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Old 01-18-2014, 08:59 AM
 
Location: Charlotte, NC
189 posts, read 276,958 times
Reputation: 622

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Luvncsunshine View Post
I don't feel that I was disrespectful by simply saying that the information does not sound right to me, so I'm a little confused by YOUR arrogant tone that is accusing ME of arrogance. Hearsay and anecdotes are not data. And although I've admittedly not found a reliable source for student/teacher ratios in the county, sites like greatschools boast an 18:1 ratio, even at these severely and hazardously overcrowded schools. If anyone knows where I can obtain actual data rather than telling me to go to the school myself and take a head count, I'd be interested in reviewing. With all DUE respect, Waxhawmom, I'd like to see data. Not sure why this upsets you to such a degree.

I asked whether or not the middle and high schools at MR and Cuth have trailers. According to everyone, the middle schools do. I accept that. Do the high schools currently have them?
lol,lol,lol....18:1 student/teacher ratio? That is laughable, those ratios weren't even true for the first years MRMS and CMS were open! If that website is where people are getting information about the schools in question, no wonder they're so dumbfounded by the redistricting plan! I can ASSURE you, those are not the current student/teacher ratios.

Let me break it down for you; the students at schools such as CMS, MRMS, Kensington, Newtown, etc. are jam-packed in there like sardines. If anyone is nave enough to think that over-crowding is not that big of a deal, try hanging out in a hallway with 450 sixth graders in the middle of a class change. The safety and logistical issues have become a nightmare. Try learning a new math concept in a class of 36 where the teacher isn't able to give any individual instruction because they are spread so thin; not to mention because they simply can't physically maneuver between desks.

And unfortunately, yes, the only way to truly understand the impact over-crowding has had on the students and their learning is to actually see it and experience it.

I have been following this thread vigilantly. The issues for the county and any responsible educator are student learning and safety. Student learning has been affected by the over-crowding , whether parents realize it or not. Student safety/logistics has become a primary focus of the school day. Is that what you want your teachers and administrators spending the majority of their day worrying about? I would prefer that my children's teachers are able to spend their time planning and implementing interesting, effective lessons that aren't limited and restricted because there are just too many kids!

 
Old 01-18-2014, 09:00 AM
 
397 posts, read 580,071 times
Reputation: 284
Quote:
Originally Posted by somersmom View Post
As a teacher (but not in Union), class sizes this large are not in the best interests of the students, esp. at the middle school level. I teach high school and have had classes of 42 and it was miserable. These were 9th-grade honors students, so good kids for the most part,. But it's hard to give anyone individual attention at those numbers, and a physically packed classroom means they are stuck in their seats the ENTIRE period as there is no room for group work or getting up and moving around to do fun, but educational activities. Fire or emergency drills, forget it! Took them forever to get out of the room. Also, there are never enough computers in a lab to accommodate that many kids so it becomes difficult to do the ancillary projects you can do with smaller classes.
I am so, so happy to see an actual educator's point of view on here. Thank you so much for sharing!! As many of us have said before, overcrowding is just not conducive to learning. Even if one is at a "10" school and has the "teacher of the planet", there are real, tangible limitations in terms of what a teacher can realistically carry out if she/he has too many students!! Not to mention the safety hazards. Thanks again for sharing
 
Old 01-18-2014, 09:19 AM
 
451 posts, read 609,269 times
Reputation: 248
Quote:
Originally Posted by whxwlvr View Post
And unfortunately, yes, the only way to truly understand the impact over-crowding has had on the students and their learning is to actually see it and experience it.
It makes one wonder if parents actually ever go to their kids schools during the school day to see what is going on. Or if people ever leave their own cluster bubbles and go to activities in other parts of the county.
 
Old 01-18-2014, 09:28 AM
 
Location: Pixley
3,521 posts, read 2,240,406 times
Reputation: 1858
Quote:
Originally Posted by SunshineCJ View Post
No-Because no one really lives out there (again no offense meant, its rural not suburban like the western part of the county) and the cost to bus students, both $$$s and student well being, would out weigh the benefits. Now if there was a true conspiracy theory to raise test scores, the BOE would bus as many kids from the Marvin cluster as they could to Forest Hills (again no offense) and have a really good lacrosse and dance teams allowing them the buy the vote of Kevin Stewart, a Forest Hills grad and District 2 Rep. (There may be a little sarcasm there to)





They did a poor job redistricting when Cuthbertson opened. They allowed Weddington Chase and a couple of others to stay in the Marvin cluster instead of moving them to Weddington as once proposed. They drew the lines too big for Cuthbertson. And these mistakes got compounded starting in 2011 when the migration from parts unknown and the housing market started to come back in the southern part of the Marvin cluster, (i.e. Chimneys) and Cuthbertson cluster came back (i.e. Quellin Cureton, Lawson, Millbridge, etc.). Sort of the same thing with SV. I think any time one moves lines you want to impact the fewest people possible. They did that and lost.
sorry, my mistake - I meant to type the "3 WESTERN most schools" MR/Cuth/Wedd. are being left significantly left under Watch levels. Why?

They did a poor job redistricting when Cuthbertson opened. - So this time they are going to get correct?

I think any time one moves lines you want to impact the fewest people possible. - Like they are now?
 
Old 01-18-2014, 10:06 AM
 
Location: livin' the good life
2,148 posts, read 3,668,844 times
Reputation: 1239
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zatol View Post
From 2012...This can't be true! How could a Parkwood student accomplish this? LOL...

I only hope that the arrogance displayed by some of the posters to this thread is not passed on to their children. If so, it could be a tough experience in their new school.... I would not want my children uprooted either, but it would not be because I thought they were "better" than the children of the new school, or that our family was more affluent than those families of the new school. Whether intended or not, that is the theme of this thread. It is sickening to see that some adults actually believe in this way.

BTW, there are families in the Piedmont, Forest Hills and Parkwood districts that have more wealth than many of you will ever know. In fact, I bet that you unknowingly support them daily!

Parkwood High student gets perfect score on ACT
I'm surprised to see the Superintendent say 'in 35 yrs that he has never known a student to get perfect score on ACT/SAT...a boy got a perfect SAT score last year at WHS..
 
Old 01-18-2014, 10:10 AM
 
103 posts, read 143,323 times
Reputation: 67
Maybe the county needs to switch data vendors. Study Ranks Esri US Demographic Data Most Accurate | ArcNews
 
Old 01-18-2014, 10:15 AM
 
31 posts, read 39,476 times
Reputation: 31
To those of you thinking that Weddington Chase was slated for redistricting to Weddington last time, that is incorrect. When Weddington Chase was first built it went to Weddington Schools and then was redistricted to Marvin Ridge to relieve overcrowding at Weddington. Then it was slated for a move to Cuthbertson (and NOT back to its original Weddington assignment). So it remained at MR until now, where it is now proposed to return to the original Weddington assignment. Weddington Chase is in the middle of 3 clusters (MR, Weddington and Cuthbertson) and obviously is more at risk of reassignment because of this location. From what I have personally heard, many who live in Weddington Chase are accepting of the move back to Weddington, especially if it will bring a more long term outcome for them. And I truly believe the BOE recognizes the changes made in the previous reassignment did not provide the long term effects they had hoped for, and that the "larger" proposed changes are attempting to provide longer term solutions. For those of us who have been in this area a bit longer, the BOE had to play "catch-up" with the uncontrolled growth.
 
Old 01-18-2014, 10:20 AM
 
451 posts, read 609,269 times
Reputation: 248
Quote:
Originally Posted by WaxhawMike View Post
The majority of the Union County population is against redistricting...
Based on what poll or survey? 14% of the student population is being affected. Only 46% of households in UC have kids under 18. Which means 54% of households, a majority, are pretty much out of this redistricting fight. They have an interest but not a big one. All of this means only about 8% of households in UC are getting impacted. Where's the majority? The 8% is really loud I will give you that.

I bet if you talked to those not being redistricted or households that don't have kids or those that home shcool or send their kids to private school they would say "it's not right", "what a shame it is", "no redistricting", "trailers first", "bus the newcomers", etc., etc. But in reality they are thinking "thank god it's not us", "don't move those lines", "we got to watch those guys because I don't trust them", or "don't raise our taxes".


Quote:
Originally Posted by WaxhawMike View Post
this board is probably the very worst place to come for accurate information.
Not sure about that one. But if you think the Facebook groups are better. Go there.

Quote:
Originally Posted by WaxhawMike View Post
There are 3-4 posters, it's obvious who they are, that are either board members, UCPS facilities employees, or are just big fans of 'government knows best' and blindly follow the propaganda machine.
Not a board member. Not a UCPS facilities employee. Critical of 2008 Cuthbertson redistricting and I think a few people at UCPS should have been fired in the fall when the website was deleted just days before the start of school. Not a fan of government knows best. Not a fan of Marvin gov. Not a fan of Waxhaw gov. Not a fan of Indian Trail gov. Don't blindly follow anyone or anything especially that Facebook propaganda. Not a communist.

Practical libertarian that believes in public education for everyone. Not just those in Marvin, Cuthbertson and Weddington.

Quote:
Originally Posted by WaxhawMike View Post
I don't have all of the 2008 meeting minutes and I don't know all of the board members.
Meeting minutes thru 2007 are on the BOE website. Good reading.

You don't need to know any board members just read the minutes, look at some of their e-mails, talk to neighbors that have been here awhile and know what has gone on.
 
Old 01-18-2014, 10:48 AM
 
Location: Union County
5,786 posts, read 8,428,797 times
Reputation: 4818
Quote:
Originally Posted by SunshineCJ View Post
Based on what poll or survey? 14% of the student population is being affected. Only 46% of households in UC have kids under 18. Which means 54% of households, a majority, are pretty much out of this redistricting fight. They have an interest but not a big one. All of this means only about 8% of households in UC are getting impacted. Where's the majority? The 8% is really loud I will give you that.

I bet if you talked to those not being redistricted or households that don't have kids or those that home shcool or send their kids to private school they would say "it's not right", "what a shame it is", "no redistricting", "trailers first", "bus the newcomers", etc., etc. But in reality they are thinking "thank god it's not us", "don't move those lines", "we got to watch those guys because I don't trust them", or "don't raise our taxes".
...
Not a board member. Not a UCPS facilities employee. Critical of 2008 Cuthbertson redistricting and I think a few people at UCPS should have been fired in the fall when the website was deleted just days before the start of school. Not a fan of government knows best. Not a fan of Marvin gov. Not a fan of Waxhaw gov. Not a fan of Indian Trail gov. Don't blindly follow anyone or anything especially that Facebook propaganda. Not a communist.

Practical libertarian that believes in public education for everyone. Not just those in Marvin, Cuthbertson and Weddington.
...
I would agree - for those with skin in the game I'm sure it feels like a majority in the echo chamber. Granted it will be loud, but I don't see how it can be considered "a majority". It's slightly disingenuous to say you're against redistricting when the reality is a parent just being against putting their kids through switching schools. The numbers rallying, petitioning, and putting up the fight will almost certainly be equivalent to the number impacted - and I'm sure the BOE expects this.

I would be shocked if a Board member is actively posting here as their email volume alone will occupy their online time. But if they are posting or reading here then good for them, I would love to hear their comments.
 
Old 01-18-2014, 11:21 AM
 
451 posts, read 609,269 times
Reputation: 248
Quote:
Originally Posted by Redd Jedd View Post
sorry, my mistake - I meant to type the "3 WESTERN most schools" MR/Cuth/Wedd. are being left significantly left under Watch levels. Why?
Subdivision size, the way the cluster system works, and projected growth.

MRMS situation is pretty constant because Marvin has controlled development. They just need move 200+ students out now to fix the problem and it stabilizes at about 90% capacity. That MRMS move also fixes the MRHS cap coming.

Weddington MS has a cap coming so they are doing the same thing there. Again right around 90%.

Cuthbertson is different. First reason is the projected growth. Kensington is capped now, Cuth MS cap next year, Cuth HS cap in 3 years. New Town gets impacted by the Kensington fix so it also has to get fixed. So when you fix Kensington you fix those issues too even though you don't have to right now. And the Cuthbertson cluster only has 2 elementaries to feed Cuth MS/Cuth HS. They will probably add a Cuth ES in a few years but you can't forecast that because even though they have the land they don't have the money to build it.

How close do you want them to get to watch levels. Some say it's too close, you say it's too far away.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Redd Jedd View Post
They did a poor job redistricting when Cuthbertson opened. - So this time they are going to get correct?
People make mistakes (You just did and even me). You learn from those mistakes/experiences and try not to make them again. I think they have learned a lot over the past 5 years.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Redd Jedd View Post
I think any time one moves lines you want to impact the fewest people possible. - Like they are now?
I think they have looked at the current problems and forecasted future problems and determined that this is the right way to go. Is it perfect, probably not. I don't think they are just doing it for the hell of it.

If a subdivision thinks it can make a business case that it should stay where it is or should go somewhere else because the student impact would go down, the cost would be lower while it achieves the districts cap goals make it. That case can't be a comparison of one subdivision vs another. That's got no shot.

Make the business case and leave the emotion out of it and if the numbers make sense it will have a shot to be an amendment.

or

You could also just get rid of the cluster system.

or

We could just redistrict every time a cap is hit. Let's just redistrict the MRMS, Porter Ridge MS, Kensington ES cap problems this year. Next year we can do Cuthbertson MS. 2016 will be Weddington MS turn. 2017 gets big with Cuthbertson HS, MRHS, and Porter Ridge HS.

Last edited by SunshineCJ; 01-18-2014 at 11:32 AM..
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