Which Chicago suburb have the worst reputation ? (Tinley Park, Harvey: real estate, crime rate)

[promis1]

Originally Posted by ajolotl

Where will you go?

Australia.

[promis1]

Originally Posted by At1WithNature

Well, there's no denying that. but if you give a minority money, the problems/crime seem to stop. this is why income is the most important indicator IMO. I think it starts with education and the government leadership. it's too bad that a lot of minority laden cities (such as Harvey) are corrupt to the bone and mismanage city funds that take away from the youth and their citizens as a whole. If minorities were given better education opportunities (at the local level) and better leadership (in the local government) then i think they would have a better income which, i believe, would lead to less strain on taxpayer's pockets (like yours and mine) and lead to less crime. And most importantly, improving their lives and the lives of others.

Good post, but lets not depend on government leadership. We will be disappointed if we do. Let us make the parents accountable to be leaders to the youth- and lets avoid parents from fleeing and making their kids everyone elses problem.

[Lookout Kid]

Originally Posted by promis1

That is your opinion but I know that Oak Park was a much safer place 40 years ago. Diversity in the community,especially in their high school has not made this town any safer. In fact, there are parts of Oak park that are quite unsafe to walk at night-say the corner of Lake/Austin or anywhere in that vicinity. Oak Park is a town that is known for its extreme liberalism- you either will love or hate this town I personally cannot stand this town as I feel that there is something in the water there that makes people so darn weird. If America becomes a big Oak Park- I will leave this country and never look back.

Oak Park's issues with crime are largely from it's proximity to other high-crime areas, like Chicago's Austin neighborhood and Maywood/Bellwood. If you read the crime blotters, you'll see that very little of the criminal activity in Oak Park comes from within Oak Park.

[Lookout Kid]

I'll add that even though Oak Park has a liberal reputation, "extreme liberalism" isn't really that common. Most Oak Park liberals are educated professionals who fall into a more moderate brand of liberalism. It's not freakin' Berkley. There are a few aging hippie types, some "earth mother" types, and other fringe elements there. But this is not representative of the town as a whole, which is actually quite buttoned up and family friendly.

[oldhousegirl]

Originally Posted by promis1

So why is it that certain minority groups dominate the lower income or poverty level? If these same groups actually have a greater chance of finding a job due to affirmative action, quotas, diversity fairs,etc.-then why do they dominate the lower class. If we need to speak of income- we need to figure why the majority of these minority groups cannot break through poverty levels. Is it because their family structure- having babies and not being held accountable? Is it their work ethic- where they may think that they should not start at the bottom in the work world- where they may blame Mexicans for taking those lower tier jobs. Is it because they would rather collect welfare,link cards, and section 8 vouchers, realizing that if they actually worked, they may lose these benefits. Or is it because many inner city youth may think it is not cool to stay in school- but instead should hang on the corner and sell dope. Whatever the case may be, if we are to look at these cases not by race, but by income-then we must examine why certain groups have not broke through these poverty level in so many years.

In regards to the infamous, "certain groups". I believe there will always be a percentage of people of various races that for a boatload of reasons do not take advantage of potential opportunities. Again, a percentage of, not the whole, not even the majority of any one race. We can talk about poor people all day long. Discuss the whys and why nots of breaking through the poverty levels. Chicago, as will the majority of places, will ALWAYS have poor people. Why are we surprised at that??

Not to say that gains haven't been made by, "certain groups". I won't state the obvious by mentioning that special little event happening in a few days in D.C. However, gains still do need to be made.

But the challenge is in discussing the "certain groups" without the implication that the part is equal to the whole. The majority of the "certain groups" are living viable lives, and are active contributors to society. Now, the rest of the "certain groups", is an entirely different story that again can be dissected until kingdom come. But I believe the main problems are the obvious ones of poor education with low expectations, and clueless parenting.

When you think like this: "I live in substandard housing, don't have a job, don't know how I am going to pay for life's basics, what's the use?" And you have no stable, positive influences in your life that personify success, you're pretty much toast. Some people don't have the ability to visualize a future that can be different. But many people can see ahead to a brighter future, and they think like this: "Momma said I could do big things in my life. We may be poor, but we know that education is the way out. I'll work hard in school, I won't be poor forever." Different people, different life views. Of course this is a gross simplification.

Courage, desperation and circumstances can force people to make choices in difficult situations. Again, everyone is not the same. Think of the traditional American immigrant experience of the early 1900's. Some left for a better future in the new world, but not ALL did. It was variable. Some had the desire for adventure, risk, and could see forward to a better future, others couldn't. Now, the people that stayed in Ireland, Germany, Italy, wherever, was it their poor work ethic, were they content with the "poverty" that was ever present on a daily basis? I doubt it, who knows. But those that chose to stay for whatever reason, were not condemned, looked down upon as ... it was all they could do at that time. And, life went on.

[deechee]

I must say that Country Club Hills is just fine. I live minutes from a nature walk, there are cozy raised ranches and ramblers around me, and there is never a peep heard at night. I have pulled all nighters at home studying, and NOPE, never heard a sound, not even a garage door opening. I have safely walked to the store at nine o'clock at night, and I attend writer's events/conventions for days and sometimes for whole weeks.

My neighbors look out for my home and car, they sometimes get my mail and keep it for me when I ask. I don't know why people would not want to live here.

I think I know the very unfortunate answer. It is because Country Club Hills is nearly 81% black. I have a neighbor who is a white woman who is kind and sweet. She never thinks twice about the fact that her neighbor (me and others) is/are black. We treat her with respect and she treats us with respect. My grandparents (who are an interracial couple) have lived here since the late eighties. They have never experienced violence in their home, neighborhood, or while out shopping.

It saddens me that Country Club Hills, isn't more diverse. I love this area, and I like the proximity to the City of Chicago, but also the wide open land I see when coming home down Cicero.

I hope in the future Country Club Hills, which is still a very nice place to live, becomes more diverse. People are really missing out simply because they are scared to live amongst different folks!

Much love from a recent homeowner

[ajolotl]

Yes, it is true. Most whites tend to avoid black neighborhoods. This is less the case when the neighborhood has some outstanding things going for it(proximity to the lake, loop, great architecture, whatever), but CCH isn't special enough in any way for your average white person to choose it over another similar suburb that is less black (Tinley Park, etc.). I would say this tendency is a mixture of unfamiliarity, exaggerated stereotypes, even ignorance on the one hand and a more sensible reaction to certain undeniable realities on the other. As you know most black neighborhood have a much greater tendency to have some really over the top bad apples in them. There are lots of boring white suburbs where violent crime is almost nonexistent. Wish it weren't true but it seems hard to deny. Even if CCH is relatively safe people will always interpret it in the statistical pool of majority black neighborhoods.

[Chuckity]

Originally Posted by deechee

I must say that Country Club Hills is just fine. I live minutes from a nature walk, there are cozy raised ranches and ramblers around me, and there is never a peep heard at night. I have pulled all nighters at home studying, and NOPE, never heard a sound, not even a garage door opening. I have safely walked to the store at nine o'clock at night, and I attend writer's events/conventions for days and sometimes for whole weeks.

My neighbors look out for my home and car, they sometimes get my mail and keep it for me when I ask. I don't know why people would not want to live here.

I think I know the very unfortunate answer. It is because Country Club Hills is nearly 81% black. I have a neighbor who is a white woman who is kind and sweet. She never thinks twice about the fact that her neighbor (me and others) is/are black. We treat her with respect and she treats us with respect. My grandparents (who are an interracial couple) have lived here since the late eighties. They have never experienced violence in their home, neighborhood, or while out shopping.

It saddens me that Country Club Hills, isn't more diverse. I love this area, and I like the proximity to the City of Chicago, but also the wide open land I see when coming home down Cicero.

I hope in the future Country Club Hills, which is still a very nice place to live, becomes more diverse. People are really missing out simply because they are scared to live amongst different folks!

Much love from a recent homeowner

Um, yeah. Scared to live amongst the murderers.

You know, the people who murdered FIVE people in in CC Hills a week and a half earlier this year?

[deechee]

Originally Posted by Chuckity

Um, yeah. Scared to live amongst the murderers.

You know, the people who murdered FIVE people in in CC Hills a week and a half earlier this year?

Last I recall, ya know, since I live here; the murders were not connected, and they were ALL domestic. Sorry, just discounted your story that CC Hills is falling to the pits?

And why don't you come check it out yourself?

[deechee]

Originally Posted by ajolotl

Yes, it is true. Most whites tend to avoid black neighborhoods. This is less the case when the neighborhood has some outstanding things going for it(proximity to the lake, loop, great architecture, whatever), but CCH isn't special enough in any way for your average white person to choose it over another similar suburb that is less black (Tinley Park, etc.). I would say this tendency is a mixture of unfamiliarity, exaggerated stereotypes, even ignorance on the one hand and a more sensible reaction to certain undeniable realities on the other. As you know most black neighborhood have a much greater tendency to have some really over the top bad apples in them. There are lots of boring white suburbs where violent crime is almost nonexistent. Wish it weren't true but it seems hard to deny. Even if CCH is relatively safe people will always interpret it in the statistical pool of majority black neighborhoods.

I understand, although it deeply saddens me.