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Old 07-10-2008, 02:56 PM
 
830 posts, read 1,316,097 times
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I may be mistaken, but wasn't SouthPark built in the 70s, and only fairly recently has become a mega-mall? In general, malls tend to draw crime...but SouthPark does have the advantage of not being located close to major interstates for easy access.

My understanding is that dispersal of low-income housing, not only here in Charlotte, but around the country was a response to the failure of the large-scale, dense housing projects/towers that were built post-WW2 (Cabrini-Green in Chicago, Pruitt-Ingo in St. Louis, etc). Those towers were torn down and gradually replaced with lower-density housing, some times with a mix of market rate and subsidized housing - and the former tower residents were dispersed.
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Old 07-10-2008, 03:35 PM
 
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Regardless of where you house them, people that feel entitled to sucking on the government teet will also be linked to crime. The dispersal from high concentration to low has done nothing more than spread the crime from a small area to throughout the city. Seems that some have a problem with projects and dense poverty areas, but I ask why the rest of an area should be forced to endure criminal behavior?
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Old 07-10-2008, 04:02 PM
 
Location: State of Being
35,885 posts, read 67,059,012 times
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I have enjoyed the discourse on this thread very much. I have only one simple observation.

Drive around and look at places that have a high saturation of Section 8 housing, and then ya'll tell me if you think it is a hotbed of criminal activity. Or try matching up CMPD's map of "hotspots" for criminal activity w/ blocks that also contain Sec. 8 housing.

Then tell me that you think there isn't a correlation. There may be a gizillion reasons why the areas evolved into places that attract thugs . . . but really . . . does it matter which came first - the chicken or the egg? All I know is . . .it is THERE.

Last edited by brokensky; 07-10-2008 at 04:04 PM.. Reason: syntax
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Old 07-11-2008, 12:49 PM
 
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Wow, what an interesting thread. Muffinman, I heard the same NPR program and was fascinated. Likewise, I read the Atlantic Monthly article. I can tell you that from my own experience that is exactly what happened to my East Charlotte neighborhood. First, it was the apartments which the city planers dumped in our area and then investors started buying up some of the small 1960's homes for rental to Section Eight tenants. It was so disheartening - we felt that we could do nothing. Luckily, we now have a rebirth of our 1970's neighborhood association which is doing a great job of promoting owner responsibility. Because of its aggressive leadership, we have fewer rentals and almost no crime in our immediate neighborhood nowadays. That is not to say that there is no crime in East Charlotte - I don't wear blinders - but as someone who follows the crime dots, I almost never see any in my neighborhood. This comes from the effort of our association who keeps on top of it. I was discussing this same topic with a friend who lives in Merry Oaks; she has had the same experience. Due to their neighborhood association's work, they keep a lid on the thugs and force responsible home ownership.
Of course, our accessibility to Uptown, the medical area and shopping is also helping our neighborhoods. As prices go up, Section Eight tenants can't afford to rent and we have more investors selling to home owners.
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Old 07-11-2008, 03:16 PM
 
Location: Drury Lane
822 posts, read 2,541,908 times
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The illegal immigrant angle is an interesting part of the thread.

I'd be interested in seeing data or a colored map. I found this article on a website called red orbit. They seem to have old Observer articles which is nice because the Observer doesn't make these available.

The article notes that the highest concentrations of Section 8 are in north and northeast Charlotte but that doesn't mean much without data. What determines a high concentration?

Crime, Section 8 Housing Studied: Cause-Effect Connection Not Found Between the 2, UNCC Report Says - Technology - redOrbit

The article did confuse me because the UNCC researcher who studied this said an increase in A did not mean an increase in B. But later in the article it says that rental properties that accept section 8 are 5 times as likely to be within 100 feet of a crime whereas with a normal rental the factor is only 2. This sounds like a correlation to me.
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Old 07-11-2008, 03:52 PM
 
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You certainly are right about the conclusions reached in the above article being contradictory to the another statement in the same article that rental properties that accept Section 8 vouchers are five times as likely to be within 100 feet of a violent or property crime whereas other rental properties are only twice as likely to be within 100 feet of a violent or property crime. Furthermore, it contradicts the NPR study.







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Old 07-11-2008, 03:57 PM
 
Location: Noth Caccalacca
5,556 posts, read 6,675,189 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BarbJ View Post
You certainly are right about the conclusions reached in the above article being contradictory to the another statement in the same article that rental properties that accept Section 8 vouchers are five times as likely to be within 100 feet of a violent or property crime whereas other rental properties are only twice as likely to be within 100 feet of a violent or property crime. Furthermore, it contradicts the NPR study.







It seems like those UNCC researchers need to "refine" their methods a bit more, so they can reach something other than a nebulous conclusion!
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Old 07-11-2008, 05:24 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheEmissary View Post
It seems like those UNCC researchers need to "refine" their methods a bit more, so they can reach something other than a nebulous conclusion!
Seems that UNCC has a history of flawed studies. Or, maybe that's just me.
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Old 07-19-2008, 04:51 PM
 
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Smile It Depends on the People and Situations!

Section 8 can only play a small part of crime, however crime was conceive way befoe Section 8 came to pass. Why do we want to put the blame on Section 8? Because of low income families, lets be real, we know every house hold is not mentor to have two parents to raise their children or child. Basically it's always one single parent in regards to raising their child or children. Which means someone or somebody will get into trouble by leaving the house without following rules. On the other hand we have trouble teens and adolescents trouble on every hand, which means they are looking for love in all the wrong places. Most of these teenagers turn to gangs for a substitute of love that a parent can not give because of survival trying to make a living. Now that we have all of this money store up through the government. What do we do? We transfer it over to politics, V-Dot, Roads, Lottery, and Etc. So it tells the american man or woman that the struggle must go on. You can't afford to fight the system, so the system make way for the Drug Dealers to come into low income neighborhoods to sell their product. Products that make a young man believe he can make money or get rich. He deals it on the corner and take a chance of lossing his life or killing someone else or taking a beat down. Likewise, the police department comes in to arrest whoever, but it doesn't change the next person from doing the same thing. What happens? The community or neighborhood becomes "Ghetto" but what about the children? No where to go, to play, or sometimes to hide. Why can all this money we spend for foolishness help build a better place to help low income families that are not alike. Sure there all bad apples in a lot of baskets, we as mentors need to know to let those bad apples turn sour to throw them away if they do not want to change. Change comes to better ourselves and our children. Everyone is not born Rich, Wealthy, with a silver spoon to pass on. So I can not say I blame Section 8 for all the crime that is committed everyday. It takes a Village to raise a child, so it takes love to cover A multitude of faults. Amen.

Last edited by angels09; 07-19-2008 at 04:55 PM.. Reason: Others need to know that Section 8 is a blessing to some maynot not for others!
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Old 07-19-2008, 04:55 PM
 
Location: southern california
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know charolotte a lil. know san francisco much better. per SFPD, known prior fact (somewhat dated). in the past 50% of san francisco crime came from the projects. typically its not the people on the agreement its the gang bang grandkids.
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