Sad rumor. Why no media coverage? (Charlotte: crime, high school, floor)

[Feltdesigner]

Teachers can't stop kids from bullying each other. Schools are too big and there are too many opportunities in a day where teachers aren't present.

[vmaxnc]

Originally Posted by coped

I'd rather my kid get beat up than deal with the consequences of a criminal record. You have no idea how stringent school rules are these days about that stuff.

You hit first, you started the fight, bottom line. Hitting back in self defense is OK. But in no way is it ever advisable to hit first.

I'm an adult and will do whatever I can to protect myself, and deal with the circumstances later. As the phrase goes, I would rather be judged by 12 than carried by 6. I understand that a younger person may not be able to make the distinction between imminent threat and an annoying schoolmate, but it only takes one blow to incapacitate a person, and then that person can't defend themself.

As for not striking first, ever, we must agree to disagree.

Originally Posted by chuckles34

With all due respect, this is part of the problem. A lawsuit should not be a primary consideration for 90% of what goes on in life, but here it's the first thing many people think of. Kid killed himself, someone must be to blame, bring on the lawyers. Jam up the courts, cost the taxpayers a bunch of money, solve nothing.

Or, I'm no lawyer, but how about: 12 year old kills himself, father sees evidence of a pattern of abuse documented on Facebook. Knows he spoke to the school guidance conselor on several occasions asking that the bullying be addressed, it gets worse and the worst happens. Father hires a lawyer who does some investigating. Asks questions at the school or wherever, finds enough kids to come forward and testify that two students in particular repeatedly harrassed the boy and were never punished. Father sues the kids, the school, don't ask me on what grounds, (wrongful death) and suddenly the school, CMS, the state, etc. develop policies to prevent and address bullying. If it saved the life (or self-esteem) of one child, I'd say it was worth it.

If the father knew about this for a while before the suicide, who will be suing him for allowing the bullying to continue? Why didn't he follow up until it stopped? The parent is the final word on taking care of their own children.

Bullying isn't new, it has happened everywhere since kids first began being around each other. How many laws can be enacted to stop it? Who pays for that? We've taken away much of the ability to punish kids, so what will be used to deter the bullying?

Why did the father not recognize that his son was suicidal? The kid didn't go from being happy to suicidal overnight.

Originally Posted by Charlotteborn

Chuckles - are you saying the father knew the son was being bullied, had gone to the school and nothing was done? I hope this is not the case because my heart absolutely breaks for this boy if adults KNEW (his teachers, his father, his principal) he was being bullied and they did nothing. I cannot imagine the pain this young man must have been in.

As I said before, I do believe teachers, principals, parents and kids know kids that are being bullied and they ALLOW it to happen. (If the bullying continues the adults didn't do their job!) If I had found out my son ever bullied someone I would have tanned his hide. There needs to be strict no-bullying policies in place.

Yes, I have no doubt many adults knew about it, and the other bullying that takes place everywhere, all day. It's seldom an issue unless it goes too far.

Maybe tanned hides are what is missing from modern education. Whatever is in place now obviously isn't working very well.

Originally Posted by Feltdesigner

Teachers can't stop kids from bullying each other. Schools are too big and there are too many opportunities in a day where teachers aren't present.

Agreed.

[anifani821]

After having written several articles on bullying and researching the topic since 2006 . . . it is my opinion that peer-to-peer intervention is the most successful. Yes, parents can notice what is going on, especially with their own child's mental health and status . . . Yes, teachers and school administrators should have policies wh/ they actively enforce . . . Yes, the community should step up if anyone sees bullying taking place . . . but the bottom line is: kids who band together and refuse to allow their peers to become the targets of bullies are the most effective way of handling bullying - at least, initially.

As MSM said earlier . . . the problem typically starts at home. Some bullies feel no empathy. Others are abused at home and seek to overpower others. There is no one profile of a bully.

And bullies are not limited to the classroom and playgrounds. There are bullies in the workplace, too - and there are few methods for handling them . . . but that's another discussion for another day, I would suppose.

I don't have children in school any longer so have no reason to know anything about a matter being kept quiet in the school - and don't feel it is proper to ask a neighbor about it. I hate to think about a child resorting to suicide at this young age and I hope if bullying had anything to do with it, parents will band together to find out exactly what went on and address it with their own children.

[msm_teacher]

Originally Posted by anifani821

After having written several articles on bullying and researching the topic since 2006 . . . it is my opinion that peer-to-peer intervention is the most successful. Yes, parents can notice what is going on, especially with their own child's mental health and status . . . Yes, teachers and school administrators should have policies wh/ they actively enforce . . . Yes, the community should step up if anyone sees bullying taking place . . . but the bottom line is: kids who band together and refuse to allow their peers to become the targets of bullies are the most effective way of handling bullying - at least, initially.

As MSM said earlier . . . the problem typically starts at home. Some bullies feel no empathy. Others are abused at home and seek to overpower others. There is no one profile of a bully.

And bullies are not limited to the classroom and playgrounds. There are bullies in the workplace, too - and there are few methods for handling them . . . but that's another discussion for another day, I would suppose.

I don't have children in school any longer so have no reason to know anything about a matter being kept quiet in the school - and don't feel it is proper to ask a neighbor about it. I hate to think about a child resorting to suicide at this young age and I hope if bullying had anything to do with it, parents will band together to find out exactly what went on and address it with their own children.

Well said!

Add into the mix the children who cry "bully" whenever they don't get their way or who truly just do not understand peer interaction and misinterprete peers behavior, and sorting out the situation gets even messier. Sometimes the child just isn't wired in a way to "fit" societies norm and ends up a bully, bullied or both. There are supports available for those to learn better behaviors, but too often you have to have money or really good insurance to access those resources.

Back to parents - much does lead back to the parents, either through bad examples or lack of good examples. For instance, my husband and I disagree in front of our kids and then go on to work it out - providing examples of listening, empathy, and consideration for the other's view point. Usually (not always) my own kids use those techniques to work out differences with their friends. So far, we've been spared the teen girl drama that so many others seem to struggle with.

I am astounded how often I see other parents yell at each other or say inappropriate things in front of their kids. That is what the kids learn!

[CharlotteGal]

Originally Posted by vmaxnc

Back then kids weren't ... killing themselves over being bullied. Stuff like that was often handled as my situation was, or "down by the lake at 3 o'clock". People handled their own business, and kids were tougher.

Not quite. Here's just one article that cites some research about the long-term effects of bullying:
What Happens Over Time To Those Who Bully And Those Who Are Victimized? | Education.com And no, it's not a peer-reviewed published article, but the research it cites includes those sources.

There are many others, and lots and lots of stories from adults who were severely negatively affected by bullying. I have no doubt quite a few suicides "back then" were from bullying but 1) Suicide was seen as so shameful, you didn't hear what really happened 2) Fewer people talked openly about their feelings - especially when they were surrounded by b.s. like the solution to bullying is to "toughen up".

Still today, some grown men have a hard time admitting how damaged they were by bullying; the discussion that's been opening up for the past few years can help heal some of that.

[Charlotteborn]

If what I am reading turns out to be correct this boy was 12 years old. His mother was dead and he was being bullied by at least 2 kids at his school. Not sure how much 'peer to peer' intervention took place although I am sure other kids knew he was being bullied.... At 12 years old I think the responsibility lies with the adults. IF the father, teachers and principal knew that this young man was being bullied I am terribly sad that the two perpetrators were not dealt with.

[vmaxnc]

Obviously we know few facts. Does anyone know the extent of the bullying? Life deals crappy hands to a lot of us, if only for a short time, but few of us go so far as to kill ourselves. I suspect there is a lot more to the mental state of the kid than has been said.

[anifani821]

Just want to throw this out there . . . my research has convinced me that the "old school" bullying that many of us recognize as bullying - the physical stuff - is only part of the problem.

The bigger problem may be cyber bullying.

Teachers can address what they see as far as some kid bashing another kid in the head with a book. Often, tho, no one has a clue what a child is enduring with text messages, chatrooms, FB, etc.

[GCharlotte]

Originally Posted by southbound_295

It's a sad scenario, chuckles. If it happened at school or a library, etc., it would be public property. The media would be all over it, but could not legally use the child's name without permission.

The reason that Zara Baker's name went public is that she was reported missing.

As long as this happened in the child's home & it checked out as a legitimate suicide, it's a private matter. Now, if the father chose to sue the school, it would become public. It's a very fine line.

That might be true. Suicide at school would be extraordinary but the media generally won't cover suicides because of fear of copycats. There's nothing stopping them besides that not that it is private. Death certificates are public and as long as you quote that you can't be sued.

[GCharlotte]

Originally Posted by vmaxnc

Yeah, it's probably better for your kid to get beat up, when it could have been avoided.

isn't it great that our schools continue to operate on prison rules.