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Old 12-12-2011, 08:24 AM
 
Location: Full time RV"er
2,403 posts, read 5,619,244 times
Reputation: 1459

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Quote:
Originally Posted by ofcjim40 View Post
Fighter, I've now read many articles about verified complaint and still have zero idea how it applies here. All I've read is how for issues such as this it does t apply and those who have tried to use it failed. Can you provide us with a credible law link that supports your claims? Fighter, I looked at your post history and it appears you give this same answer on several different States forums yet never explain.

To save us all time here is a 5 page thread from C-D of others trying to get straight answers from Fighter. I can see it will be a circular argument waste of time. I'm done with it.
Traffic Ticket Advice
Thanks for posting the sites, Those apply to California but the constitutional right to due process is your right in all states. Due process means follow the rules. As I states above, private property is just that! what next come into your home without a warrant? If the car was on the street ,Yes he can give you a ticket and you still go to court and fight it. So you may have violated a city code, how were they injured ? there has to be an injury for the court to have jurisdiction to hear the case. Did the apt. mgr call? then they will be required to produce the written complaint in court. Now what is a verified complaint > It is a statement from the complaintent stating their "INJURY" , this must by law be sign in front of a NOTARY, with the notary signature and seal.Thats the law , the courts law!) now look at any ticket , its not there. Now if you have done your research you would know that constitutional law is the highest law of this land , above city codes. As to case law , Well go to" Right to drive, Justice Tolman, State of Washington" read the many cites explaining why constitutional we have the right to free, unrestricted private travel. ( , not commercial use of the highway). Before you state you can't do it , well I and thousands of others have traveled all over this country with out Vehicle plates, or drivers license for this purpose. Hard to believe ? well thats because most people believe when a cop gives you a ticket you are guilty, just pay the fine. Never giving thought to the question " is he doing it for safety reasons or just to make money for the city". In reality no matter how much is said on this matter most people will just complain about their actions rather the get educated on the most important area of your life today "Your constitutional rights" because our leaders are taking them away at a fast pace.
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Old 12-12-2011, 08:31 AM
 
Location: Lake Arlington Heights, IL
5,481 posts, read 10,055,514 times
Reputation: 2784
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fighter 1 View Post
Thanks for posting the sites, Those apply to California but the constitutional right to due process is your right in all states. Due process means follow the rules. As I states above, private property is just that! what next come into your home without a warrant? If the car was on the street ,Yes he can give you a ticket and you still go to court and fight it. So you may have violated a city code, how were they injured ? there has to be an injury for the court to have jurisdiction to hear the case. Did the apt. mgr call? then they will be required to produce the written complaint in court. Now what is a verified complaint > It is a statement from the complaintent stating their "INJURY" , this must by law be sign in front of a NOTARY, with the notary signature and seal.Thats the law , the courts law!) now look at any ticket , its not there. Now if you have done your research you would know that constitutional law is the highest law of this land , above city codes. As to case law , Well go to" Right to drive, Justice Tolman, State of Washington" read the many cites explaining why constitutional we have the right to free, unrestricted private travel. ( , not commercial use of the highway). Before you state you can't do it , well I and thousands of others have traveled all over this country with out Vehicle plates, or drivers license for this purpose. Hard to believe ? well thats because most people believe when a cop gives you a ticket you are guilty, just pay the fine. Never giving thought to the question " is he doing it for safety reasons or just to make money for the city". In reality no matter how much is said on this matter most people will just complain about their actions rather the get educated on the most important area of your life today "Your constitutional rights" because our leaders are taking them away at a fast pace.
And is ALL this worth the OP's time and effort? And if many start doing this, the revenue will just get shifted to higher property tax and then to higher rents. Or higher local sales tax. Or another revenue source. We're talking a lousy $35-$50 sticker, right? It's still cheaper than states that require you to pay yearly property tax on your vehicle , right?
IMO, it's less of hassle to have a driver's license, plates, and home address vehicle sticker than to spend ALL that time fighting tickets. But if that's your "hobby", more power to ya.
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Old 12-12-2011, 08:48 AM
 
Location: Full time RV"er
2,403 posts, read 5,619,244 times
Reputation: 1459
Quote:
Originally Posted by cubssoxfan View Post
And is ALL this worth the OP's time and effort? And if many start doing this, the revenue will just get shifted to higher property tax and then to higher rents. Or higher local sales tax. Or another revenue source. We're talking a lousy $35-$50 sticker, right? It's still cheaper than states that require you to pay yearly property tax on your vehicle , right?
IMO, it's less of hassle to have a driver's license, plates, and home address vehicle sticker than to spend ALL that time fighting tickets. But if that's your "hobby", more power to ya.
As I stated earler, we loose our rights "one " at a time. Now I ask one last question, Was it not worth the time to fight?.
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Old 12-12-2011, 08:52 AM
 
Location: Lake Arlington Heights, IL
5,481 posts, read 10,055,514 times
Reputation: 2784
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fighter 1 View Post
As I stated earler, we loose our rights "one " at a time. Now I ask one last question, Was it not worth the time to fight?.
For THAT? NO.
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Old 12-12-2011, 01:27 PM
 
587 posts, read 1,481,637 times
Reputation: 506
Simply put Fighter is wrong. Sorry, you will be unable to provide any proof of your claims. Your Justice Tolman defense is from 80 years ago. First it doesn't cover what you say it does. Second it no longer applies. Please stop giving people dangerous advice in the rare chance that someone might truly believe you. I'm not sure if you are delusional or are intentionally trying to confuse people.
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Old 12-12-2011, 02:00 PM
 
Location: Full time RV"er
2,403 posts, read 5,619,244 times
Reputation: 1459
Quote:
Originally Posted by ofcjim40 View Post
Simply put Fighter is wrong. Sorry, you will be unable to provide any proof of your claims. Your Justice Tolman defense is from 80 years ago. First it doesn't cover what you say it does. Second it no longer applies. Please stop giving people dangerous advice in the rare chance that someone might truly believe you. I'm not sure if you are delusional or are intentionally trying to confuse people.
Yep ! one of us is confused and dosen't want to hear the truth, Oh now I see are you a former police officer? that would explain it all.
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Old 12-12-2011, 02:14 PM
 
49 posts, read 106,936 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cubssoxfan View Post
Really? I guess I missed the part in the Constitution about "Right to drive car". Was it next to "Right to bear arms"? And here I thought a drivers license was a privilege one had to earn by taking drivers ed, passing drivers exams and following rules of the road! Silly me
As far as the constitutional "right to bear arms" goes. Let's just say I'm ready for the zombie apocolypse, and leave it at that.

The supposed "constitutional right to drive a car" might be more closely related to the supposed "constitututional laws prohibiting income tax" and delusional belief some still hold that income taxes are voluntary. A number of those cases have gone to court, and to the best of my knowledge the IRS has won, every time.

However, whether or not driving car is a constitutional right? I'm not familiar with the supposed legal basis for making that particular constitututional claim, or how sound, or flimsey that basis may be, but it doesn't really matter. All that matters is which side the jury agrees with. Their verdict represents nothing more than their opinion, and in that particular neck of the woods, everyone knows everyone else, and that guy is quite the character, extremely entertaining and well liked.

And then, there's always "jury nullification" which basically means that juries can decide that the law is bad one, and in their opinion, does not serve the cause of justice, and rule against the law on that basis, and that basis alone. They have every legal right to do so too.

If laws really were that "black and white" courts would not exist because there would be no need for them. Again, the law is open to interpretation and verdicts represent nothing more than the "opinion" of either the judge or jury. Opinions can vary greatly and usually do.

Quote:
And regarding this debate about the city sticker, let me share some advice a Business Law professor once shared. You may be legally correct. BUT can you prove it in a court of law, AND how much will it cost you in time and $$?? IMO this is not worth it. And besides, if too many people "blow off" purchasing city stickers, they will just need to find another method to tax you; so in the end they will get their $.
Gee, first thing my professor taught us in Law 101 was to forget those silly notions about justice. The law was designed for one purpose, and one purpose alone, namely "to keep the peace." Prior to courts of law, people would often resolve their differences by running around and killing each other, so it was a means of ending the bloodshed. For the most part anyway.

As far as proving my case in court goes, well, I go to court fairly often. Most recently, just last week in fact, but that was just a tenant eviction on behalf of a relative. I haven't lost yet, but whether or not I actually proved anything by doing so, is nothing more than a matter of opinion.
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Old 12-12-2011, 02:31 PM
 
Location: Lake Arlington Heights, IL
5,481 posts, read 10,055,514 times
Reputation: 2784
Geez, all this over a $35-$50 city sticker?
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Old 12-12-2011, 02:38 PM
 
183 posts, read 271,985 times
Reputation: 164
What suburb do you live in? I paid 85 plus 15 for zoned parking sticker in Chicago.
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Old 12-12-2011, 02:54 PM
 
Location: Lake Arlington Heights, IL
5,481 posts, read 10,055,514 times
Reputation: 2784
Quote:
Originally Posted by themag62 View Post
What suburb do you live in? I paid 85 plus 15 for zoned parking sticker in Chicago.
Please see the box in the upper right hand corner, opposite my user name labeled: location.
Suburbs are typically cheaper and often waaaay cheaper than Chicago vehicle stickers. Part of the "premium" of city living
I believe we pay $35.
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