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Old 10-14-2008, 12:08 PM
 
Location: New Jersey
1,181 posts, read 2,746,163 times
Reputation: 460

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We have more people in prison than any other country in the world and we have more crime than any country as well. Our system is not working.

We're locking up people, treating them like animals, throwing them back out on the street, our prisons are overcrowded, so officials are hard pressed to put more criminals into the prisons, our court system is a paper mill designed to feed the hungry pockets of lawyers and get judges home in time for dinner.

Nothing is getting fixed. Nobody is getting helped... not the criminals, not the victims, not society. Nobody.

Yes Ani, there are resources out there, but try to get someone to call you back. I have tried to help several people through various organizations and it is very difficult to get anywhere. It is not as simple as picking up the phone and getting help.
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Old 10-14-2008, 02:06 PM
 
Location: State of Being
35,885 posts, read 67,009,663 times
Reputation: 22370
Quote:
Originally Posted by MommyV View Post
We have more people in prison than any other country in the world and we have more crime than any country as well. Our system is not working.

We're locking up people, treating them like animals, throwing them back out on the street, our prisons are overcrowded, so officials are hard pressed to put more criminals into the prisons, our court system is a paper mill designed to feed the hungry pockets of lawyers and get judges home in time for dinner.

Nothing is getting fixed. Nobody is getting helped... not the criminals, not the victims, not society. Nobody.

Yes Ani, there are resources out there, but try to get someone to call you back. I have tried to help several people through various organizations and it is very difficult to get anywhere. It is not as simple as picking up the phone and getting help.
Hey, MV!! Yes, I am sure you are right about it not being simple. Heck, when I call a utility company or credit card company (and I am sending them money, LOL!) that is not even simple, so no surprise that trying to get charity help is complicated.

Well, it all starts at home. When you see mothers justifying their sons' behaviors . . . that is a sign right there of why things have gone so awry in this country (w/ crime and derelicts and thugs and miscreants). Of course, there are real cases of people being locked up unfairly . . . but in this city? I don't think so. The young thugs are like marauding wolves - and any of us could become a victim. That is what is so outrageous. They invade our neighborhoods, our places of business . . . and wreak havoc - and sometimes - kill people. They run in packs, attack people . . . and if they get caught up with . . . they are back out on the streets in no time.

By the time someone is in high school, who they are is who they are. An "at risk" child is only "at risk" until he/she commits a crime . . . after that, the die is cast - and the chances of "turning them around" - well . . . I used to believe it could be done, but after seeing genetic studies on anti-social behavior . . . I don't think so. Maybe if a child could be helped on a path b/f middle school . . . but after that - don't think so. God bless the people who strive towards helping others . . . but I am all burned out. And I don't see the success stories . . . and wonder if there really are any out there.
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Old 10-14-2008, 10:00 PM
 
Location: Charlotte, NC
1,577 posts, read 2,383,690 times
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I know of several success stories Ani but you don't see them posted on the news.

We have hired a couple of guys from the work release program and they worked out very well for us. They had drug/alcohol offenses and were part of a 12 step program. They may be few and far between but they do exist. I do wish more employers were willing to help these guys that are serious about wanting to turn their lives around.
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Old 10-15-2008, 03:24 AM
 
140 posts, read 285,845 times
Reputation: 101
Quote:
Originally Posted by scarlet52698 View Post
I know of several success stories Ani but you don't see them posted on the news.

We have hired a couple of guys from the work release program and they worked out very well for us. They had drug/alcohol offenses and were part of a 12 step program. They may be few and far between but they do exist. I do wish more employers were willing to help these guys that are serious about wanting to turn their lives around.
Good post Scarlet. I agree with some of Ani's points too but I think we just can't go out there labeling ppl as thugs w/o looking for answers on how to solve the problem. We are prone to put these ppl down very easily, not that I'm condoning their crimes, after all they do need to do time if convicted (and yes I realize the systemic failure there too, another thing we need to fix) but afterwards they should be able to get a second chance if we don't want them to do the same.

These folks will have very little incentive to become good citizens if they can not even get a job. This will get even worse with a worsened economy, esp after we'll see the ugly effects of the WB debacle to hit us in the upcoming months.

I hope education is really high on the list of whoever wins in November, we are falling behind big time against all industrialized nations, we need to change our collective thinking here too and become more used to the idea a globalized world is here to stay and become more open to things like learning how to speak another language for instance. We need to establish real DISCIPLINE in our schools. Having lived overseas, the way our students behave here is a joke (b/c we allow it to). Discipline goes a long way IMO. This is where the failures of a dysfunctional home can be repaired. We need to empower our teachers and instructors with the authority to be respected by students here. Uniforms should be a standard, etc. Anyway just my 2 cents.
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Old 10-15-2008, 04:58 AM
 
Location: Charlotte, NC
7,041 posts, read 13,104,253 times
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Default You don't know the 1/2 of it

Quote:
Originally Posted by Doorway View Post
WOW!! It would be hard for me to live life anger free if I had to watch that slime come and go freely each day knowing the crime he is responsible for. I'm sorry you have to deal with that.
These same folks have broken into several houses in the neighbourhood, stolen anything of value (including pedigreed dogs), are responsible for the car break-ins for the area as well as car thefts. We have a common area, a pond, that they have been known to mug people at gunpoint. It has not been fun. However, since I knew this kid when he was a (literal) kid and have jumped up in his face to confront him....plus, I have two large dogs that bark a lot , thankfully, they have left me alone. Of course, I have lived in much worse neighbourhoods in my life, so, I know how to be "city smart".

These kids don't WANT any help. (even if it were available, which it is not once you have a felony conviction). They don't WANT education. They are making an estimated $5-$10k WEEKLY doing what they do. Their network is now large enough that if one or two are caught and in jail, the money still comes in...and the fines are pocket change. They don't care about anything but their drugs and bling. To be sure, their drug addiction is probably fueling a good part of this life, but, still, there comes a point when the only good place for them to be is in prision or in that fabled farm out in the middle of nowhere with no chance of getting out.

Chef, you are right. Our system is not working, primarily because we are too soft on these people. Prision time in other countries is not living at the local country club, only with bars. Prision time there is seriously bad news. That is why people don't want to go there! Here, who cares? You get three meals a day, cable TV, A/C and heat...plus a lot more. Many times, living in prision is BETTER than where these people live on the outside! And, at the end of the day, all these thugs need/want (truly) is structure and guidelines, dicipline if you will; something that has been lacking in their lives.

Tough call. Hope these newly elected officials are up for it. At least it looks like the city of Charlotte is now getting angry enough to force the issue!
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Old 10-15-2008, 08:15 AM
 
630 posts, read 1,674,481 times
Reputation: 287
I'm for the death penalty. I believe that if these criminals start thinking that there's a good chance of them meeting their maker after these armed robberies or murders (even for accomplices) then they make a decision not to do it or to change the people they associate with.

Criminals are not as stupid as we would like to believe. They know they will go through the revolving door of the criminal system. Even jail isn't so bad because they would get to hang out with their friends in jail while enjoying the comforts of life. So the money they can make while robbing is worth the risk to them or even the jail term. Figure if they rob 2 banks for 100K each and there are 2 people doing the job. Thats 100K tax free. Even if they go to jail for a year it's still 50K a year for 5 minutes of work. Robbing a house can get you $20K worth of stuff in 3 minutes. Not too bad.

But if they know they'll end up dead, then they might change their mind.

As for the reforming of criminals, where is the tax payer money to help the people who no longer feel safe in their homes after being broken into... who no longer have a source of income and lose their loved ones when they get murdered.. who worry about getting mugged walking around their neighborhood?
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Old 10-15-2008, 08:42 AM
 
Location: State of Being
35,885 posts, read 67,009,663 times
Reputation: 22370
Quote:
Originally Posted by scarlet52698 View Post
I know of several success stories Ani but you don't see them posted on the news.

We have hired a couple of guys from the work release program and they worked out very well for us. They had drug/alcohol offenses and were part of a 12 step program. They may be few and far between but they do exist. I do wish more employers were willing to help these guys that are serious about wanting to turn their lives around.
Scarlet - thank you so much for your post!

I should have clarified what I meant . . . I am talking about violent criminals. I have somewhat controversial opinions on drug addicts and substance abusers in general. I do not think people should be incarcerated for drug violations (when they are users) and I think that there needs to be a different system for dealing w/ drug dealers, as many are simply users who are dealing in order to support their habit. I believe addicts need help to address the addiction, rather than slapping people in jail. I am against jail time for druggies, period. They should all be in substance abuse facilities (of course, our penal system does not work that way - so much for my ideas).

I did make a blanket statement and I am so glad you posted your info as I didn't realize that I had been so general. I am only referring to violent offenders.

I 100% support any program that works w/ substance abusers and yes, I have seen many of those programs work and people's lives been transformed.

Thank you again for reminding all of us that programs that work w/ non-violent offenders and substance abusers are not only valuable - they can turn lives around.

Last edited by brokensky; 10-15-2008 at 08:43 AM.. Reason: typo
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Old 10-15-2008, 08:47 AM
 
Location: State of Being
35,885 posts, read 67,009,663 times
Reputation: 22370
CHEF - you make many good points and I agree w/ all you said about our schools. So many of these kids drop out and I believe keeping them in school is key. I also believe you have to intervene b/f middle school to do that.

Turning lives around also involves what is going on at home. There is no way a school can somehow make up for the deficit that a child may have at home w/ crackhead parent/s, etc. But yes, I do agree - education is always the key to someone having a good life at 21 - wh/ is almost always dependent on earning a salary.
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Old 10-15-2008, 08:54 AM
 
Location: Charlotte, NC
1,577 posts, read 2,383,690 times
Reputation: 414
Quote:
I did make a blanket statement and I am so glad you posted your info as I didn't realize that I had been so general. I am only referring to violent offenders.
Thanks for clarifying that, I agree with you that violent criminals are a different story.
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Old 10-19-2008, 10:26 AM
 
Location: Charlotte
2,447 posts, read 6,642,486 times
Reputation: 1389
Good update!

Suspects in minivan robberies arrested

Quote:
Police have arrested four Charlotte men they believe used stolen minivans to get away during a three-month violent crime spree in Charlotte and York County, S.C., that left one man dead and two others with gunshot wounds.

Charged with murder are Jamar Lavert Belk, 19; Darryl Agustus Manning, 23; Robert Charles Shealey, 20; and Joshua Matthew Squire, 20.
Quote:
Originally Posted by anifani821 View Post
I will be very surprised if these thugs turn out to be older than mid 20s. I bet they are all 25 and under.
You nailed it.
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