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you don't know what your talking about. he was under contract. you stated he was asking for 8-9 million. He wasn't asking for anything. He had a contract. In the nfl, it doesnt matter what your making, it matters what your cap hit is. be releasing smith when they did it cost the panthers 4 million is dead cap space this year. teams rarely do this. this move was made because gettleman isn't a fan of smith. the panthers would have been a better team with smith on it this year. THey never asked him to take a paycut, a common move done with vets. you give them a bonus, and free up cap space.
Tread....what was he due to make this year if they kept him? 7,8,9 mil $? To save $, they cut him loose. Happens all the time in the NFL. Now, if you want to say that Smith and the GM didnt get along, ok, i will buy that....lets be fair, Smith isnt the easiest person to get along with, lol. Please do not try and say he was some game changing receiver AT THIS POINT in his career....Last year he had 64 catches for 745 yds and 4 TD's. That is not true #1 numbers
Tread....what was he due to make this year if they kept him? 7,8,9 mil $? To save $, they cut him loose. Happens all the time in the NFL. Now, if you want to say that Smith and the GM didnt get along, ok, i will buy that....lets be fair, Smith isnt the easiest person to get along with, lol. Please do not try and say he was some game changing receiver AT THIS POINT in his career....Last year he had 64 catches for 745 yds and 4 TD's. That is not true #1 numbers
I do not like Steve Smith, but I would just like to point out that so far this season he is 819 yards, 54 catches and 5 touchdowns.
I do not like Steve Smith, but I would just like to point out that so far this season he is 819 yards, 54 catches and 5 touchdowns.
Flying, he has absolutely bounced back. Be fair, no one had any idea he would perform better. When you are 35, production tends to decline, not increase. Its easy now to say "look, he is doing better than last year", but not many people thought that would happen. It wasnt like he was getting alot of offers when the Panthers released him
Panthers say they let him go due to him being a distraction. Smitty says he wanted to become a slot receiver at this point like Wes Welker is. Due to his speed and strength, he would have been an incredible slot receiver as he is both bigger and faster than Welker. Losing LaFell hurt because he was known around the league as a great run blocker. I feel that's 1 reason we can't seem to run wide. I like Benjamin, but the more I see, I feel he is a #2 receiver like Mushin Muhammed was for us. He doesn't have breakaway speed like a true #1 should have. IMO, not addressing the offensive line was the biggest mistake. Losing Gross and Wharton on Cam's blind side has killed the offense. Bell is a joke at tackle. Gross was also a leader in the locker room as well. Remember when the lockout happened 4 yrs ago? He organized practices at Charlotte Catholic for all the players due to them not being allowed at team facilities while the strike was being worked out.
Hardy was an unfortunate incident that nobody saw coming. I think even if he is found innocent, he will not command the huge payday from anyone. Remember, this guy has had a motorcycle accident, taken a picture of his speedometer in his car while traveling 120mph, and taken another picture with a slew of pistols and assault rifles sitting on his couch. I'm not sure that there are too many teams that will take a chance investing a ridiculous amount of money on someone like that. I hope that he signs a 1-2 year incentive heavy contract to come back next year.
As far as "running back hell" is considered, Tolbert is costing us $2.3M this year and $2.4 next year. If I understand the numbers correctly, cutting Williams/Stewart before June 1 would cost close to $18M against the cap, while after that date it would "only" count $8M. A lot less money, but I can't imagine them just letting them go like that.
Are you really going to suggest adding 3 new WR's and 4 new DB's would improve this team vs bringing back a few players who knew the system and could improve with another year under their belt? Can you name one team who has gone 12-4 and scrapped their WR and DB starters?
..and don't say the Patriots because, well.. they are the Patriots and this is Carolina where they never have back to back winning seasons. Why the hell would you remove 7 or 8 starters from a 12-4 team?
Lets start with the defense... Sure the secondary was exposed when they had to cover when the rush didn't get there but guess what? Most secondaries struggle when the rush doesn't get there. You don't get rid of 4 starters in a secondary unless you don't want to win. Who does that? When the team got pressure the DB's were forcing TO's.. why scrap it? It's called being cheap.
On offense... Ginn was their KR/PR and a decent #3 who had the ability to stretch the field. Who stretches the field now so WR's can get open underneath? No one... LaFell had iffy hands but he knew the offense and he could get decent separation. Now we have a big but slow #1... some white dude with hair and Cotch who was a great possession WR but since we don't have anyone to blow the top off the D he can't get open underneath. The WR corp isn't better this year. Youth doesn't trump leadership, chemistry and vet savvy when it comes to in game adjustments.
The offense was ranked 30th last year because they rarely had to drive 80 yards to score points. It was mostly short fields due to the D. You can't remove this many pieces and expect a similar result.
This team undercut Gross so he bailed on him... they have 2 tackles who were undrafted and people blame Cam for not putting up points?
I know this is due to being in cap hell but cmon, this isn't fair. You don't get rid of half the team after a 12-4 season unless you don't give a crap about winning this year.
The team didn't undercut Gross. He got out because he wanted to spend quality time with his kids while he was able to. He said that multiple times but I guess you didn't hear that.
We will agree to disagree. The team was 12-4 last year because of the front 7 on defense. The offense stunk and did the bare minimum to win games.
Panthers say they let him go due to him being a distraction. Smitty says he wanted to become a slot receiver at this point like Wes Welker is. Due to his speed and strength, he would have been an incredible slot receiver as he is both bigger and faster than Welker. Losing LaFell hurt because he was known around the league as a great run blocker. I feel that's 1 reason we can't seem to run wide. I like Benjamin, but the more I see, I feel he is a #2 receiver like Mushin Muhammed was for us. He doesn't have breakaway speed like a true #1 should have. IMO, not addressing the offensive line was the biggest mistake. Losing Gross and Wharton on Cam's blind side has killed the offense. Bell is a joke at tackle. Gross was also a leader in the locker room as well. Remember when the lockout happened 4 yrs ago? He organized practices at Charlotte Catholic for all the players due to them not being allowed at team facilities while the strike was being worked out.
Hardy was an unfortunate incident that nobody saw coming. I think even if he is found innocent, he will not command the huge payday from anyone. Remember, this guy has had a motorcycle accident, taken a picture of his speedometer in his car while traveling 120mph, and taken another picture with a slew of pistols and assault rifles sitting on his couch. I'm not sure that there are too many teams that will take a chance investing a ridiculous amount of money on someone like that. I hope that he signs a 1-2 year incentive heavy contract to come back next year.
As far as "running back hell" is considered, Tolbert is costing us $2.3M this year and $2.4 next year. If I understand the numbers correctly, cutting Williams/Stewart before June 1 would cost close to $18M against the cap, while after that date it would "only" count $8M. A lot less money, but I can't imagine them just letting them go like that.
My opinion is that they'll let deangelo go and keep Stewart. Stewart is the better back by far, but much more brittle. The RB situation in terms of cap space gets better after 2015
Tread....what was he due to make this year if they kept him? 7,8,9 mil $? To save $, they cut him loose. Happens all the time in the NFL. Now, if you want to say that Smith and the GM didnt get along, ok, i will buy that....lets be fair, Smith isnt the easiest person to get along with, lol. Please do not try and say he was some game changing receiver AT THIS POINT in his career....Last year he had 64 catches for 745 yds and 4 TD's. That is not true #1 numbers
they didn't save money. thats the thing. 4 million in dead cap space is huge. they paid him to go away. He is going to have over 100 yards receiving this year. He is on a downhill slide, but we could have kept him and it would have been the same cap space, as it was to bring the free agent WR. that didnt work out. Gettleman is going to be a bust as well
Look, there are a million second guessers that came out of the woodwork since this whole suspension thing came out and are saying they shouldn't have franchised him.
NONE of those people had the same opinion last year before this whole incident took part. So, to me, at the time, franchising him was the only logical choice the Panthers had....it was a no-brainer and there were ZERO complaints until this whole thing broke.
Its an extremely unfortunate situation. They are in a terrible spot because he is such an impact player and counts alot against the cap (and not playing). Its killing the defensive performance of this team, which impacts the offense also.
are there any capologists reading this thread that can explain the cap situation for 2015 on different scenerios for Hardy? I'd be interested in seeing that.
Actually, there were a lot of complaints. The guy had ONE good season, then boom, franchise tag. Why not work out a deal with the guy rather than slapping him with a massive 1 year deal? Now you're left in an even worse spot than you were in last year. Kicking the can down the road doesn't solve the issue.
The team didn't undercut Gross. He got out because he wanted to spend quality time with his kids while he was able to. He said that multiple times but I guess you didn't hear that.
We will agree to disagree. The team was 12-4 last year because of the front 7 on defense. The offense stunk and did the bare minimum to win games.
Jordan Gross isn't stupid. He saw the writing on the wall, and got out of dodge. The guy had plenty in the tank, but chose not to return. Gettleman was too busy running everyone off in the offseason to try to keep a few guys around while they attempt to rebuild.
At least we know how Florida Marlins fans felt in those years after the World Series wins. Good season, then total fire sale. There's nothing wrong with this team that getting rid of everyone in the offices wouldn't fix. We need an offensive minded coach in this style of football that we have now. We need an offensive coordinator that isn't an incompetent boob like Mike Shula is. And we need a GM who doesn't base his player decisions on trying to make a "leader" out of someone who is anything but. You don't get rid of productive fan favorites in the hopes that your young QB will step up and lead. If he hasn't led the team in his first 3 productive seasons, he sure as hell isn't ever going to, especially when you create this dumpster fire of an offense and expect him to work miracles.
We will agree to disagree. The team was 12-4 last year because of the front 7 on defense. The offense stunk and did the bare minimum to win games.
The offense didn't "stink" last year. The offense stinks THIS year. According to pro football reference, they were the #18 offense last year, same as 2012. So they weren't great, but they weren't horrible. The problem is Mike Shula. The team was the #5 offense in Cam's rookie year when Chudzinski was the OC. The second he stepped out the door is when the offense began sliding. This year they're 27th in offense.
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