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I wish I had never bothered to post on this thread.
Honestly.
I was trying to point out that you can't convict someone (Helms) of breaking a law when no law exists.
And you can't say that Roberts is ineffective for not censuring Helms when there is no clearly defined written policy.
Now this is getting turned around into my supporting invasive local government.
DANG.
No one is turning this around Ani. You brought up the part about bringing in alot of tax money (which is irrelevant). My point was that if you use that as an example, you're advocating government control of this which is what most are against.
The ALE said he broke several laws....(they haven't specifically laid them out).
What he did was unethical and wrong (since he returned the money, duh). But he's too arrogant to apologize and admit what he did was wrong. I think many would've dropped it if he did that right away.....you agree?
Payola is a word I used and I stand by that word. It means buying influence.
When not 1 but 2 liquor distributors treat the local ABC officials, who decide what booze gets sold in the local liquor stores, to dinners costing $12,000, it is an attempt at buying influence. i.e. Payola. This attempt at Payola is clearly against state law, state law that some have said they don't believe covers the officials, but definately covers the distributors. Said officials should have said NO, you are breaking the law and we won't be a part of it. But this didn't happen. It's Payola. There is no other explanation. If not, then I want them to send me a coupon for 2 $400 dinners at Del Friscos.
I still don't understand the reason that people are so willing to give out free passes for this behavior.
No one is turning this around Ani. You brought up the part about bringing in alot of tax money (which is irrelevant). My point was that if you use that as an example, you're advocating government control of this which is what most are against.
The ALE said he broke several laws....(they haven't specifically laid them out).
What he did was unethical and wrong (since he returned the money, duh). But he's too arrogant to apologize and admit what he did was wrong. I think many would've dropped it if he did that right away.....you agree?
It is not irrelevant that the ABC system brings in lots of revenue. Several people slammed the system b/c the high taxes made cost higher for purchase of liquor in this county. My point was - that tax money helps offset what the rest of us pay in taxes. So I believe that is anything but irrelevant (unless you don't care that your taxes go up).
Detectives and investigators turn in reports all the time that have their conclusions but it is up to the judicial branch as to whether or not the conclusions can result in an indictment. If the law is not applicable, then any recommendations from ALE can't be acted upon.
I think Helms is an ass. But no, I don't think it would have made any difference had he apologized sooner. When he made that decision to attend the meal at that particular restaurant, he knew damn well that it would be an expensive meal. He should never have accepted the invite. All the apologies in the world don't change the message that his behavior sent.
Regardless, his attending that dinner (apology or not) doesn't rise to the level of "mafia-like" behavior, etc.
If you privatize the system, you would collect substantial property tax revenue for the the city and county. IMO, you would probably come up short, but only by a small difference IMO. You would then (as NC residents) have a larger selection at much lower prices.
In addition to what Helms did, it just makes me cringe when I hear arguments for (the ABC system) is about "monitoring", "control" and "regulation".......which it IS a total double standard.....
If you privatize the system, you would collect substantial property tax revenue for the the city and county. IMO, you would probably come up short, but only by a small difference IMO. You would then (as NC residents) have a larger selection at much lower prices.
In addition to what Helms did, it just makes me cringe when I hear arguments for (the ABC system) is about "monitoring", "control" and "regulation".......which it IS a total double standard.....
Well, I just like the taxes that the ABC system brings in. What I would like to see done is to legalize marijuana and sell it through the ABC system. They are set up to "regulate" and it seems that would work well with pot. And it would bring in even more taxes plus de-criminalize purchasing pot.
I am not excusing Helms' behavior! But the whole premise of this thread has been that the political system here in Charlotte is corrupt, and Jennifer Roberts is a louse for not censuring Helms since he broke the law. He didn't break a law b/c no such law applies to board members.
Doesn't mean the guy isn't morally corrupt. But to call this tempest in a teapot over a meal an example of political corruption in MECK - honestly, let's find a time when ballots are defaced to affect the outcome of an election . . . or a board member is paid off by a developer to get him/her to push through a zoning change . . . before we start charging forth with indictments for political corruption.
Sure, it was tacky and reeks of elitism for Helms to have sat there and gorged himself on wine and lobster, but for heaven's sake . . . it doesn't rise to the level of Tony Soprano paying off government officials.
Well, I just like the taxes that the ABC system brings in. What I would like to see done is to legalize marijuana and sell it through the ABC system. They are set up to "regulate" and it seems that would work well with pot. And it would bring in even more taxes plus de-criminalize purchasing pot.
I am not excusing Helms' behavior! But the whole premise of this thread has been that the political system here in Charlotte is corrupt, and Jennifer Roberts is a louse for not censuring Helms since he broke the law. He didn't break a law b/c no such law applies to board members.
Doesn't mean the guy isn't morally corrupt. But to call this tempest in a teapot over a meal an example of political corruption in MECK - honestly, let's find a time when ballots are defaced to affect the outcome of an election . . . or a board member is paid off by a developer to get him/her to push through a zoning change . . . before we start charging forth with indictments for political corruption.
Sure, it was tacky and reeks of elitism for Helms to have sat there and gorged himself on wine and lobster, but for heaven's sake . . . it doesn't rise to the level of Tony Soprano paying off government officials.
We don't know for sure if he's broken any laws or not. The ABC (antiquated beverage commission) has different layers of laws that even Jenefir Roberts doesn't know...(just listen to her dance around what to do about Helms...)
Keith Larson | Homepage (http://larson.wbt.com/index.cfm;jsessionid=2a30172ad425fc8d5f0c546019279 7023382?section=guest&ID=486 - broken link)
There is an unexplained dichotomy between support for government controlled booze versus opposition to government controlled health care.
If you are referring to my stance on those issues, you have no idea what my stance is. I play devil's advocate on this forum regularly. I like to see both sides of a discussion represented.
We don't know for sure if he's broken any laws or not. The ABC (antiquated beverage commission) has different layers of laws that even Jenefir Roberts doesn't know...(just listen to her dance around what to do about Helms...)
Keith Larson | Homepage (http://larson.wbt.com/index.cfm;jsessionid=2a30172ad425fc8d5f0c546019279 7023382?section=guest&ID=486 - broken link)
Really enjoy Keith Larson - thanx so much for the link. Listening to it now. I am sure she is doing a tap dance, lol. Helms put her - and the whole board - in a terrible position.
If you are referring to my stance on those issues, you have no idea what my stance is. I play devil's advocate on this forum regularly. I like to see both sides of a discussion represented.
It is just an exercise in debate.
Ahh that explains it. I only post stuff that I believe in.
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