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Old 08-29-2014, 07:40 AM
 
Location: Macao
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Where do you see Charleston WV in 30 years?

I'm not living there, but it seems like the city has enough beauty, and an interesting location, to grow and be way more than it currently is.

Maybe it's fine as is, but it seems quite small for the capital of a state. With it's natural resources in beauty, doesn't seem like it's just a matter of time, before it becomes 'discovered' much like an Austin, capital of Texas? Or Madison for Wisconsin?

Or is most of the momentum for that moving more towards Morgantown?
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Old 08-29-2014, 08:12 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Tiger Beer View Post
Where do you see Charleston WV in 30 years?

I'm not living there, but it seems like the city has enough beauty, and an interesting location, to grow and be way more than it currently is.

Maybe it's fine as is, but it seems quite small for the capital of a state. With it's natural resources in beauty, doesn't seem like it's just a matter of time, before it becomes 'discovered' much like an Austin, capital of Texas? Or Madison for Wisconsin?

Or is most of the momentum for that moving more towards Morgantown?
Austin and Madison is like if one would combine Charleston and Morgantown (capital and site of a large university). That's the thing that Charleston is lacking - connection with higher learning. Currently, there's the University of Charleston (small, private) and West Virginia State University, several miles out of town and not very big either.

In terms of business mix, education, built environment, etc., the three candidates for large growth or transformation would be Morgantown, Charleston, and Huntington.

Morgantown is leading the way with WVU and proximity to Pittsburgh and the gas fields, but the historical urban core is basically built-out, unless we start to see a lot more high density developments. The topography somewhat disjoints the town, and the actual city borders and corresponding population numbers don't accurately convey the amount of people in town. In short, it was a town built for 15-20,000 max, but now it's over 30,000 with thousands extra as students at WVU. It's a vibrant place, but feels constrained. But make no mistake, it's going to grow for a while to come.

Huntington is a bit different. It has a mid-major (I'm saying that in terms of student population - about 10,000 on the main campus) college in Marshall University, and it has a lot of space and some vacant properties. It's pretty flat and has wide streets, and while it ranks very low in terms of health, I don't understand why. The parks are phenomenal and there are plenty of amenities that enhance the livability of the city. Much of the old manufacturing economy is gone, but the economy and population have both bottomed out in the past and it's starting to grow again. It's somewhat close (about 2-2.5 hours) to Columbus, Dayton, Cincinnati, and Louisville, but not enough to feed off those urban centers.

Charleston, like I said, has a dearth of higher education and a nominal young professional/millennial population. They're making strides, though, so I'll give them that. It is the capital city and the home to a few HQs and is the financial capital of the state as well. It is definitely the densest in terms of built environment, but not many people actually live downtown. To actually answer your question, I see Charleston as a revived city that made great strides to build off its natural assets and was successful at attracting the younger generations (like myself) back to town. I mean, you get the luxury of being able to live in a city with mountain biking only a couple miles away. I'd love to see it take off and reach 100,000 in 30 years (that's fairly ambitious, obviously).

I don't know where you're from, but I like to compare WV to TN. On a smaller scale, Morgantown would be Knoxville, Huntington would be Chattanooga, and Charleston would be Nashville.
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Old 08-29-2014, 09:10 AM
 
Location: Winfield, WV
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Hey Tiger Beer, thanks for stopping buy. I always enjoy reading your posts. From what I've read you are quite a traveller.

Back to topic, Charleston has plenty of natural beauty and resources, but it will struggle to grow in the future without something major changing. The world is becoming more urban and people not only what to live in big cities, they also want to live in proximity to other large cities. And this is where Charleston's relative isolation may hold it back more than comparable cities such as Asheville, Chatanooga, or even Roanoke.
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Old 08-29-2014, 09:37 AM
 
Location: Macao
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Originally Posted by elewis7 View Post
Austin and Madison is like if one would combine Charleston and Morgantown (capital and site of a large university). That's the thing that Charleston is lacking - connection with higher learning. Currently, there's the University of Charleston (small, private) and West Virginia State University, several miles out of town and not very big either.

In terms of business mix, education, built environment, etc., the three candidates for large growth or transformation would be Morgantown, Charleston, and Huntington.

Morgantown is leading the way with WVU and proximity to Pittsburgh and the gas fields, but the historical urban core is basically built-out, unless we start to see a lot more high density developments. The topography somewhat disjoints the town, and the actual city borders and corresponding population numbers don't accurately convey the amount of people in town. In short, it was a town built for 15-20,000 max, but now it's over 30,000 with thousands extra as students at WVU. It's a vibrant place, but feels constrained. But make no mistake, it's going to grow for a while to come.

Huntington is a bit different. It has a mid-major (I'm saying that in terms of student population - about 10,000 on the main campus) college in Marshall University, and it has a lot of space and some vacant properties. It's pretty flat and has wide streets, and while it ranks very low in terms of health, I don't understand why. The parks are phenomenal and there are plenty of amenities that enhance the livability of the city. Much of the old manufacturing economy is gone, but the economy and population have both bottomed out in the past and it's starting to grow again. It's somewhat close (about 2-2.5 hours) to Columbus, Dayton, Cincinnati, and Louisville, but not enough to feed off those urban centers.

Charleston, like I said, has a dearth of higher education and a nominal young professional/millennial population. They're making strides, though, so I'll give them that. It is the capital city and the home to a few HQs and is the financial capital of the state as well. It is definitely the densest in terms of built environment, but not many people actually live downtown. To actually answer your question, I see Charleston as a revived city that made great strides to build off its natural assets and was successful at attracting the younger generations (like myself) back to town. I mean, you get the luxury of being able to live in a city with mountain biking only a couple miles away. I'd love to see it take off and reach 100,000 in 30 years (that's fairly ambitious, obviously).

I don't know where you're from, but I like to compare WV to TN. On a smaller scale, Morgantown would be Knoxville, Huntington would be Chattanooga, and Charleston would be Nashville.
Morgantown, interesting, yeah, built-out. That means it'll turn into sprawl, I'd imagine. Unless somehow they can decide to mimic Pittsburgh in some way, but I think the current generation is more into the sprawl. Built-out, is a good description to help me understand it better.

Huntington sounds very midwestern, if so flat like that. I've never been that interested in flat cities, as much as the beautiful ones with hills.

Charleston, you've described that well for me. I could see that, the lack of higher education is a serious draw. I guess that is what REALLY makes most cities. You really need those young people coming in, taking a part of the city, and deciding to grow roots. Without that, it's hard to attract them in the first place. Maybe that will continue to be a major struggle with Charleston.

Although the biking culture sounds great, without all the traffic! I'll have to get back and check out Charleston again sometime.
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Old 08-29-2014, 09:40 AM
 
Location: Macao
16,265 posts, read 43,058,695 times
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Originally Posted by Silkdashocker View Post
Hey Tiger Beer, thanks for stopping buy. I always enjoy reading your posts. From what I've read you are quite a traveller.

Back to topic, Charleston has plenty of natural beauty and resources, but it will struggle to grow in the future without something major changing. The world is becoming more urban and people not only what to live in big cities, they also want to live in proximity to other large cities. And this is where Charleston's relative isolation may hold it back more than comparable cities such as Asheville, Chatanooga, or even Roanoke.
Thanks for the great compliment! I always enjoy the West Virginia forums, even if I don't drop by that often. I do like the region.

The urban attraction, does seem like something Charleston COULD potentially give, right? But yeah, proximity to other cities is a major drawback. I think whenever I do interested in the possibility of Charleson, I realize that how small it is, and just how far it is to anything that is sizeable, probably are two factors that always put some other place slightly more above it.

Even just mentioning Asheville...yep, that is a bit isolated, but the size really makes up for it. I mean, the size comparative to Charleston.
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Old 08-29-2014, 09:50 AM
 
Location: ADK via WV
6,019 posts, read 9,021,711 times
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Good scenario: In 30 years Charleston will have made a successful and complete turn in economic direction with capitalizing in proximity to recreation, growth in healthcare/education/and government, and the revival of research and chemical industry (which is very possible with appropriate leadership). Also clean coal (with right leadership) will be a factor and exporting it internationally will keep jobs here. The population might rebound to 85,000 and almost 400,000 in the metro. Urban living will drive renaissance in downtown, east end, and west side (which is already happening now). This success will be matched with growth in Huntington as well, as the two metros combine into one. Downtown will look completely different from a street perspective, plus the addition of some larger modern buildings (probably residential, with maybe one or two commercial). There will be an extensive trail network that links up the whole valley and extends north to Sutton lake, South to the New River Gorge, and West to Huntington. The city might even feature an amusement park by then (near Dog track).

Bad scenario: In 30 years Charleston will be the same size and coal would be non-existent. The only thing propping up the city is the state government, and even then the city is a pathetic excuse for a city. The population will be 40,000 and the metro shrink to 170,000. Huntington would suck all of that potential growth here into its growth and would become the main city for the state economically.
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Old 08-29-2014, 10:07 AM
 
1,642 posts, read 2,412,159 times
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Originally Posted by Tiger Beer View Post
Morgantown, interesting, yeah, built-out. That means it'll turn into sprawl, I'd imagine. Unless somehow they can decide to mimic Pittsburgh in some way, but I think the current generation is more into the sprawl. Built-out, is a good description to help me understand it better.

Huntington sounds very midwestern, if so flat like that. I've never been that interested in flat cities, as much as the beautiful ones with hills.

Charleston, you've described that well for me. I could see that, the lack of higher education is a serious draw. I guess that is what REALLY makes most cities. You really need those young people coming in, taking a part of the city, and deciding to grow roots. Without that, it's hard to attract them in the first place. Maybe that will continue to be a major struggle with Charleston.

Although the biking culture sounds great, without all the traffic! I'll have to get back and check out Charleston again sometime.
I wouldn't totally term Morgantown as sprawlly. Yes, a lot of commercial development is geared towards the outskirts of town, but the topography helps to facilitate density. When I say the urban core, I mean around High Street and the downtown campus. The Evansdale campus, while not downtown, is compact enough to where I wouldn't term it sprawl.

Huntington is kind of midwestern, yes. The city itself is flat, but that's because it's in a bottom by the Ohio River. It is bounded by hills/mountains to the south, the river to the north, and more hills and mountains in Ohio just past that. Topographically, it's similar to Charleston, with tons of recreation and wilderness right next door.

And as far as biking, it's plodding along in terms of growing the culture. Morgantown has a good bit, especially with the awesome rail trails, but riding in town can be dangerous or even just daunting, due to the hills, curves, and traffic. Commuting is easy in Huntington and Charleston as the cities are flat with undercapacity roads. Both cities are expanding bike/ped paths and routes (Huntington's Paul Ambrose Trail for Health, PATH, for instance), and Huntington actually has the only dedicated (though unprotected) bike lanes in the state on 4th Ave.

And you're always welcome in WV! If you check out Charleston, definitely check out Huntington, too. I was surprised by the quality of the town when I moved there, and I only continue to love it more.
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Old 08-31-2014, 11:43 PM
 
Location: Nashville, TN
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Without a boost in Charleston's economy (jobs) and investment in infrastructure, I don't see much changing in 30 years. Charleston is the best thing West Virginia's got going for it, and even that's not saying much. Charleston is limited by the state government and lack of direction. It is a beautiful city with good neighborhoods, but it's not growing for a reason. Charleston, like Huntington, needs to tap into it's tourism/recreation vibe to bring in more visitors the way it's larger Southern cousins Asheville and Chattanooga have done for years.
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Old 09-01-2014, 12:24 AM
 
10,147 posts, read 15,002,875 times
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Originally Posted by Tiger Beer View Post
Morgantown, interesting, yeah, built-out. That means it'll turn into sprawl, I'd imagine. Unless somehow they can decide to mimic Pittsburgh in some way, but I think the current generation is more into the sprawl. Built-out, is a good description to help me understand it better.

Huntington sounds very midwestern, if so flat like that. I've never been that interested in flat cities, as much as the beautiful ones with hills.

Charleston, you've described that well for me. I could see that, the lack of higher education is a serious draw. I guess that is what REALLY makes most cities. You really need those young people coming in, taking a part of the city, and deciding to grow roots. Without that, it's hard to attract them in the first place. Maybe that will continue to be a major struggle with Charleston.

Although the biking culture sounds great, without all the traffic! I'll have to get back and check out Charleston again sometime.
One thing about Morgantown. There are more folks and development here outside of the city limits, but that doesn't seem to bother those within the city. As was pointed out, the city limits area is constrained with 32,000 "permanent" residents and another 25,000 transient students most of the year, although during the summer months that student population drops to 10,000. The city proper almost does not seek to develop itself on purpose, wanting to retain its essential college town character. More than once high rise developments have been rejected by the city government... something that definitely wouldn't happen any place else in our state. Outside of the city limits though, things are literally booming with development at every turn. I would not call it urban sprawl. Actually, as pointed out previously our city's topography does not lend itself to that. It is a somewhat disjointed development with lots of green space in between, but it works fine for those of us living here. We have all the ingredients in place for continued growth and prosperity... excellent anchor employers and a highly educated, youthful population, awesome outdoor venues nearby, and all the arts and entertainment being near a major national university brings about. Our proximity to Pittsburgh also works to our advantage.

I agree with your observations about Charleston. It does have lots of natural beauty, and having the state capital located there helps insulate it from economic downturns that otherwise might take place. It also has a strong industrial component in terms of the chemical industry. As silk pointed out, isolation is a detriment there, but I believe it can and will grow again, especially if more industrial facilities can be brought into town. At one point in time, it was literally a chemical powerhouse and it easily could be one again if more businesses relocate to America instead of seeking cheap wage countries. There are tons of talented people in Charleston. A way needs to be found to make proper use of them.
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Old 09-01-2014, 12:31 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Shakeesha View Post
Without a boost in Charleston's economy (jobs) and investment in infrastructure, I don't see much changing in 30 years. Charleston is the best thing West Virginia's got going for it, and even that's not saying much. Charleston is limited by the state government and lack of direction. It is a beautiful city with good neighborhoods, but it's not growing for a reason. Charleston, like Huntington, needs to tap into it's tourism/recreation vibe to bring in more visitors the way it's larger Southern cousins Asheville and Chattanooga have done for years.
Well, obviously many West Virginians are going to disagree with your contention that Charleston is the best thing our state has going for it, and that "that isn't saying much", but I certainly don't disagree with the rest of your statement. West Virginia has plenty of great things going for it, and economically the shale gas developments can offer great potential for the future. We don't have any big cities here, that's true, but I'm not sure we want them. Having a state comprised of small cities and towns has worked just fine for us for 150 years. And, many West Virginians live near large cities where they can enjoy the benefits of them without the obvious negatives associated with them. I would take living just about any place in this state as opposed to living in Charlotte or Louisville.

To answer the question at hand, I see a resurgence of manufacturing in Charleston within the next 30 years and a return to the prosperity of past decades.
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