In YOUR honest opinion: Do you think Charlotte and Atlanta are similar?? (Fairview: sales, 2010)

[anifani821]

SouthPark is kinda Buckhead-ish . . . just no Ritz, LOL.

[anifani821]

Originally Posted by urbancharlotte

This is why I say Charlotte needs to just focus on urban density in Uptown (and South End). Charlotte needs a midtown. Charlotte does not need a Buckhead (eventhough it will probably get one anyway LOL).

Agree with this. And anyone who doesn't realize how much time you have spent in both ATL and CLT has just not been reading our forum, Urban. I think your opinions of both cities are very interesting and based on real knowledge.

[adavi215]

I also think CLT needs more urban density. An uptown population of 13,000 for a city of 670,000 does not make it look to urban. Charlotte also as an urban area of around 750,000 people but a Primary Census Area of 2.1million. I would say roughly the population of Meck county. This means that roughly 1.3million people live in rural areas of the Charlotte metro region. Atlanta, even though it has a Primary census area of 5.4-5.5 million, only has an urban area of about 4million. So roughly 1.5 million live in "rural" areas of the ATL metro region. Atlanta, compared to cities of its size, lags in its urban area. This meaning it is not as dense or urban as other areas. I think the same can be said about Charlotte compared to city of its size.

I would say in this sense maybe ATL and CLT may be more similiar when you look at how they stack relative to cities of its size. ATL compared to Boston, Philly, Dallas, Houston, San Francisco, Detroit, Seattle, etc., is not as "urban." CLT compared to Cincinnati, Cleveland, Indianapolis, Nashville, Tampa, Sacramento, etc., is not as "urban."

This may not necessarily be a bad thing. Plus also when you look at ATL and CLT they are just now really developing mass transit lines like light rail in order to improve their transportation infrastructure. BTW, 485 runs outside of CLT, along the outskirts of the city and does not run through the "city." I-277 would be a better comparison.

I would say CLT and ATL have a parallel similiarity. ATL is definitely bigger than CLT. But that is not really what the question is asking. Both cities are great, historic, good for minorities, southern (the best part), rapidly developing, and don't get their true recognition when compared to cities of similiar size.

[atlantaATL]

Originally Posted by anifani821

SouthPark is kinda Buckhead-ish . . . just no Ritz, LOL.

No ritz no W no Intercontential No ritz carlton residences No Westin NO JW marriot. No heavy rail transit system serving 4 differnt train stops in the area NO skyline No 100,000 people living in the are. No major major Retail like phipps ANd lenox combines Lol Southpark can just be a section of Buckhead LOL !!!!!

[urbancharlotte]

Originally Posted by atlantaATL

No ritz no W no Intercontential No ritz carlton residences No Westin NO JW marriot. No heavy rail transit system serving 4 differnt train stops in the area NO skyline No 100,000 people living in the are. No major major Retail like phipps ANd lenox combines Lol Southpark can just be a section of Buckhead LOL !!!!!

You are correct again my friend, but Ani does have a point. Here are the stats on Southpark's primary zip code of 28210.

Population 41595
Male Population 20359 (48.95 %)
Female Population 21236 (51.05 %)
Percent Change Since 1990 14.0 %
Percent Change Since 2000 1.0 %
Density (Persons per sq. mile) 3304.00
Median Age 36.75

Here are the stats on Buckhead's primary zip code of 30319

Population 22400
Male Population 12661 (56.52 %)
Female Population 9739 (43.48 %)
Percent Change Since 1990 59.0 %
Percent Change Since 2000 22.0 %
Density (Persons per sq. mile) 6412.00
Median Age 34.76

This info shows that Buckhead is indeed adding density much faster than Southpark (no surprise!!!). I must add that this particular Buckhead zip is the smallest in land area I could find. This explains the low population and high density. The other Buckhead zip codes are between 3,000 and 4,000 people per sq/mi. 3,000 to 4,000 people per sq/mi is comparable to the densities you will find in both Southpark and Myers Park's zip codes. Dilworth, South End, Elizabeth, and much of central Charlotte has densities of 3,000 to 4,000 people per sq/mi as well. Uptown (28202) pushes nearly 7,000 people per sq/mi in places.

Neither Myers Park nor Southpark are moving towards urbanity quite like Buckhead is, but Ani's observation was not far off at all. I am well aware of Buckheads skyline. Heck, Buckhead have been building skyscrapers since the 80s. I know because I saw them go up back then in person. However, South Park and Myers Park (even without skyscrapers) currently have similar density as most of present day Buckhead (with the obvious exception of the very small 3 1/2 sq/mi 30319 zip). The 28210 South Park zip by comparison covers about 12 or so sq/mi.

Again Atl-guy, these are your clues as to why Fulton and Mecklenbug county are similar in land area, population, and density. Also, office vacancies in Buckhead are pushing nearly 20% yet they keep building. This is not good at all for the city of Atlanta. One more thing; Mecklenburg county has a faster population growth rate than Fulton county this decade. I have those numbers too if you are interested in seeing them.

It is numbers like the ones that I have shown that makes me quite upset with Charlotte. I love this town, but its main urban county is not far behind Fulton when it comes to population. However, the development here in Charlotte is quite suburban outside of central Charlotte. It would be nice to have a strip like Peachtree or a GA-400 like road/rail combo, or skyscrapers in Southpark, but it just is not Charlotte's thing (for now). The population is in Mecklenburg to support these things, but the mentallity here is still "not that highrise mess in my backyard". URRRRRRGGGGGGGG!!!! Oh well, it is what it is LOL!!!

[gold15]

Originally Posted by adavi215

This may not necessarily be a bad thing. Plus also when you look at ATL and CLT they are just now really developing mass transit lines like light rail in order to improve their transportation infrastructure. BTW, 485 runs outside of CLT, along the outskirts of the city and does not run through the "city." I-277 would be a better comparison.

I was unclear. I was comparing 485 to 285. In addition, there are (at least) two major interstates running through each city: 85/20 ATL, 85/77 CLT.

[anifani821]

Originally Posted by atlantaATL

No ritz no W no Intercontential No ritz carlton residences No Westin NO JW marriot. No heavy rail transit system serving 4 differnt train stops in the area NO skyline No 100,000 people living in the are. No major major Retail like phipps ANd lenox combines Lol Southpark can just be a section of Buckhead LOL !!!!!

Very true. SouthPark could be a section of Buckhead, but it would be a very nice section. Clean, uncrowded, well landscaped and upscale. As for your statements about all the hotels . . . sure Buckhead has more hotels! But SouthPark has a nice Renaissance, Doubletree and 4 star Marriott.

In addition, who wants a "skyline" in SouthPark? I certainly do not! I like the subtle residential mix w/ upscale shopping. And you are sadly misinformed when you say there is no major retail on the scale of Lenox and Phipps. I do go to Phipps to shop - the only place I shop at Lenox is Bloomies, wh/ we do not have here in CLT. HOWEVER - SouthPark does have Nordstrom and Neiman Marcus. Not to mention Tiffany's, Kate Spade, M. Kors, Louis Vuitton, etc. Sure . . . no Saks . . . But to say SouthPark "has no retail" - sorry. Boutiques and niche shoppes - from Williams Sonoma to Crate/Barrel are also in the SP area . . . and SP serves the whole MSA as the upscale shopping district in this region.

And sorry - MARTA stopping at Lenox may be your idea of upscale, but it isn't MINE.

[Akhenaton06]

Originally Posted by adavi215

I also think CLT needs more urban density. An uptown population of 13,000 for a city of 670,000 does not make it look to urban. Charlotte also as an urban area of around 750,000 people but a Primary Census Area of 2.1million. I would say roughly the population of Meck county. This means that roughly 1.3million people live in rural areas of the Charlotte metro region. Atlanta, even though it has a Primary census area of 5.4-5.5 million, only has an urban area of about 4million. So roughly 1.5 million live in "rural" areas of the ATL metro region. Atlanta, compared to cities of its size, lags in its urban area. This meaning it is not as dense or urban as other areas. I think the same can be said about Charlotte compared to city of its size.

This isn't exactly an apples-to-apples comparison here. Atlanta has become so big that its urbanized area has subsumed the smaller urbanized areas within its orbit. Charlotte has not yet gotten to that size which is why the satellite cities in the Charlotte metro area--Rock Hill, Gastonia, Concord, etc.--still have their own urbanized area populations. So it's a bit misleading to say that there are only 750K people (which is an outdated figure from 2000, but the most recent we have) within the urbanized area of the metropolitan area.

CLT compared to Cincinnati, Cleveland, Indianapolis, Nashville, Tampa, Sacramento, etc., is not as "urban."

I'd say that Charlotte is probably just as "urban" as Nashville, Indianapolis, and Tampa in terms of the ratio of urbanized areas to non-urbanized areas within the metro area.

[Akhenaton06]

Originally Posted by atlantaATL

No ritz no W no Intercontential No ritz carlton residences No Westin NO JW marriot. No heavy rail transit system serving 4 differnt train stops in the area NO skyline No 100,000 people living in the are. No major major Retail like phipps ANd lenox combines Lol Southpark can just be a section of Buckhead LOL !!!!!

Actually SouthPark does have a mini-skyline and the mall does have major retail (and there are the shopping centers that surround the mall). SouthPark mall isn't as big as Lennox, but the quality of retail in the two malls are comparable. Even though I'm doubtful, it would be nice to see SouthPark develop into a more walkable area.

[jstn]

Originally Posted by anifani821

And sorry - MARTA stopping at Lenox may be your idea of upscale, but it isn't MINE.

Good point...that's probably why Lenox has turned to trash in the last few years. Face it folks, Buckhead is not anything compared to what it once was. Yuck!