it's compactness of the island - this is entirely personal, but I would prefer to drive Seven Farms Dr than 17 to get to the things mentioned above we use.
Do we go off island? Sure. Not a whole lot - I like to pop into Whole Foods now and then, Homes Goods, Office Max and Barnes and Noble. And we travel to MP for our doctors and hospitals. And obviously for the beach. We're not beach-goers but like going out for a burger or something at Poes. But that's the way I grew up and lived most of my life - in a smallish "Main St America" sort of town (less than 20K in pop) and had to drive to big box stores.
We like all the events that are right here - love going to the tennis tournament or a concert at Volvo Stadium or out to dinner and having a simple 5 min drive home, in a golf cart if we want (if we had one).
And because we have a dog one of the biggest draws - other than the beauty and safety of the island - are all the interconnected walking trails. I hear all the time from parents that one of the draws was that their kid could ride their bike to school. I think that's the big draw with Park West and Carolina Park as well.
We don't have kids, so I don't know about the sports programs, but I see plenty of organized team games after school and on the weekends going on in the public park and school fields. And plenty of pick up games by the kids in all the numerous parks on the island. They will be building a new rec center, as well as a new performance center soon.
I agree, there isn't a ton of work on the island, but for the 10K population, it's not too bad. And there are condos for sale under 150K and townhouses under 250K so it's certainly possible for someone not in an executive position who saves a bit to buy and work here.
I'm not surprised you don't visit here. Daniel Island isn't really a place to visit - it's a place to live. I also agree with you about the "pockets" in a town. I think it would be nice if more subdivisions followed a similar model - don't know what you call it - that had a "cluster" of basic amenities right in the development like Seaside Farms, Park West, etc. Would cut down on traffic on 17 and I think fosters more a sense of a little community.
This is purely personal opinion, but I would rather live in Carolina Park than Tupleo because of the amenities in Carolina Park - the walking trails, the fire station, the hospital, the Publix that's just across the way at Park West. And if they eventually do retail and we could walk or have a 5 min car ride to a restaurant for dinner or a "neighborhood pub" that would be a bonus.
Different strokes for different folks. For whatever reason we are drawn to planned communities. Before we decided on the Charleston area, we looked seriously at a planned community in Chapel Hill, NC that had parks, trails, a beautiful inn and restaurant, 2 other casual restaurants, a post office, a book store, a gift shop, a little garden store, and a coffee shop/ice cream/newsstand type little convenience store where people in the community would sit and talk outside with their neighbors and a farm. It had a great sense of community. Chapel Hill is not quite as big as Mount Pleasant, but these kinds of developments have since popped up throughout the town, so they are popular with a lot of people.
Again, just us. Call it convenience, call it growing old and not seeing as well to want to drive much at night, call it liking that sense of community a planned community creates. To us it's great.
IsNull - is your statement about the North impacted more by traffic because people have to travel further on 17 to get downtown, etc.?
It's because the people in north MtP have to travel to get to anything other than a grocery store and Walmart.
There's very large, huge, sections in north MtP still open for development. The original plans were for lots of commercial space along 17 and in the areas between Park West and Carolina Park. This is where they planned for the "big box stores". I'm not sure why they thought north MtP would be good for the all big box stores. Many of these stores prefer to be near interstates.
Even without these areas developed, the road capacity is very strained. Highway 41 is at a stand still during rush hour as is Park West Blvd. Highway 41 won't even start expansion for another 5 years (if then). Park West Blvd has space (graded and cleared) for an additional set of roads but the city doesn't seem to have the appetite for putting pavement down. Many think it's just a road in a neighborhood, but it's just as busy (if not more at times) as Rifle Range. It's become a main artery for Rivertowne, Dunes West, Park West, and Carolina Park.
With the roads maxed now, there are concerns about the additional growth that will come. The schools are over full and the county just "lost" $18 million.
With that being said, residents on the north end want commercial development that makes sense. They want shopping, dining, and entertainment choices closer to home. This is one of the biggest issues Dunes West and Park West have with the Cambridge Square project. It was supposed to be a neighborhood node, meaning small amount of housing but mainly small commercial space that was walkable/bike ride-able from the homes. Instead the developer now wants to yank all the commercial out and put in high density housing. The homeowners in the area were very vocal against that.
Daniel Island is a great place. I personally find it to "ordered" and would be going off island far to much. However, I realize that many people really want that and are perfectly happy with limited choices and more "small town" living. We decided on MtP over DI because of schools, bigger home, and more choice. However the layout and pocket parks are really nice.
With that said, I don't feel anyone is buying in DI or north MtP because there's a lack of condos available. Space is a limited resource in both areas. There's a market for both condos and "tacky cookie cutter sprawl neighborhoods". You may not like condos. You may not like neighborhoods. But there is a huge market right now for both.. regardless of your personal opinion. The town needs to determine at what level they meet those demands. The Save Shem Creek folks want no more development because in areas most of their members live it's already developed. What's left is trying to squeeze higher density housing in the space that's left which they're against. The people in north MtP have more open space, but need commercial choices and tend to prefer neighborhoods. They don't want high density housing crammed into their neighborhoods either, but tend to be more flexible about condos in limited undeveloped areas. Think of it more like 40% commercial, 30% planned residential, 10% high density, and 20% green space. This puts the northern residents as somewhat allies with the Save Shem Creek crew in certain areas. But don't confuse that alliance in certain areas as a complete endorsement of Save Shem Creek.
Daniel Island is a great place. I personally find it to "ordered" and would be going off island far to much. However, I realize that many people really want that and are perfectly happy with limited choices and more "small town" living. We decided on MtP over DI because of schools, bigger home, and more choice. However the layout and pocket parks are really nice.
That's exactly my view.
From what I understand, condos are cost prohibitive for most developers & municipalities because of the legal complexities and costs. Class action suits by homeowners for everything and anything I think have made the condo not a viable product for most developers/builders.
And I agree -- the pockets left to develop in 'south' Mt. Pleasant are for the most part in very developed areas and many don't want it.
From what I understand, condos are cost prohibitive for most developers & municipalities because of the legal complexities and costs. Class action suits by homeowners for everything and anything I think have made the condo not a viable product for most developers/builders.
I'm not usually sue-happy but most of the law suits I've seen regarding local condo construction have been merited. You really had people either providing not oversight/quality control to their product at best and cutting corners to the point of ethical lapses at worse. Lots of poorly installed siding, skipping flashing details, no attention to properly installing windows, and the like. Usually the issues have not been structural or even electrical or mechanical. A lot of it comes down to cut corners or poor planning meaning a decent product was installed ineffectively.
The problem with many condos has been they were built cheaply during a boom and when you repeat a mistake 60 times across a multi family development it becomes much more apparent than in scattered houses. Also they might be inspecting entire portions of the development at once instead of each unit individually as would occur in a house. About ten years ago there were no less than three condo/townhouse complexes entering litigation that all ended up being designed/managed by one person at a local architecture firm. Flashing and detailing were not her forte.
Also there were a lot of condo conversions in the 00s where local or national apartment developers had done poor maintenance over time and simply hoisted the units on the market as condos rather than addressing whether to upgrade them or tear down and rebuild at the end of their life cycles.
If I had to sum of the politics regarding development in Mt. Pleasant it would be that the struggle stems from where the voting majority prefers higher development/density (far from downtown) vs. where city planning experts and developers believe it makes the most sense to develop higher density (near downtown).
Is Null - What is the status of the Cambridge Square Project now.
Too bad - the change in plans - sounds like it would have been a nice little "node" for the North End.
Don't know what the plans looked like, but it's too bad someone doesn't build a nice little sort of place like Freshfields Village with shops, restaurants, green space for outdoor concerts, farmers markets and other events, services, etc. in North MP.
With all the beautiful architecture and charm in the Charleston area, you'd think there would be more of these types of "village center" types of places built instead of just more strip malls. I know strip malls are popular, but just MHO, I think a place like Freshfields Village is way more attractive than a strip mall and much more of a gathering spot/commerce "center".
Is Null - What is the status of the Cambridge Square Project now.
The Park West Development Company has filed a request with the Town to rezone the commercial area of Cambridge Square into R3 townhouses. This request will add 43 townhouses around the Greymarsh and Park West Blvd area. It seems that he didn't get his plan approved holistically so now he's trying to piece mill it in.
The Park West Development Company has filed a request with the Town to rezone the commercial area of Cambridge Square into R3 townhouses. This request will add 43 townhouses around the Greymarsh and Park West Blvd area. It seems that he didn't get his plan approved holistically so now he's trying to piece mill it in.
I'm guessing it's because residential demand far exceeds commercial demand in this part of town. Cambridge Square has a lot competition from Carolina Park, Oakland, and those random commercial lots for sale right on 17. The developer was probably tired of sitting on commercial property.
I'm guessing it's because residential demand far exceeds commercial demand in this part of town. Cambridge Square has a lot competition from Carolina Park, Oakland, and those random commercial lots for sale right on 17. The developer was probably tired of sitting on commercial property.
The developer sold the property. The owners were foreclosed on and the property is now owned by the bank. The original developer now wants a second dip.
The homeowners in the area really don't care what the current demand is as there are other areas for town homes. This was zoned as a neighborhood node for light commercial use. They'd rather see it stay that way. They feel it was originally designed and sold as a planned community with commercial areas mixed in. To try to change that now is akin to bait and switch. They simply don't want to give up the future prospect of light commercial space so the developer can cram more town homes.
In addition, the areas where they've found an inch or two to put in town homes, the build/design quality DR Horton as been pushing out has left a very unfavorable taste in the community's mouth.
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