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Since you have fancied yourself as someone providing a financial analysis (go, no go) that proves the Panthers should receive $194M, let's look at it like a corporate manager would.
With a salary base of the team and organization, the state receives over $10m in state income taxes annually.
Is this an assumption? You realized that for every player that is not a resident of NC, taxes paid to another state are deducted from NC. What about deductions, tax shelters, etc.?
Looking at just that portion two different ways provides a present value of the cash stream over 15 years at $100m.
See 1. Please provide an official statement from the NC Dept. of Revenue the state is receiving this stream from the Panthers.
this project would be approved in a business setting
Not with the "due diligence" you have provided here. You have not proved your figures. (See 1) If this were a real corporation they would want to see the actuals, and barring that, a list of assumptions you used to create them.
Comparison to MetLife.
MetLife qualified for a state incentive grant. The Panthers failed to meet the qualifications for the same grant. (which was where they went for the money). You can bet the due diligence was done there.
Again, the deals are not drastically different but you want a referendum on one and not the other, makes no sense.
You have this one completely wrong. The Referendum was for a new local sales tax. A sales tax wasn't requested for MetLife.
Do nothing, we will have no team, an empty stadium with little property taxes collected
Again incorrect. The city/county currently collects no property taxes on the land. The owner of the stadium owes the property tax whether the Panthers play here or not. If Richardson abandons the site, the county condemns it and sells it off. From a tax situation, the city/county comes out ahead. This land will not sit unused. Finally, Richardson has not made the money a condition for staying. He was clear about this.
I find that what you have presented doesn't meet any definition of proper due diligence at all. It's full of mistakes, unverifiable assumptions, and doesn't address the issue at hand. A corporation would not accept this from a college hire.
Since you have fancied yourself as someone providing a financial analysis (go, no go) that proves the Panthers should receive $194M, let's look at it like a corporate manager would.
[list=1][*]With a salary base of the team and organization, the state receives over $10m in state income taxes annually.
Is this an assumption? You realized that for every player that is not a resident of NC, taxes paid to another state are deducted from NC. What about deductions, tax shelters, etc.? [*]Looking at just that portion two different ways provides a present value of the cash stream over 15 years at $100m.
See 1. Please provide an official statement from the NC Dept. of Revenue the state is receiving this stream from the Panthers. [*]this project would be approved in a business setting
Not with the "due diligence" you have provided here. You have not proved your figures. (See 1) If this were a real corporation they would want to see the actuals, and barring that, a list of assumptions you used to create them. [*]Comparison to MetLife.
MetLife qualified for a state incentive grant. The Panthers failed to meet the qualifications for the same grant. (which was where they went for the money). You can bet the due diligence was done there. [*]Again, the deals are not drastically different but you want a referendum on one and not
the other, makes no sense.
You have this one completely wrong. The Referendum was for a new local sales tax. A sales tax wasn't requested for MetLife. [*]Do nothing, we will have no team, an empty stadium with little property taxes collected
Again incorrect. The city/county currently collects no property taxes on the land. The owner of the stadium
owes the property tax whether the Panthers play here or not. If Richardson abandons the site, the county
condemns it and sells it off. From a tax situation, the city/county comes out ahead. This land will not sit
unused. Finally, Richardson has not made the money a condition for staying. He was clear abo
I find that what you have presented doesn't meet any definition of proper due diligence at all. It's full of mistakes, unverifiable assumptions, and doesn't address the issue at hand. A corporation would not accept this from a college hire.
LOL, you are not qualified to render a judgement.
Your optimism on the Stadium is naive. You also pay taxes on the structure. In this case, it is an income generating structure where the value is inlarge part determined by income streams. If the team does not play there, no Income is generated and the stadium would have little value. It is highly unlikely that a developer would take on this site instead of other surface sites that are easy to develop. If you think this site has a quick turnaround, you are looking at it to justify opposition to assistance. This stadium would sit empty for a decade at a minimum.
Your optimism on the Stadium is naive. You also pay taxes on the structure. In this case, it is an income generating structure where the value is inlarge part determined by income streams. If the team does not play there, no Income is generated and the stadium would have little value. It is highly unlikely that a developer would take on this site instead of other surface sites that are easy to develop. If you think this site has a quick turnaround, you are looking at it to justify opposition to assistance. This stadium would sit empty for a decade at a minimum.
If the Panthers left the stadium would sit empty and in 5 to 10 years they would vote to have it torn down and rebuilt with a dome to try and whoo a new team just like St. Loius did after they lost the Cardinals.
If the Panthers left the stadium would sit empty and in 5 to 10 years they would vote to have it torn down and rebuilt with a dome to try and whoo a new team just like St. Loius did after they lost the Cardinals.
It's always no until they go...
With a cost of 1.5b or more. Yet another reason that referendums make no sense. We can keep a team for 1/5 of that amount. But, because folks want to pigeon hole government and don't understand the financial implications, we are placed in these situations. Yet, the same folks try rendering judgement of what is relevant and material. In essence, they are trying to throw out material item in the analysis because it is right. And because it is right, their arguments don't work.
Anyway, pointlss talking about this with folks who don't understand. In the end, I don't think McCrory wants to be the governor who watches a team leave for LA. Richardson is being patient at this point but, if he state is not willing to use $65m, his patience will dry up especially if he is offered a price tag north of a billion.
WSOCtv flat stated, they were more than able to finance the stadium upgrades without tax money.
If tax money is going to be spent, there are certainly people with real needs & hardships and better uses for this money than spending it on this bunch of spoilt multi-millionaires. The state absolutely made the right call.
WSOCtv flat stated, they were more than able to finance the stadium upgrades without tax money.
If tax money is going to be spent, there are certainly people with real needs & hardships and better uses for this money than spending it on this bunch of spoilt multi-millionaires. The state absolutely made the right call.
What is a "spoilt" millionaire? No, the state has not made the right call. This has nothing to do with the Panthers books. It is about the most popular sport in America and a limited supple of teams. If you want to retain one, you pay for it somehow.
As for financial analysis, I was a little off on my earlier estimates, they were actually low. See, the NFL raises the salary cap each year which means more tax revenue to the state. So, the present value of the cash flow is more than the $100m I quoted. And, if you believe WSOC, look on the player salary line, is is over $100m and will rise again this year. Now, since you like to be critical, run the present value of that number with a 10% annual increase for 15 years. If that number if larger than the $65m that the state has denied, then you should make the investments.
FYI, due diligence typically comes after a merger to ensure the books are what was represented in the sales price. You erronously used that term when trying unsuccessfully to discect my numbers. It was a nice try but, my math and assumptions are correct.
Interesting that folks talk about this and gloss over Met Life, do you think Met Life is hurting? So, again, another reason not to have a referendum. With WSOC's report, the public is poisoned against rational thinking. Instead, we get the "government should only do this....." garbage.
WSOCtv flat stated, they were more than able to finance the stadium upgrades without tax money.
If tax money is going to be spent, there are certainly people with real needs & hardships and better uses for this money than spending it on this bunch of spoilt multi-millionaires. The state absolutely made the right call.
After hearing about these facts I have to say that my opinion is swaying.
The unfortunate part is that I *really* enjoy having the Panthers here, and there are certainly a number of cities out there that would pay much more than 125MM to have the Panthers in their city.
^I think the bigger question is who needs who here. Apparently Richardson and his crew are raking in the money in Charlotte. Rolling in dough. Why would they even think about giving that up by leaving Charlotte. It would be killing the goose that was laying the golden eggs.
Since you have fancied yourself as someone providing a financial analysis (go, no go) that proves the Panthers should receive $194M, let's look at it like a corporate manager would.
With a salary base of the team and organization, the state receives over $10m in state income taxes annually.
Is this an assumption? You realized that for every player that is not a resident of NC, taxes paid to another state are deducted from NC. What about deductions, tax shelters, etc.?
Looking at just that portion two different ways provides a present value of the cash stream over 15 years at $100m.
See 1. Please provide an official statement from the NC Dept. of Revenue the state is receiving this stream from the Panthers.
this project would be approved in a business setting
Not with the "due diligence" you have provided here. You have not proved your figures. (See 1) If this were a real corporation they would want to see the actuals, and barring that, a list of assumptions you used to create them.
Comparison to MetLife.
MetLife qualified for a state incentive grant. The Panthers failed to meet the qualifications for the same grant. (which was where they went for the money). You can bet the due diligence was done there.
Again, the deals are not drastically different but you want a referendum on one and not the other, makes no sense.
You have this one completely wrong. The Referendum was for a new local sales tax. A sales tax wasn't requested for MetLife.
Do nothing, we will have no team, an empty stadium with little property taxes collected
Again incorrect. The city/county currently collects no property taxes on the land. The owner of the stadium owes the property tax whether the Panthers play here or not. If Richardson abandons the site, the county condemns it and sells it off. From a tax situation, the city/county comes out ahead. This land will not sit unused. Finally, Richardson has not made the money a condition for staying. He was clear about this.
I find that what you have presented doesn't meet any definition of proper due diligence at all. It's full of mistakes, unverifiable assumptions, and doesn't address the issue at hand. A corporation would not accept this from a college hire.
Your response to #6 is so interesting. I would love to know how a developer will pass over vacant lots in Charlotte to tackle demolishing a stadium just to get the site ready. In no scenario over the next decade or two would that make sense. To make those numbers work, the project would have to be dense enough to support the site prep on top of the structures. You are in a dream world if this makes any sense. I can think of 100 sites that would develop before tearing down a stadium.
Again, your use of due diligence is incorrect. In short, my numbers are not 100% accurate but, they are in the 95% range which is more than enough to show that the state is getting a deal by this contribution.
As for Richardson, he has said that when he dies, the team will be sold. If this stadium is not renovated, the enterprise value of the Panthers could rise 50% with a move to LA. So, for a new buyer not tied to Charlotte, this is an easy decision. You can stay here with a state government that will not provide $65m or you can move to the nation's second largest market and in a state where the 49ers are moving into a $1b stadium financed in part by the city.
^I think the bigger question is who needs who here. Apparently Richardson and his crew are raking in the money in Charlotte. Rolling in dough. Why would they even think about giving that up by leaving Charlotte. It would be killing the goose that was laying the golden eggs.
IMO, he needs CLT more than he is implying.
LOL, lets look at the numbers...............Charlotte has a little above 2m residents. The market area around Charlotte approaches 5m. LA's market is in the 12-14m range. So, in terms of advertising, corporate sales, suite sales, etc....which market would earn the most revenue? So, no, from a financial point of view, Richardson would be a much wealthier man in LA than Charlotte.
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