U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > North Carolina > Charlotte
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 11-03-2009, 05:46 AM
 
Location: The place where the road & the sky collide
21,977 posts, read 27,258,015 times
Reputation: 9008

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheEmissary View Post
If that was my 81 year old father, I'd be calling my "friends" in NJ to make sure those kids took a "ride" to rural SC that they'd never return from! "Hey Vito", "come visit me and I'll load up your truck with some free cigarettes"..."I need a favor"! Maybe if some of these thugs "disappeared" after they got out of jail, both the prosecutor and their parents wouldn't object to a long stay in jail. Most likely, they'll be let go and we'll hear about them three or four months from now getting caught doing the same thing! Perhaps, CMPD needs a "Dexter" in their midst to correct the "revolving door of crime" that is perpetually swinging round and round in Charlotte.
Hmmmmmm.......... in South Jersey or South Philly, this could mean large investments in cheese &/or cigarettes, that would make paying the state restitution programs look good.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 11-03-2009, 06:35 AM
 
4,222 posts, read 6,725,654 times
Reputation: 1560
I am glad to see that those that are acquiring conceiled weapon license and guns are increasing significantly. If these punks feel that someone is conceiling a weapon, they will think twice. I am personally ready at all times, in or outside of the house and inside of my car. Being prepared probably saved my life during one incident. I believe some of the bad neighborhoods need to get with the police departments and form neighborhood watch programs.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-03-2009, 06:37 AM
 
4,222 posts, read 6,725,654 times
Reputation: 1560
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheEmissary View Post
If that was my 81 year old father, I'd be calling my "friends" in NJ to make sure those kids took a "ride" to rural SC that they'd never return from! "Hey Vito", "come visit me and I'll load up your truck with some free cigarettes"..."I need a favor"! Maybe if some of these thugs "disappeared" after they got out of jail, both the prosecutor and their parents wouldn't object to a long stay in jail. Most likely, they'll be let go and we'll hear about them three or four months from now getting caught doing the same thing! Perhaps, CMPD needs a "Dexter" in their midst to correct the "revolving door of crime" that is perpetually swinging round and round in Charlotte.

Yes! Dexter or Charles Bronson.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-03-2009, 08:25 AM
Status: "North of Palm Trees, South of High Taxes" (set 6 days ago)
 
Location: Noth Caccalacca
5,599 posts, read 6,691,901 times
Reputation: 4903
Quote:
Originally Posted by BrianH1970 View Post
Give 'em a wood shampoo, slide 'em alongside that batch of DVD players, take 'em to Secaucus and dump 'em off of route 3.

That's the way we do things.

heh
Or a trip in a plastic bag over the Paterson Falls to end up as "One-a-Day in Newark Bay!
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-03-2009, 09:52 AM
 
Location: State of Being
35,885 posts, read 67,154,265 times
Reputation: 22373
I am so glad to find that others feel something has to be done.

I want to emphasize that I am not targeting any one group of kids. There was another attack in Plaza Midwood this past weekend by another group of kids - I was told hispanic/latino thugs. So this behavior is not limited to one ethnic group. It is not exclusively black or hispanic and we also see white kids breaking into houses, so this is behavior across the spectrum. It seems to me to be more associated with the make up of the home - everything from lousy parenting to poverty to drug use and school delinquency.

Since the parents can't seem to get a grip on these kids, then I see no way to get the message across that communities are no longer gonna tolerate this bullying behavior in schools and the violence on our streets and the invasions into our homes - unless we reach the folks who helped create the mess: the parents.

We sure can pour the money into all these programs for "at risk" kids. Yet, what good is it doing? Why are we spending millions of dollars to reach kids who are getting no training or discipline or moral values at home? It is obviously an attempt to try to overcome the lack of parenting but it is NOT WORKING.

So I don't see any solution except going back to the place where this all starts - AT HOME. We are subsidizing families who birth kids who then disrespect the society feeding them. This is NUTS!!!!

If parents cannot handle their kids, then shouldn't there be a way to make them wards of the state? I thought there was a way to do this. Wouldn't it be better for parents to admit their kid is a thug and call law enforcement or Social Services for help? But the only way that is going to happen is if the parents FEAR that they will lose their monthly checks and/or their housing subsidy. Right now, folks who KNOW these kids have committed crimes will not come forward b/c they FEAR the kids!!! I think fearing getting thrown on the street homeless might be enuff incentive to move parents to get help for these wannabe gangsta kids BEFORE they get themselves in big trouble - and harm others around them.

If someone has a better idea, then I bow to those suggestions. We have been throwing money at this problem for how many years now? It is not working! We need to try something else.

Time to hold parents responsible - in a meaningful way. Take away their vouchers and subsidy checks and see if that doesn't get folks motivated.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-03-2009, 10:05 AM
 
Location: Yellow cottage, green doors.
16,397 posts, read 13,097,524 times
Reputation: 72231
You can't be punishing parents for the punk's behaviour. Electrocute the little punks.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-03-2009, 10:16 AM
 
Location: State of Being
35,885 posts, read 67,154,265 times
Reputation: 22373
Quote:
Originally Posted by rainroosty View Post
You can't be punishing parents for the punk's behaviour. Electrocute the little punks.
You can't? Why? We are talking kids who have rap sheets by age 16! And their status as juveniles protects them from prosecution.

Kids don't get this way for no reason. As Mr. Robinson said - no one bothered to raise these kids.

The parents are responsible. Why should the rest of us suffer at the hands of these miscreants b/c the parents were irresponsible?

Last time I checked, if my dog bites you, I am responsible. You think the custodian/parent of a child should be held less accountable than a dog owner?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-03-2009, 11:23 AM
Status: "North of Palm Trees, South of High Taxes" (set 6 days ago)
 
Location: Noth Caccalacca
5,599 posts, read 6,691,901 times
Reputation: 4903
Quote:
Originally Posted by anifani821 View Post
I am so glad to find that others feel something has to be done.

I want to emphasize that I am not targeting any one group of kids. There was another attack in Plaza Midwood this past weekend by another group of kids - I was told hispanic/latino thugs. So this behavior is not limited to one ethnic group. It is not exclusively black or hispanic and we also see white kids breaking into houses, so this is behavior across the spectrum. It seems to me to be more associated with the make up of the home - everything from lousy parenting to poverty to drug use and school delinquency.

Since the parents can't seem to get a grip on these kids, then I see no way to get the message across that communities are no longer gonna tolerate this bullying behavior in schools and the violence on our streets and the invasions into our homes - unless we reach the folks who helped create the mess: the parents.

We sure can pour the money into all these programs for "at risk" kids. Yet, what good is it doing? Why are we spending millions of dollars to reach kids who are getting no training or discipline or moral values at home? It is obviously an attempt to try to overcome the lack of parenting but it is NOT WORKING.

So I don't see any solution except going back to the place where this all starts - AT HOME. We are subsidizing families who birth kids who then disrespect the society feeding them. This is NUTS!!!!

If parents cannot handle their kids, then shouldn't there be a way to make them wards of the state? I thought there was a way to do this. Wouldn't it be better for parents to admit their kid is a thug and call law enforcement or Social Services for help? But the only way that is going to happen is if the parents FEAR that they will lose their monthly checks and/or their housing subsidy. Right now, folks who KNOW these kids have committed crimes will not come forward b/c they FEAR the kids!!! I think fearing getting thrown on the street homeless might be enuff incentive to move parents to get help for these wannabe gangsta kids BEFORE they get themselves in big trouble - and harm others around them.

If someone has a better idea, then I bow to those suggestions. We have been throwing money at this problem for how many years now? It is not working! We need to try something else.

Time to hold parents responsible - in a meaningful way. Take away their vouchers and subsidy checks and see if that doesn't get folks motivated.
ani - I am always outraged when I read these stories but there are some factors which create them in the first place. It isn't a matter of race! When was the last time you read of Bill Cosby or George Lopez holding up a 7-11 store? It's mainly economics. We have had a permanent subclass of poor people in this country for most of the 20th century. Unfortunately, state and federal subsidies help to perpetuate them in their current forms. Some of this state's policies are p*ss-poor in this regard. What gives, with CMS schools using an abstinence-only policy for so many years? It's "failure" produces parents and babies. Will Medicaid pay for an abortion for the pregnant 16 year old daughter of the 32 year old welfare mother who wants one? I don't believe so! But they'll happily pay for formula and food for her kid after it's born. Does Planned Parenthood make visits to high schools to hand out condoms to the boys? I doubt it! Policies like this, produce vast quantities of "unwanted kids" with overwhelmed teen-age parents and thirty-something grandparents who don't have a clue! This happens in rural as well as urban areas. These kids are the ones who grow up to be the "thuggies" of the urban areas and the "trailer-trash meth-lab operators" in the "sticks".

What's the answer? Education of all parties involved! If you want "welfare mom" to get off of it, perhaps paying for her to go to school to better herself might be cheaper than paying down the road for all those kids she might have that will end up in jail. When you weigh the costs of the education (a couple of thousand dollars for welfare mom) vs the ($26,000 to keep her teen-ager in jail for a year in Mecklenburg County) it does make economic sense. Better family planning on both the state and federal level couldn't hurt either!
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-03-2009, 11:39 AM
 
Location: State of Being
35,885 posts, read 67,154,265 times
Reputation: 22373
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheEmissary View Post
ani - I am always outraged when I read these stories but there are some factors which create them in the first place. It isn't a matter of race! When was the last time you read of Bill Cosby or George Lopez holding up a 7-11 store? It's mainly economics. We have had a permanent subclass of poor people in this country for most of the 20th century. Unfortunately, state and federal subsidies help to perpetuate them in their current forms. Some of this state's policies are p*ss-poor in this regard. What gives, with CMS schools using an abstinence-only policy for so many years? It's "failure" produces parents and babies. Will Medicaid pay for an abortion for the pregnant 16 year old daughter of the 32 year old welfare mother who wants one? I don't believe so! But they'll happily pay for formula and food for her kid after it's born. Does Planned Parenthood make visits to high schools to hand out condoms to the boys? I doubt it! Policies like this, produce vast quantities of "unwanted kids" with overwhelmed teen-age parents and thirty-something grandparents who don't have a clue! This happens in rural as well as urban areas. These kids are the ones who grow up to be the "thuggies" of the urban areas and the "trailer-trash meth-lab operators" in the "sticks".

What's the answer? Education of all parties involved! If you want "welfare mom" to get off of it, perhaps paying for her to go to school to better herself might be cheaper than paying down the road for all those kids she might have that will end up in jail. When you weigh the costs of the education (a couple of thousand dollars for welfare mom) vs the ($26,000 to keep her teen-ager in jail for a year in Mecklenburg County) it does make economic sense. Better family planning on both the state and federal level couldn't hurt either!
I agree with what you are saying about emphasizing education, birth control, etc. but the problem is not as simple as just doing that.

Folks have learned to "game the system" and having babies is one way to increase the monthly subsidy. Kids become meal tickets. So these welfare mommas are not interested in abortion or adoption. They WANT the kids cause this means more $$$ every month, plus a certain "status" they feel they will instantly have b/c they have had a baby.

These babies become kids who have not been parented. It is not a matter of simply educating - as long as we keep rewarding folks for having kids by giving them $$$$ for services and monthly subsistence, they are gonna keep having babies as a means to an end.

There are counseling services all over this state wh/ will help women get abortions or put their babies up for adoption - but the only women who use them are women who truly don't feel they are ready to have children. Sadly, the folks who SHOULD be putting their kids up for adoption need to be able to list the kids on their Social Services application . . . and the more, the merrier as far as they are concerned - BIGGER CHECKS.

You can't GIVE someone an education. They have to want it. Everyone could graduate from high school (it's free!!!) and they are not even doing that. For those who want an education and want a better life, that is already available. Our community colleges educate students on many different types of loans, grants and scholarships. It is very easy to get $$ for these degrees. However, the problem is not with folks who want to make a life for themselves - it is with a certain class of entitled welfare recipients who depend on public subsidies to underwrite their existence. Some are on drugs, others are just gamers.

The only way to stop this madness is to stop rewarding people for spawning kids who are destined to be raised in poverty and neglect. The second method is to FORCE people to face consequences for their lousy choices and refusal to parent. Once a child is brought into this world, we can't expect him/her to become more than they are exposed to at home. Add to that the influences in the neighborhood and you have a formula for disaster. But since the influence of school and education doesn't appear to be enough to keep most of these children on track . . . then the only place to make a difference is at home. Parents who refuse to parent need to be held responsible for the behavior of their kids.

These kids were brought into this world as a meal ticket. Turn this around. If irresponsible parents figured out that they will lose their housing and/or subsidies should their kid turn into a repeat offender by 15 . . . perhaps those parents will feel it is the most important thing in their lives to raise decent kids. I believe that for most of us, that is how we live - we know the most important task we have on this earth is to raise our children to be decent citizens. Let's give some incentive for those who DO NOT feel that way.

Last edited by brokensky; 11-03-2009 at 11:58 AM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-03-2009, 11:55 AM
Status: "North of Palm Trees, South of High Taxes" (set 6 days ago)
 
Location: Noth Caccalacca
5,599 posts, read 6,691,901 times
Reputation: 4903
Quote:
Originally Posted by anifani821 View Post
I agree with what you are saying about emphasizing education, birth control, etc. but the problem is not as simple as just doing that.

Folks have learned to "game the system" and having babies is one way to increase the monthly subsidy. Kids become meal tickets. So these welfare mommas are not interested in abortion or adoption. They WANT the kids cause this means more $$$ every month, plus a certain "status" they feel they will instantly have b/c they have had a baby.

These babies become kids who have not been parented. It is not a matter of simply educating - as long as we keep rewarding folks for having kids by giving them $$$$ for services and monthly subsistence, they are gonna keep having babies as a means to an end.

There are counseling services all over this state wh/ will help women get abortions or put their babies up for adoption - but the only women who use them are women who truly don't feel they are ready to have children. Sadly, the folks who SHOULD be putting their kids up for adoption need to be able to list the kids on their Social Services application . . . and the more, the merrier as far as they are concerned.
ani - I so agree! Education is just a part of the solution. Maybe the Chinese "solution" might work for welfare, altho' it's a little heavy-handed!
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:



Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > North Carolina > Charlotte
Similar Threads
View detailed profiles of:
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

2005-2019, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top