Why on earth would city folks move to suburbs (Chicago: cheap house, zoning)

[via chicago]

Originally Posted by Drover

God forbid someone might want a little space for his own mental health. Dude, he moved to the suburbs. You make it sound like he retreated to a mountaintop shack in Nepal. Good God, what is it with you? Why are you so vitriolic toward anybody's preferences but your own? Live and let live, people.

Because I fundamentally disagree with the urban planning process which modern suburbs have been built around. If someone wants to live there thats their decision. But I'm probably still going to say I disagree with the choice, because ultimately that choice affects the entire region. Dosent mean its right or wrong. Just means its my opinion.

[rgb123]

the urban planning process? Like what happened in the 40's, 50's and up to the 70's was some master plan?

If your gonna point your anger somewhere point it in the direction of developers.

There are very dedicated (and not rich) individuals working to make the whole metro area function better and to correct at least some of the mistakes of the past and to actually "plan" more in the future. (not to say it really is or was as bad anyway though, as you suggest)

But you make it sound like its some diabolical plan, and zoning, codes, and laws and loopholes never existed and don't now....and that they are somehow static through time with some super suburb monsters pushing the buttons on some master planning machine housed somewhere in Schaumburg, that spits out directions to the rest of the metro.

The urban planning "process" is made up of many people (citizens), government planners, non-government planners, the law, developers, the courts.....and what might be a code or a law in Berwyn might be totally different in another suburb.

Scoffing in disgust from your perch in the city isn't helping the problem you seem so worried about. Look up CMAP ......at least most real planners know that the suburbs and the city are a whole....we need to work together for "planning" to occur

and it doesn't take a rocket scientist to see its not exactly easy to get things done overnight, right, or perfect given the amount of stakeholders in the "process"

But just to let you know, there is also not a master transportation planner calling the shots somewhere from an oasis on I-94 talking about adding extra lanes and everyone's gonna have to just like it.

Originally Posted by via chicago

Because I fundamentally disagree with the urban planning process which modern suburbs have been built around. If someone wants to live there thats their decision. But I'm probably still going to say I disagree with the choice, because ultimately that choice affects the entire region. Dosent mean its right or wrong. Just means its my opinion.

[via chicago]

Originally Posted by rgb123

the urban planning process? Like what happened in the 40's, 50's and up to the 70's was some master plan?

If your gonna point your anger somewhere point it in the direction of developers.

By "modern", I meant post WWII. Suburbia as we know it. And no, I'm not a fan of stuff put up from the 50s onward. The stuff early on wasnt great, but what we have now is the same concept except on steroids. And I totally agree that by and large developers are to blame.

[Steve-o]

Originally Posted by via chicago

Because I fundamentally disagree with the urban planning process which modern suburbs have been built around. If someone wants to live there thats their decision. But I'm probably still going to say I disagree with the choice, because ultimately that choice affects the entire region. Dosent mean its right or wrong. Just means its my opinion.

And I quote Will Ferrell in Old School: "Youre crazy. Youre crazy, man! I like you, but youre crazy."

[sbd78]

Originally Posted by via chicago

By "modern", I meant post WWII. Suburbia as we know it. And no, I'm not a fan of stuff put up from the 50s onward. The stuff early on wasnt great, but what we have now is the same concept except on steroids. And I totally agree that by and large developers are to blame.

So what are you proposing? That the suburbs should cease to exist and everyone should live in the city? And where do you propose the city puts these millions of suburban transplants? Start knocking down all the 2 and 3 flats to build high rise after high rise?

I don't know if you've noticed, but many city dwellers are dependent on automobiles as well. Why do you think it takes 2 hours to find a parking space in East Lakeview?

[Chicago60614]

Originally Posted by via chicago

whatever. keep eating up cornfields until we have subdivisions hitting cedar rapids. im not going to agree with you, you're not going to agree with me.

For what it's worth I agree with you 100%.

The exurbs are so unsustainable, if you just think about it a little it makes sense. On a very simple level you have Americans who are just use to ditching what's old and building new. You have an exurb of 75,000 people covering 50 square miles. That's a horribly low population density. Sure it's fine when everything is new and doesn't need to be replaced, and you have good schools because of rich families and lots of money.

Fast forward 50 years. Houses get old, people move on. Roads become old and all need to be resurfaced, utilities get old, schools get old. Now you have poorer people who can't pay horrid taxes to keep all of this upkeep when you're only having a few thousand people pay taxes for all this infrastructure.

You just can't expect another 2 million people moving into Chicago in the next 25 years with another 1.5 million cars. We need to start building SMART communities that make sense - not bulldozing everything in sight with random housing tracts in every direction.

It's not un-american, it's just common sense. Americans are obsessed with cars, and have been for decades. I think the current generation needs to realize that we're living on borrowed time as far as everyone having a car. You can't just have huge functional cities that keep adding hundreds of thousands of cars to the burbs every year. You can see travel times in LA and Atlanta start to really creep up to the point something needs to be done. What's being done is FINALLY a lot of urban infill and the huge growth of housing in the central city.

[Chicago60614]

Originally Posted by quamen

I moved from the suburbs to the north side about 4 years ago, Belmont and Broadway area, I absolutely hated it. There is no parking, and I love my car (it is not possible to own a nice car and not have it get dinged up and bumped into on a daily basis, I had to leave my vette at my parents house), I hate to have to rely on gross public transportation.

There is no room for personal space, everywhere you go there is other people, the only way to get away from everyone is to your cramped apartment.

I personally couldn’t handle it as of six months ago and moved back to the suburbs. I now have my own yard with lots of room, I can park my car outside in my driveway!, I can drive anywhere I want and not worry about people breaking into my car and I can also find parking right away .

Everyone saying there are no great local restaurants in the suburbs obviously haven’t spent any time out there, as there are plenty. Some of the best bars around Chicago are in the suburbs as well.

Over all if you like your space, and don’t like crime and drunk people messin with your stuff and your car all night, you will enjoy the suburbs.

That's actually really interesting given my situation. I have friends at work who went through what you went through, so I'm certainly not saying it's bad. People are people - we're all different.

I've lived in Lakeview for the past 4 years and came from a burb (not of Chicago) and was ADDICTED to my car. Within a few months I grew to hate my car, as it was just as easy to grab a bus or train somewhere, and it cost so damn much, not to mention PARKING.

I lived in a small place with my roommate, but we loved it. Made it our cozy little oasis where we could sit and do what we wanted and look out at the bustling city and people wander by at all hours. I absolutely LOVE the urbanity of the north side. I like riding public transit and walking the busy streets - just feeling like i'm part of a collective community. Growing up I couldn't imagine giving up my car, let alone riding a CITY BUS. Today though, I love being able to feel like I belong to something larger. I go home and my parents just drive everywhere, live in a suburb where the nearest neighbor is 200 feet away....it all seems so secluded. You see someone in your yard and your first reaction is startled/fear/confusion.

[rgb123]

Look at Europe....Holland for instance, its almost entirely urban and "filled in" with large tracts of farms. The difference is they have excellent transportation systems.

There is no reason the suburbs and exurbs cannot be sustainable. The transportation systems are the problem. We need more trains with more connections, not just spokes to the city.

We also need to preserve open space, and people need open space. Density and "building up" looks good on paper....but not neccessarily in reality.

Cornfields are not exactly fully sustainable either, and are not the only use of land outside of the urban core.

The suburbs may not have been expertly planned, but a lot of the resolution is not to abolish them, but to make them more walkable in themself, bikable, and to connect cities better (cities, meaning all of the urban cores of the suburbs and exurbs).

This has already happened or improved SO much in the last few years. People get it and want that to happen . To look down one's nose at this situation does sound simply snobbish or uninformed.

[Windy City John]

I think the State of IL should create an elevated rapid train sytem in the shape of a "C" that connects Highland Park - Arlington Heights - Wheaton - Naperville - Bollingbrook and Oak Lawn. The can pay for it by having a casino at every station.

[via chicago]

Originally Posted by Windy City John

I think the State of IL should create an elevated rapid train sytem in the shape of a "C" that connects Highland Park - Arlington Heights - Wheaton - Naperville - Bollingbrook and Oak Lawn. The can pay for it by having a casino at every station.

STAR Line anyone?
Metra Connects : Proposed New Starts