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Old 09-14-2015, 09:50 AM
 
Location: southern california
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Well according to black lives matter the only issue is police presence so please explain these dead young men and the loss to the community
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Old 09-14-2015, 10:24 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Charlotte485 View Post
But we also shouldn't act like Chicken Little throwing around demagoguery. This is what happens when we act retroactively instead of proactively...

The police can only do so much. They can't be everywhere all the time stopping crime. The police needs help from the citizens and the community and we need to give the community tools they need to succeed. Not slashing school budgets to get rid of Drivers Education and teaching assistants and other vital programs.


So what is your solution to solve this problem?
Schools in low income/distressed areas get considerably more money per pupil (up to 3x the dollars) than other schools and that has not helped the problem.

I agree it is up to the community to step up. I was glad to see an article in the paper this morning about ex gang members that are hoping to talk to kids about the bad decisions they made being in a gang.

At some point in your life you need to look at yourself and decide the path you choose. Blaming others for your situation doesn't get you anywhere and it prolongs the pain.
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Old 09-14-2015, 11:00 AM
 
1,985 posts, read 1,384,237 times
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Originally Posted by Charlotteborn View Post
Schools in low income/distressed areas get considerably more money per pupil (up to 3x the dollars) than other schools and that has not helped the problem.

I agree it is up to the community to step up. I was glad to see an article in the paper this morning about ex gang members that are hoping to talk to kids about the bad decisions they made being in a gang.

At some point in your life you need to look at yourself and decide the path you choose. Blaming others for your situation doesn't get you anywhere and it prolongs the pain.

Your quote about blame is a great one. It applies to everyone - including gang members engaging in illegal behavior as well as the out of touch race baiters and social engineers on this thread. I think you're correct that we need to focus on how the community bonds together against violence. If you think they can/should do this on their own without support from our more affluent and privileged communities, that's where we disagree.

Where do you find your information showing a 3x difference in school allotment funding low income schools? I see the CMS page has some information about allotments from 2010. They note there is a 30% difference for some items for focus schools, but not 3X.

http://www.cms.k12.nc.us/cmsdepartme...20Formulas.pdf

Do you think schools that serve students from exceptionally poor communities should receive the same per pupil spending?

What problem do you think funding focus schools 30% more "has not helped"? Are you talking about crime or education?
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Old 09-14-2015, 11:07 AM
 
1,985 posts, read 1,384,237 times
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Originally Posted by Huckleberry3911948 View Post
Well according to black lives matter the only issue is police presence so please explain these dead young men and the loss to the community

http://sentencingproject.org/doc/pub...ves_Matter.pdf


Where are you getting your information? What does it have to do with the OP about 5 shootings? I think 3 of the victims were Hispanic. None of the shootings involve police officers. Do you know what a red herring is?

There are idiots in every group, so I don't doubt someone may have told you this is the "only issue" for the Black Lives Matter movement. But it's not. No idea if the proposals would prove effective, but it's not "the only issue" according to anybody but you.
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Old 09-14-2015, 11:09 AM
 
1,985 posts, read 1,384,237 times
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Originally Posted by Wolf Howl View Post
The Charlotte Observer had a story on there last night, still might be, around the improvement in the Hidden Valley area of Charlotte with previous gang problems. If you know gangs in Charlotte you know the Hidden Valley Kings and that mess so it's interesting to see how a judge stepped in and tried something different and it's working.

While I agree the judicial system and the police can't fix it all they definitely need to be a part of the process of cleaning up the growing gang problem in Charlotte.

Is the "gang problem" growing in Charlotte? I have read a few articles about a growing % of inmates in NC prisons having gang affiliation, but that's where I want gang members to be (prison).

I'm not saying you're wrong, but curious about what evidence you have or how you know gang violence is increasing in NC. Do they measure this?
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Old 09-14-2015, 11:41 AM
 
2,828 posts, read 4,135,372 times
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Originally Posted by Essequamvideri View Post
Your quote about blame is a great one. It applies to everyone - including gang members engaging in illegal behavior as well as the out of touch race baiters and social engineers on this thread. I think you're correct that we need to focus on how the community bonds together against violence. If you think they can/should do this on their own without support from our more affluent and privileged communities, that's where we disagree.

Where do you find your information showing a 3x difference in school allotment funding low income schools? I see the CMS page has some information about allotments from 2010. They note there is a 30% difference for some items for focus schools, but not 3X.

http://www.cms.k12.nc.us/cmsdepartme...20Formulas.pdf

Do you think schools that serve students from exceptionally poor communities should receive the same per pupil spending?

What problem do you think funding focus schools 30% more "has not helped"? Are you talking about crime or education?
It is very difficult to find the actual per pupil expenditures in CMS schools because they don't publicly publish it. Also, there are a number of factors that skew the expenditures based on weighted staffing, grants, private funding, etc.

The 'problem' I see is that we STILL have the same issues we had 40 years ago. I was talking about crime as this is what the thread is about. I don't mind spending more per pupil at disadvantaged schools if we are truthful about costs and can prove it is helping the students. That is not the case in CMS. It is obvious that throwing more money at the problem has not solved anything.
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Old 09-14-2015, 11:46 AM
 
Location: Washington DC
3,749 posts, read 3,265,475 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Essequamvideri View Post
Your quote about blame is a great one. It applies to everyone - including gang members engaging in illegal behavior as well as the out of touch race baiters and social engineers on this thread. I think you're correct that we need to focus on how the community bonds together against violence. If you think they can/should do this on their own without support from our more affluent and privileged communities, that's where we disagree.

Where do you find your information showing a 3x difference in school allotment funding low income schools? I see the CMS page has some information about allotments from 2010. They note there is a 30% difference for some items for focus schools, but not 3X.

http://www.cms.k12.nc.us/cmsdepartme...20Formulas.pdf

Do you think schools that serve students from exceptionally poor communities should receive the same per pupil spending?

What problem do you think funding focus schools 30% more "has not helped"? Are you talking about crime or education?


if the lower income neighborhoods school were as well off as the higher income neighborhood schools, then redistricting and such wouldn't be the biggest lightening rod in the entire Charlotte region. People will light themselves on fire when it comes to school redistricting around here.(I'm not directing this at you, just quoting your post so the statistics are seen again)


I think getting the public schools on equal levels would be a start. I think CMPD is doing a tremendous job, personally. I don't know if CMPD can do anymore than they are? Maybe gentrification is key.
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Old 09-14-2015, 12:06 PM
 
Location: The place where the road & the sky collide
21,877 posts, read 27,138,998 times
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Originally Posted by Feltdesigner View Post
http://6abc.com/news/philadelphia-vi...e-rise/927865/

Philly has 192 murders and 692 people have been killed as of July 2015.

While it may have worked in West Philly years ago gang violence is on the rise in the city of brotherly love.

Different areas require different strategies.... all are welcome but it isn't as easy as reading a link, copying their blueprint and getting the same results.
One woman made a huge difference. I'm not even sure if she's still alive. Gang violence then was homegrown gangs which are different than the big national drug-related gangs. If one or more people took elements of what Falakka Fattah did. It would make a difference. Would it fix everything? I don't know. Whatever good it did would take time. The reason that I brought her up was she made a difference & it wasn't just displacing the gang problems to somewhere else.

Since Philadelphia's population is ~twice the population of Charlotte, try dividing those numbers in half. Look a little more familiar?
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Old 09-14-2015, 12:09 PM
 
1,985 posts, read 1,384,237 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Charlotte485 View Post
if the lower income neighborhoods school were as well off as the higher income neighborhood schools, then redistricting and such wouldn't be the biggest lightening rod in the entire Charlotte region. People will light themselves on fire when it comes to school redistricting around here.(I'm not directing this at you, just quoting your post so the statistics are seen again)


I think getting the public schools on equal levels would be a start. I think CMPD is doing a tremendous job, personally. I don't know if CMPD can do anymore than they are? Maybe gentrification is key.

I agree with your point about transparency in funding (and everything really) being important. CMS does a better job than they get credit for but definitely have to bear some responsibility for winning over support from the community. Some people won't support public schools no matter what - sometimes based on preconcieved notions of where they come from, or based on a bad experience. I think a parent/student are a more important factor in the education of a child than a school.

You are correct in saying it's one of the most controversial issues. Makes sense too - people love their kids and want to give them as good an education as possible. They're good parents for advocating. The irony of it all, is if everyone went to the schools they were zoned for publicly, the beneficial influence that more affluent families would inject into their neighborhood schools would be tremendous. It's totally understandable that people do what they think will benefit their children. I think people should have that right, I don't claim to have the solutions, but I do know that when affluent families pull their kids out of the system, or to other magnet schools in large numbers, it can really impact a school negatively if the students that aren't moving and remain are less privileged. Those are the kids that suffer. In a more diverse school they would be pulled up, but when the affluent families leave, the PTA crumbles, many teachers choose to leave, it can gut a school.

There are a lot of students that go home everyday to a parent or parents that don't have the ability to keep up with their progress. Some on this forum think it's always the parent's fault that this is the case. Sometimes it is, many times it is not. I think personal responsibility is a great trait to preach about and model, but there are circumstances where 'pulling yourself up' or 'getting it together' isn't possible independently. There are parents battling addictions/abuse/depression - all of which are issues that are magnified in poverty. It's not as simple as blaming a welfare mentality. The funny part is that some of you claiming we should lock up more people don't realize that investing in students and the community is a lot cheaper than paying to incarcerate in the future. The shame of it all, is we look at these issues on paper or based on race statistics and try to target one specific cause when it's rarely as simple. The posters on this topic mentioning race without considering socioeconomics is irresponsible. They are cherry a storyline as it is - the OP story isn't race related anyway.

Last edited by Essequamvideri; 09-14-2015 at 01:18 PM..
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Old 09-14-2015, 01:32 PM
 
Location: Charlotte NC
11,722 posts, read 9,345,072 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Huckleberry3911948 View Post
Well according to black lives matter the only issue is police presence so please explain these dead young men and the loss to the community
all that is missing is a "thanks Obama" and a "if Obama had a son he would look like one of the perps"
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