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Old 01-16-2014, 05:24 AM
 
381 posts, read 237,493 times
Reputation: 171
Awesome post CC0789!

Thanks for putting the details out here on the criteria. It definitely makes sense and if anyone read it 6 months ago, most people would agree that those criteria were sound.

 
Old 01-16-2014, 05:31 AM
 
381 posts, read 237,493 times
Reputation: 171
Quote:
Originally Posted by tpl77 View Post
cc0789:

Thank you for your post. Please confirm that the person(s) in control and who determine which development gets moved around and which development can stay put is then the superintendent, director of facilities, and subordinates? I understand the procedures used, and the factors they consider.
The people you listed create a proposal based on the criteria. The ultimate decision comes down to the approval of the BOE.

Many of the new proposed boundaries are very similar to the boundaries that existed in the past so I'm assuming they used some of those as precedent. I can't find the link at the moment, but the other day you could see the reassignments from 5-8 years ago as they had to address overcrowding in Porter Ridge, Sun Valley, and then the addition of Cuthbertson. Most of the developments going back to Parkwood were originally zoned for Parkwood before they built Cuthbertson.
 
Old 01-16-2014, 06:11 AM
 
1,226 posts, read 973,234 times
Reputation: 1813
Quote:
Originally Posted by tpl77 View Post
cc0789:

Thank you for your post. Please confirm that the person(s) in control and who determine which development gets moved around and which development can stay put is then the superintendent, director of facilities, and subordinates? I understand the procedures used, and the factors they consider.
Well...no, they are not "in control", they really have no control. They just use their set of respective skills to make suggestions based on the criteria that has been set and approved by the board of education for decades. So, yes, while they are the ones with the pencil and eraser, it is the board that has the ultimate say, but they are also limited by HAVING to follow previously approved policy. It is in there black and white.... they have to make use of their current facilities.
 
Old 01-16-2014, 07:05 AM
 
103 posts, read 75,695 times
Reputation: 67
Here's a post from the UCPS Redistricting page on Facebook detailing an interesting option to the proposed plan from Tuesday night:

Another great viable solution! This is not a done deal people. Don't stop fighting!!! Read the proposal below and make your voices heard to the BOE...

"From another Page--a twist on the "new construction" proposal...seems this might solve the bus dilemma--with neighborhoods being moved miles past closer schools with railroad tracks and major highways in between, this efficiency rating can't be much (if any) worse! Sorry it's so long, but it's worth the read!

"Tracy and Melissa, you have both mentioned a plan similar to one I outlined and sent to the BOE. It's long, but I'll share it here. Maybe we can all get behind this alternative.
"I propose that you move forward with “capping” the clusters that are over 120% of capacity (which I understand to be “core capacity”), BUT that UCPS BOE grandfather in ALL existing homes and subdivisions that have closed escrow on at least 75% of their existing housing permits[1]. For example, if there are 800 existing homes in Millbridge, and they have permits/plans to build 200 more, then Millbridge would be grandfathered into their current school- the subdivision would be 80% complete. If instead, the developers add 500 more homes (meaning it is only currently 61% complete), then the entire subdivision would be “capped out” of the Cuthbertson cluster and reassigned.

This cap would also apply to small subdivisions and new construction built on property where there is no existing home. Developers would have to disclose to potential buyers that, until enrollment in the neighborhood school drops below 110%, children in that subdivision would be bussed to a school that is not over capacity.

The many benefits to this plan would include:

1.This plan communicates and demonstrates that the UCPS BOE values and respects the citizens of Union County. It allows parents the opportunity to choose the school environment that best fits their child when they make a housing decision. Citizens are not at the mercy of elected officials who seem to prove, time and time again, that they cannot be trusted.
2. This plan keeps entire neighborhoods and clusters together; simplifying bussing, saving money, fostering long term relationships and stability for children and families. It cannot be cost effective to bus the very small number of children currently affected by the current caps.
3. This plan should also allow “reassigned” students the option to choose another UCPS for their child, providing the school is under 110% capacity and the parent provides transportation.
4. This plan allows UCPS BOE to take a more conservative “wait and see” approach. The prior McKibben report grossly overestimated the current number of students; and the current one predicts only minor, temporary increases in numbers of students. The schools may balance themselves out in the next few years as our economy adjusts to the effects of the Affordable Care Act and increasing interest rates.
5. Although the state has misguidedly made it illegal to have developers pay impact fees, and county municipalities are issuing building permits without allocating for the increased costs; this plan will encourage the developers and towns to creatively collaborate on other options to encourage planned, supported growth in the future.
6. Rather than further damaging and depressing existing home values, this plan will make the existing, established neighborhoods more desirable because buyers will have confidence in the schools their children would be attending. This demand is what helps older neighborhoods thrive rather than decline.
7. This plan will provide economic benefit to the county as a whole. As housing values rise, so will tax revenues that can then be used to supplement the lack of revenue in the more rural areas of the county.
8. This plan will promote family pride, support of, and involvement in their schools. Parents will be willing to invest their time, energy and dollars into PTSO, booster clubs etc. if they know they won’t be shuttled off to a different school each year.
9. This plan keeps families within a reasonable geographic distance from their school so that they can volunteer and provide the involvement that separates good schools from bad ones. It reduces traffic on the already overburdened rural roads, and reduces the distance young teen drivers are travelling to and from school and activities.
10. This plan honors the parents, students and teachers that have worked so hard to raise money, volunteer their time and talents, and fill-in the gaps so that even with budget cuts, pay freezes, and lack of resources, have partnered in creating High Achieving Honor Schools of Excellence."
 
Old 01-16-2014, 07:34 AM
 
3,354 posts, read 3,105,791 times
Reputation: 1409
Quote:
Originally Posted by SunshineCJ View Post
Never said it was race. Was never going there and didn't think it was ever implied.

In fact it's not race at all because the makeup of the high schools across the district are fairly similar. Cuthbertson to Parkwood, Weddington to Sun Valley, etc. Fairly similar, not exactly. Even MR isn't that far off from other nearby clusters. There are exceptions of in the district of course.

MR is much, much less diverse in more ways than any other cluster in the district. It's almost like a private school system and that really ticks a lot of people off as reflected in this thread and all the redistricting Facebook groups. Even more so now than ever.

The unmentionable in this case(for which I will be quickly blasted by hundreds in this thread) is socioeconomic status, SES, as it directly impacts test scores and graduation rates. “Kind” is a combination of education, income, and occupation. Cuthbertson and Weddington are of a similar “kind”. Parkwood and Sun Valley are viewed as not of that “kind”. The eligibility for a free lunch is often used as a measure of a student’s socioeconomic status. It’s not perfect but it’s reflected here. Cuthbertson is 14% while Parkwood is 39.2%. Weddington is 9.5% while Sun Valley is 36.2%. Privilege, power and control. It’s not fair and it’s not right but it’s the reality in this case.

There was no outrage before the caps and redistricting proposal about the conditions at Parkwood, Sun Valley or any of the other schools in the eastern part of the county. No facebook groups, no petitions, no marching on board meetings. Nothing. Out of sight, out of mind. Just keep MY schools good and MY taxes low. Only now when that privilege, power and control are challenged is there outrage. And even this current outrage is misguided. Nothing to address the inequities and problems. Only to continue to avoid them by not sending MY kids there.

My school has a lacrosse team, that school does not. My child can’t get to an after school program because that school is too far. Etc., etc., etc….

Union County Public Schools is a countywide school system not a cluster system. Everyone who moved here should have known that and should have taken that into account. If you want a cluster system move back to New Jersey, Long Island, Ohio, or wherever else just not to CMS.
I don't think socioeconomic status is the unmentionable and I'm pretty sure it was already discussed (well I guess household income more specifically) as in my opinion that is the factor that contributes most to schools being rated highly. I know earlier people were saying it was the richest people in the NW portion of the county that were at the least risk of redistricting, but as was basically said that's mainly because they don't really have anywhere else to go. And I think part of the reason they're the "richest" is simply because the houses will cost more there since it's an easier commute to Charlotte from Marvin and Weddington than it is from Waxhaw...

I know the lacrosse comments have been made in jest but I think it's actually a fair point. Will the kids be able to play on the team with a school that does have it? What if they were in classes that are not offered at the other schools (although I don't know if that's true other than IB at MR)?

Quote:
Originally Posted by GONYMETS View Post
I choose where I want my kids to go.
I'm not quite sure you understand the definition of "public school."

Quote:
Originally Posted by cc0789 View Post
It's so disappointing to see parents attacking students from other schools and having such an elitist attitude and a sense of entitlement. I look at my daughter's instagram account and am absolutely not shocked at kids telling other kids too bad they have to go to "Poorwood", or calling Sun Valley "ghetto". The apple doesn't fall far from the tree. Like I read somewhere on this thread, I now feel worse for those kids at those schools that are going to get flooded with kids that think they are better than them and are going in with their nose turned down at their schools that they are proud of because it's all they have.
I was curious how the kids felt as it seems like most of the comments I'm seeing are from parents (although I don't care enough to read any of the facebook pages). I went through redistricting when I was in HS and really the main thing I cared about was that most of the kids I hung out with were staying at the same school and I was moving, since it was only a few neighborhoods being moved. I was a top student and I'm pretty sure I had no idea what my schools rating on greatschools.org was (looking back I went from a slightly below average school to another slightly below average school). I haven't looked that closely at the details but if there are large numbers of people moving hopefully the kids will have some of their friends moving with them which might lessen the blow a bit.
 
Old 01-16-2014, 07:35 AM
 
1,226 posts, read 973,234 times
Reputation: 1813
Quote:
Originally Posted by LINYTransplant View Post
Here's a post from the UCPS Redistricting page on Facebook detailing an interesting option to the proposed plan from Tuesday night:

Another great viable solution! This is not a done deal people. Don't stop fighting!!! Read the proposal below and make your voices heard to the BOE...

"From another Page--a twist on the "new construction" proposal...seems this might solve the bus dilemma--with neighborhoods being moved miles past closer schools with railroad tracks and major highways in between, this efficiency rating can't be much (if any) worse! Sorry it's so long, but it's worth the read!

"Tracy and Melissa, you have both mentioned a plan similar to one I outlined and sent to the BOE. It's long, but I'll share it here. Maybe we can all get behind this alternative.
"I propose that you move forward with “capping” the clusters that are over 120% of capacity (which I understand to be “core capacity”), BUT that UCPS BOE grandfather in ALL existing homes and subdivisions that have closed escrow on at least 75% of their existing housing permits[1]. For example, if there are 800 existing homes in Millbridge, and they have permits/plans to build 200 more, then Millbridge would be grandfathered into their current school- the subdivision would be 80% complete. If instead, the developers add 500 more homes (meaning it is only currently 61% complete), then the entire subdivision would be “capped out” of the Cuthbertson cluster and reassigned.

This cap would also apply to small subdivisions and new construction built on property where there is no existing home. Developers would have to disclose to potential buyers that, until enrollment in the neighborhood school drops below 110%, children in that subdivision would be bussed to a school that is not over capacity.

The many benefits to this plan would include:

1.This plan communicates and demonstrates that the UCPS BOE values and respects the citizens of Union County. It allows parents the opportunity to choose the school environment that best fits their child when they make a housing decision. Citizens are not at the mercy of elected officials who seem to prove, time and time again, that they cannot be trusted.
2. This plan keeps entire neighborhoods and clusters together; simplifying bussing, saving money, fostering long term relationships and stability for children and families. It cannot be cost effective to bus the very small number of children currently affected by the current caps.
3. This plan should also allow “reassigned” students the option to choose another UCPS for their child, providing the school is under 110% capacity and the parent provides transportation.
4. This plan allows UCPS BOE to take a more conservative “wait and see” approach. The prior McKibben report grossly overestimated the current number of students; and the current one predicts only minor, temporary increases in numbers of students. The schools may balance themselves out in the next few years as our economy adjusts to the effects of the Affordable Care Act and increasing interest rates.
5. Although the state has misguidedly made it illegal to have developers pay impact fees, and county municipalities are issuing building permits without allocating for the increased costs; this plan will encourage the developers and towns to creatively collaborate on other options to encourage planned, supported growth in the future.
6. Rather than further damaging and depressing existing home values, this plan will make the existing, established neighborhoods more desirable because buyers will have confidence in the schools their children would be attending. This demand is what helps older neighborhoods thrive rather than decline.
7. This plan will provide economic benefit to the county as a whole. As housing values rise, so will tax revenues that can then be used to supplement the lack of revenue in the more rural areas of the county.
8. This plan will promote family pride, support of, and involvement in their schools. Parents will be willing to invest their time, energy and dollars into PTSO, booster clubs etc. if they know they won’t be shuttled off to a different school each year.
9. This plan keeps families within a reasonable geographic distance from their school so that they can volunteer and provide the involvement that separates good schools from bad ones. It reduces traffic on the already overburdened rural roads, and reduces the distance young teen drivers are travelling to and from school and activities.
10. This plan honors the parents, students and teachers that have worked so hard to raise money, volunteer their time and talents, and fill-in the gaps so that even with budget cuts, pay freezes, and lack of resources, have partnered in creating High Achieving Honor Schools of Excellence."
I only read the first line.... but.... "move forward with capping"???.... that was done 2 months ago. And how do you cap at 120% (at which they are at currently), PLUS grandfather in all those new exceptions?? That would bring it above 120, which just isn't same or conducive to learning. Kensington already is at the cap..... do you put those new Millbridge kids in those hypothetical 200 new homes on someone's lap and give them a helmet in case there is a tornado? And then there is Lawson with their new homes.... and Cureton. Just doesn't make much sense to me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GoPhils View Post

I know the lacrosse comments have been made in jest but I think it's actually a fair point. Will the kids be able to play on the team with a school that does have it? What if they were in classes that are not offered at the other schools (although I don't know if that's true other than IB at MR)?


.
I wasn't really saying it in jest... I have really seen people say it. But Lacrosse is probably not offered at some schools because of interest, as its an expensive sport. In addition, the booster clubs are not as strong, because you have less parent involvement. Both those things can change with the influx of new students. But no, athletics are governed by state guidelines, and they can't bring in kids from other schools.

But there is a transfer process if one school offers something your existing one doesn't, like the IB program. But of course the kids at the assigned school get first pick, and then if there is room, they will consider transfers. Here is the board policy:

Spoiler



EDUCATIONAL NEED TRANSFERS

To qualify for an educational need transfer based upon the availability of a particular

class, the student must have requested that class during the registration process the

previous spring. Should that particular class not make and subsequently not be offered in

the school year for which the registration was conducted and, cannot be provided by some

other means including, but not limited to internet, computer-based instruction or

independent study, the student may qualify for a transfer to a school that does offer the

exact class.

Only in-house registrations may be used to determine whether or not a particular class is

offered. Potential transfer students can not be considered or included in making such

determinations.

Students may not request a schedule change after the registration process ends for the

purpose of requesting a transfer.

Once the high school master schedules are set, students may not “shop” for a course for the

purpose of requesting a transfer.

Students who are granted an initial educational need transfer are not athletically eligible

for two semesters (see BOE Policy 4.13, Transfers for Athletic Participation).

Approval of educational need transfers will be dependent upon the availability of space in

the class at the requested school and the availability of space in the core subject classes.


Last edited by cc0789; 01-16-2014 at 07:53 AM..
 
Old 01-16-2014, 08:17 AM
 
Location: Union County
5,039 posts, read 4,666,986 times
Reputation: 3630
"Board Policy" ahahaha - that's a great one.

My 3rd grader could write up something more meaningful.
 
Old 01-16-2014, 08:19 AM
 
3,354 posts, read 3,105,791 times
Reputation: 1409
Quote:
Originally Posted by cc0789 View Post
I wasn't really saying it in jest... I have really seen people say it. But Lacrosse is probably not offered at some schools because of interest, as its an expensive sport. In addition, the booster clubs are not as strong, because you have less parent involvement. Both those things can change with the influx of new students. But no, athletics are governed by state guidelines, and they can't bring in kids from other schools.

But there is a transfer process if one school offers something your existing one doesn't, like the IB program. But of course the kids at the assigned school get first pick, and then if there is room, they will consider transfers. Here is the board policy:
Wasn't necessarily referring to you, lacrosse has been mentioned a couple times so far. Good to know there might be an option if that is really an issue.
 
Old 01-16-2014, 08:34 AM
 
Location: NC
32 posts, read 21,382 times
Reputation: 59
cc0789:

If the criteria for redistricting has indeed been followed and is accurate and no fouls have been committed, it then needs to be reviewed and perhaps updated to a better approach. Roughly 6,000 kids get pushed around this year. The final solution then offers a little bit of relief for the overcrowding, and this could be deemed "the best" solution? And, can be done again in three years... then six years, and so on. I am convinced no one on the BOE, no one working for the superintendent, and no one on the BOC is poorly qualified or incompetent. It is, however, a system that isn't working well anymore. No one mentioned above wants to see any kid in a school with garbage cans collecting water (for years) and no one wants to do harm to any child whatsoever, nor cause families hardship. This needs to be stressed, yet this is the outcome of the proposal. Very little gain. There must be a "time out" taken on this matter. Look at the method. Look at how disruptive the proposed solution is. Look at how many kids and families are affected. Look at the amount of gain it will offer. Re-evaluate the re-districting process and ask if it's working like it used to. In the exact same way the district maps are ever changing, maybe the process should change to make what's best for everyone's child.
 
Old 01-16-2014, 08:49 AM
 
979 posts, read 887,296 times
Reputation: 358
On the lacrosse issue, if you want to calll it that, Union County has made it a school sport and it is no longer only funded by booster clubs starting in the 2014-2015 school year. It could be offered at all schools with studets interested and with coaches. And yes it is an expensive sport, since the pads and all are supplied by the participant not the school


And on the classes offered, if a class is not offered many may be taken by computer including foreign language, not that this is ideal in all situations, but it is currently offered at most high schools if not all in the county.

IB can be applied for by any 10th grader (the process starts shortly) and the school accepts to the program the ones with the best potential of making it, it is not restricted to MR and MR does not have a first priority in placement. Placement is dependent on how you do on the essays and the applications process to get it to the IB program. It has always been open to the county, much like CATA.
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