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Old 01-15-2009, 06:55 AM
 
Location: In The Ether
174 posts, read 427,251 times
Reputation: 104

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Here I am in Charlotte, home of the BIG BAILED-OUT BANKS, and I am looking for a banker who is willing to be aggressive.

I have a 30yr mortgage loan that has an interest rate that's too high, and I'd like to renegotiate the loan to a lower interest rate. (This is not a "modification." It is not a foreclosure or "pre-foreclosure." There is no risk of foreclosure at all. I just want a better interest rate.)

You'd think this would be simple, especially considering that I have a credit rating in the 800s (higher than most mortgage brokers), that the property is worth much more than the balance of the loan, and that I have an excellent history as an investor working with the biggest banks around.

But alas, I am hitting the wall. Yes, this is an investment property. It is not in Charlotte, but in Baltimore. But it's rented long-term, Balt City Lead Certified, and in excellent condition in a great neighborhood... And it has this mortgage already on it! (I would be happy to supply all this documentation.) Yes, I want to avoid an appraisal that bothers my tenants. I can supply two recent appraisals of the property, and we're the kind of landlords who don't bug our trusted tenants with superfluous inspections and intrusions. Deep checking using available resources and the usual drive-by inspection would yield a fine appraisal for the purposes of renegotiating this mortgage rate down, especially if you're a local Baltimorean and you know your values.

So, how aggressive are you? Do you want to snatch a solid 30yr mortgage from a big (Charlotte) bank and give a historically good customer a better rate without making him leap thru rings of fire and fight goblins to do it? Lower my rate, don't charge me out the butt for it, and don't bother my tenants, and you'll have a customer for life who knows the value of good word-of-mouth among local investors and real estate movers and shakers.

Post if you've got the goods, and we'll talk.

Thanks!

MC
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Old 01-15-2009, 08:54 AM
 
Location: State of Being
35,885 posts, read 67,009,663 times
Reputation: 22370
I feel your pain, but don't you think that - even w/ your excellent credit and history - you are trying to dictate terms by demanding no appraisal? I mean . . . how much can ANY broker help you if the lender requires that appraisal?
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Old 01-17-2009, 08:26 AM
 
Location: In The Ether
174 posts, read 427,251 times
Reputation: 104
I know. How dare I try to dictate terms. Billions in bail out money -- and I'm still paying my mortgage like a good sucker -- and I have some nerve... But, really, there's no need for this hassle. I have recent appraisals, there's zillow.com etc... A truly aggressive banker could work in these perameters for this kind of small loan. It's nothing they have not done before.

It's infuriating to me that good customers, with excellent credit and a good history, are being punished by the bad bankers for the things they did that didn't involve me. I'm trying, really, to find ways to re-start my business after being halted in my tracks by this mess.

It seems a tiny thing to ask that the appraisal not bother the good, sweet, long-term tenants. Do a drive-by. Do a web search. Anything you do will turn up a value ratio that will make my loan proposal seem fine. (I mean, the amount owed is much much less than the value of the property; I just want a lower interest rate.)

Oh well.

I'll just have to slam it out, pay it off, and no bankers will get any more of my money. Who's the sucker, then? (Still me, of course...)



MC
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Old 01-17-2009, 09:03 AM
 
Location: State of Being
35,885 posts, read 67,009,663 times
Reputation: 22370
As I said earlier . . . I do feel your pain - and I feel your anger on many levels - as a taxpayer, a homeowner and small business owner. So I am right there w/ you w/ your frustration. However, rules are rules and if a lender requires that an appraisal be done w/in xx days of loan processing . . . then aren't you trying to "beat the system" in much the same way that irresponsible borrowers tried to "beat the system" by taking out no-doc loans - or in the way that lenders tried to "beat the system" by creating lala land loans wh/ people could have never qualified for had traditional lending terms been imposed?

Aren't you asking a lender to "turn a blind eye" and make an exception for you by not complying w/ the required appraisal? Please - not trying to offend - and I apologize if it sounds that way. I am just saying - seems you are wanting the same kind of an "exception to the rule" that lenders made when they created loans that didn't require enuff documentation and thus, allowed people to get into homes they could not possibly have afforded - and now it is all ending w/ foreclosures.
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Old 01-17-2009, 10:04 AM
 
Location: Charlotte, NC
7,041 posts, read 13,104,253 times
Reputation: 2323
Royal, I am a mortgage underwriter. In this environment, there are NO exceptions being made for anyone. Investment properties are among the riskiest out there. When people get laid off, if there is a choice between paying the mortgage for the home that they are living in or the investment property, guess which one goes by the wayside??

Your attitude..."I am a good customer...blah, blah, blah" is one of the factors that got us into this mess. You and literally millions of others have done this over the years and banks have complied. "Oh, yes, Mr. Customer, you have 800+ scores, let me throw money at you". No documentation, no problem...here you go...have a few thousand grand....then, Mr. Customer gets laid off his six figure job and cannot pay back the loans that he negotiated when he was flush with cash...and the banks end up owning countless properties across the country. In fact, banks own SO MANY properties that they cannot even put them all on the market because it would devastate the entire economy.

So, I do not have a lot of sympathy for you. (sorry) Baltimore is one of the areas hard-hit by foreclosures, so, nothing outside of an actual, physical appraisal would be an accurate judge of your home's value. Chances are, your property is not worth what you think it is due to the foreclosures/short sales in the area. You might not even qualify for the lower loan-to-value requirements that are put in place due to it being an investment property.

If you can pay it off, that would be my best recommendation in this environment. That way, you would have an asset that is worth something (if not worth what you paid for it) with no liens against it AND you are getting the extra bonus of having some income generated by it.

Mortgage bankers are now erring on the side of caution. The days of Mr Good Customer coming in and telling us what they want are gone. The banks are now doing what they should have done for years & years...dictating the terms and if the customer does not like it, well, they can try somewhere else. But, the story is going to be the same everywhere.

I am sorry if this is rather blunt, but, you have hit a nerve. As a mortgage underwriter, I have seen this progression over the years and I am actually thrilled that the tighter restrictions are in place. This affects me, too...I have an investment property that I will never get another loan on as it is raw land. But, that is ok, because I would much rather that our country's economy be stable and that people learned how to manage their assets than having easy access to money that would only ultimately put me (or them) into trouble.
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Old 01-17-2009, 05:32 PM
 
Location: Washington D.C. (Metro)
76 posts, read 168,962 times
Reputation: 31
bump
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Old 01-18-2009, 08:11 AM
 
102 posts, read 285,874 times
Reputation: 23
Quote:
Originally Posted by chicagocubs View Post
Royal, I am a mortgage underwriter. In this environment, there are NO exceptions being made for anyone. Investment properties are among the riskiest out there. When people get laid off, if there is a choice between paying the mortgage for the home that they are living in or the investment property, guess which one goes by the wayside??

Your attitude..."I am a good customer...blah, blah, blah" is one of the factors that got us into this mess. You and literally millions of others have done this over the years and banks have complied. "Oh, yes, Mr. Customer, you have 800+ scores, let me throw money at you". No documentation, no problem...here you go...have a few thousand grand....then, Mr. Customer gets laid off his six figure job and cannot pay back the loans that he negotiated when he was flush with cash...and the banks end up owning countless properties across the country. In fact, banks own SO MANY properties that they cannot even put them all on the market because it would devastate the entire economy.

So, I do not have a lot of sympathy for you. (sorry) Baltimore is one of the areas hard-hit by foreclosures, so, nothing outside of an actual, physical appraisal would be an accurate judge of your home's value. Chances are, your property is not worth what you think it is due to the foreclosures/short sales in the area. You might not even qualify for the lower loan-to-value requirements that are put in place due to it being an investment property.

If you can pay it off, that would be my best recommendation in this environment. That way, you would have an asset that is worth something (if not worth what you paid for it) with no liens against it AND you are getting the extra bonus of having some income generated by it.

Mortgage bankers are now erring on the side of caution. The days of Mr Good Customer coming in and telling us what they want are gone. The banks are now doing what they should have done for years & years...dictating the terms and if the customer does not like it, well, they can try somewhere else. But, the story is going to be the same everywhere.

I am sorry if this is rather blunt, but, you have hit a nerve. As a mortgage underwriter, I have seen this progression over the years and I am actually thrilled that the tighter restrictions are in place. This affects me, too...I have an investment property that I will never get another loan on as it is raw land. But, that is ok, because I would much rather that our country's economy be stable and that people learned how to manage their assets than having easy access to money that would only ultimately put me (or them) into trouble.

I used to be the mortgage business and have underwritten and am on board with this. If someone crows enough they get what they want those days are WELL behind us now.
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Old 01-18-2009, 10:30 AM
 
1,907 posts, read 4,446,290 times
Reputation: 730
An apraiser spent an hour and a half at out house yesterday. I offered him our original appraisal whidch was only a year old. I figured he could stay warm and not have to measure the outside, etc. He said in this market, he can't take those chances and wasn't going to put his license on the line. We are a slam dunk lenders dream and are refinancing a loan for only 20% of the value of the home. DOSEN"T MATTER!!!!!!
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Old 01-18-2009, 10:47 AM
 
Location: State of Being
35,885 posts, read 67,009,663 times
Reputation: 22370
Quote:
Originally Posted by Doorway View Post
An apraiser spent an hour and a half at out house yesterday. I offered him our original appraisal whidch was only a year old. I figured he could stay warm and not have to measure the outside, etc. He said in this market, he can't take those chances and wasn't going to put his license on the line. We are a slam dunk lenders dream and are refinancing a loan for only 20% of the value of the home. DOSEN"T MATTER!!!!!!
Sure doesn't matter and I only wish lenders had been this stringent over the past five years . . . maybe we wouldn't be in this crappy mess all over the country!!!!!
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Old 01-18-2009, 11:04 AM
 
Location: Washington D.C. (Metro)
76 posts, read 168,962 times
Reputation: 31
Lenders as of January 1st are now requiring that anyone who wants to refinance and pull cash out over 85% LTV (Loan to Value) is required to have 2 appraisals done on the home. This means instead of shelling out $350 for 1 appraisal, now you're having to come out of pocket with $700 on average to pull cash out of your home.

This is actually a guideline across the board and not lender specific too so no matter where you go, that's the deal now.
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