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I am not race baiting-just simply stating realities. The problem is that so many liberals are not realistic-they have an idea of how the world should be- a utopia where everyone loves each other. The truth is I as a white male cannot even walk in many inner city, black areas without being robbed or jumped because I am white. So I am looking for my safehaven.
That's very exaggerated. You can walk freely around most black areas an no one will pay any attention to you.
Still, I'm not sure why some people see the need to excoriate you for preferring to live in a white upper-middle-class area. Who cares? Personally, it's not my preference, and not really so much because it isn't "real" to avoid the crippled, homeless, destitute, underemployed, miserable, whatever. There's something I find cheesy about places like Orland. The homogeneity of thought bores me.
More practically, though, I sense that many of these white-flight destinations won't be very resilient to what lies ahead . Soon, middle and upper-middle-class blacks and Latinos will move out there to enjoy the same benefits (schools, shopping, low crime). If everyone has your attitude then your white safe haven will be gone within five years.
Much better to move somewhere that has embraced and managed racial diversity and overcome white flight. These places won't disappear overnight when Hispanics or blacks start to move in. When people stay put property values don't decline and the quality of new home buyers will be high (regardless of race). Soon, you'll realize that, regardless of superficial cultural differences, you are likely to have as much in common as with anyone in someplace like Orland Park. Unless you can build a wall around your community, this is the best way to thrive.
That's very exaggerated. You can walk freely around most black areas an no one will pay any attention to you...
I hate to defend (however indirectly) the guy you directed this comment to, but your assertion is ridiculous while bordering on insanely ignorant and purposely misleading. It also bears a complete lack of experience of being a white person walking around majority black areas.
Even if you walk around a majority black area and the residents do not give you any attention (very rare if the area is low-income) the cops sure will give you attention.
Alright smarty lets see you walk over by Madison and Cicero for more than 15 minutes. I want to see if you come back without having someone harass you in one way or the other. You will be lucky to come out of there without being robbed, killed, or end up missing.
Thank you for the lecture on the realities of urban life in Chicago. I respectfully disagree with your view. I do not recall stating that you could not find an intersection that I wouldn't want to walk through. Obviously, there are many entire neighborhoods I wouldn't want to set foot in. Nice try but I'm not that stupid. This is why I was careful to say "most" and not "all". I spend a lot of time in neighborhoods all over the south side (washington heights, chatham, south shore, woodlawn, wash park, etc.). In most parts of these places a white person walking around in the day wouldn't get any attention from anyone.
In general I think the fear of the white person in the black neighborhood is wildly exaggerated.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Avengerfire
I hate to defend (however indirectly) the guy you directed this comment to, but your assertion is ridiculous bordering on insanely ignorant and purposely misleading. It also bears a complete lack of experience of being a white person walking around majority black areas.
Even if you walk around a majority black area and the residents do not give you any attention (very rare if the area is low-income) the cops sure will give you attention.
Alright smarty lets see you walk over by Madison and Cicero. I want to see if you come back without having someone harass you in one way or the other. You will be lucky to come out of there without being robbed or killed.
Thank you for the lecture on the realities of urban life in Chicago. I respectfully disagree with your view. I do not recall stating that you could not find an intersection that I wouldn't want to walk through. Obviously, there are many entire neighborhoods I wouldn't want to set foot in. Nice try but I'm not that stupid. This is why I was careful to say "most" and not "all". I spend a lot of time in neighborhoods all over the south side (washington heights, chatham, south shore, woodlawn, wash park, etc.). In most parts of these places a white person walking around in the day wouldn't get any attention from anyone.
In general I think the fear of the white person in the black neighborhood is wildly exaggerated.
As you say yourself "in the day" Lmao.
Go to those places at night buddy.
In reality your claim is the exact opposite of what you state. In MOST overwhelmingly black neighborhoods you have to be really lucky as a white person to not get harassed at some point by hanging out and walking around at any time of day and especially night.
Crap I can list 1000 intersections in black areas of the city I would not walk through at any time for an extended period of time EVER.
Sorry,I really do not think you have much street experience in Chicago.
I love how you are backpeddling now.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ajolotl
That's very exaggerated. You can walk freely around most black areas an no one will pay any attention to you.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ajolotl
...I do not recall stating that you could not find an intersection that I wouldn't want to walk through. Obviously, there are many entire neighborhoods I wouldn't want to set foot in...
...In most parts of these places a white person walking around IN THE DAY wouldn't get any attention from anyone.
I have to state in many or most (overwhelmingly white or hispanic) neighborhoods in Chicago and burbs a black person will get messed with by residents or by the cops in some form most of the time. This is not in dispute. But for someone to try to distort reality and say a white person in many or most black areas of the city or burbs will not get messed with in some form most of the time is absolutely asinine.
I really challenge you to get out and get some street smarts. Even black people know what the score is with this crap and will admit if you have their trust what the deal is. They will tell you that they would be very cautious to walk around Edgebrook,Norwood Park, or Edison Park for example just as any sane white person would be very cautious to walk around Austin,Garfield Park, or Englewood for example.
It is the law of the west. Whether it is right or wrong is another story.
I do not wish you ill well or dislike you,but you must open your eyes.
Last edited by Avengerfire; 01-13-2009 at 11:25 PM..
Thank you for the continuation of the lecture. You give yourself and your opinions far too much credit. It would be more appropriate for you to exercise a little modesty and maybe even consider that you might be wrong.
You are describing a certain type of all black neighborhood that definitely exists. It isn't fair to say that most are that way. There are many more that are lower, lower middle, or middle class low density residential where no one would ever pay any attention to you. These neighborhoods are all over the south side and I do most of my business in them, including taking the red and green line at all hours, shopping, biking, whatever. These areas tend to have relatively high crime rates but it would be crazy to say that you are lucky as a white person not to be singled out and harassed. If anything they'll just assume you're a cop, but more likely no one will pay any attention to you.
Maybe I've just been lucky over the last 25 years or know how to handle myself. But I suspect it's more that you've never spent much time in such neighborhoods and don't know what you're talking about.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Avengerfire
As you say yourself "in the day" Lmao.
Go to those places at night buddy.
In reality your claim is the exact opposite of what you state. In MOST overwhelmingly black neighborhoods you have to be really lucky as a white person to not get harassed at some point hanging out and walking around at any time of day and especially night.
Crap I can list 1000 intersections in black areas of the city I would not walk through at any time for an extended period of time EVER.
I really do not think you have much street experience in Chicago sorry.
I love how you are backpeddling now.
I have to state in many or most (overwhelmingly white or hispanic) neighborhoods in Chicago and burbs a black person will get messed with by residents or by the cops in some form most of the time. This is not in dispute. But for someone to try to distort reality and say a white person in many or most black areas of the city or burbs will not get messed with in some form most of the time is absolutely asinine.
I really challenge you to get out and get some street smarts. Even black people know what the score is with this crap and will admit if you have their trust what the deal is. It is the law of the west. Whether it is right or wrong is another story.
I do not wish you ill well or dislike you. But you must open you eyes.
Thank you for the continuation of the lecture. You give yourself and your opinions far too much credit. It would be more appropriate for you to exercise a little modesty and maybe even consider that you might be wrong.
You are describing a certain type of all black neighborhood that definitely exists. It isn't fair to say that most are that way. There are many more that are lower, lower middle, or middle class low density residential where no one would ever pay any attention to you. These neighborhoods are all over the south side and I do most of my business in them, including taking the red and green line at all hours, shopping, biking, whatever. These areas tend to have relatively high crime rates but it would be crazy to say that you are lucky as a white person not to be singled out and harassed. If anything they'll just assume you're a cop, but more likely no one will pay any attention to you.
Maybe I've just been lucky over the last 25 years or know how to handle myself. But I suspect it's more that you've never spent much time in such neighborhoods and don't know what you're talking about.
You are welcome. I am pleased that I have a student (however difficult and naive) to my treatise.
Many to most are the way I describe. I have been in all of them in my existence on this earth. I highly doubt you have.You only visit the limited areas (well that are half way decent in the day at least) of the half way decent and a couple decent black areas of the city which equal probably 20% AT MOST of the total black areas of the city.
Again you say most of them are ok in "the day." I dispute this. Some are ok in the day and some are fine at any time of day or night, but a huge majority are not. I would love for you to name every single neighborhood that fits your claim of "There are many more that are lower, lower middle, or middle class low density residential where no one would ever pay any attention to you. These neighborhoods are all over the south side and I do most of my business in them."
I challenge you to go to 75% of all majority black neighborhoods at night and walk around for an hour or two. I want to see how long and how many you can get through without an incident happening if you are indeed a white man.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ajolotl
Fascinating article. My junior high school had a similar racial balance ...
Still, I wouldn't send my kids to a school with a large black majority. Fire away, Manigault.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ajolotl
These little *uckers are getting bold. Just broke into my basement at 3am, knocked over stacks of boxes (which woke me up), still were bold enough to come up to the first floor. Luckily they were scared by my basement-to-first-floor door alarm and fled. I looked out the window and saw them running down the street. They looked like two black high school punks. Home invasions are an ugly feeling when you have kids. Just venting.
Walking contradiction anyone?
Yeah you know so much about what you are talking about that you allowed your house to get busted into because you do not know the proper ways to have your house secured. You thought Beverly is some sort of Utopia far from the crap areas of the city and that crap will never enter your Utopia. Sorry I had to bring this up but you left yourself open to it.
Again, I really do not have a problem with you. I am sure you are a great person but you really need to stop being so politically correct. I think you have a really bad case of white guilt. Stop being a conflicted apologist.
''We talk about perception and reality,'' Lovie Smith said. ''That may be the perception, but I don't know where it came from. It is not the reality at all. Just go with our track record. I keep hearing these things. It hasn't happened, so where does this come from?''
What a jem of a quote.
Last edited by Avengerfire; 01-14-2009 at 01:16 AM..
You are welcome. I am pleased that I have a student (however difficult and naive) to my treatise.
Many to most are the way I describe. I have been in all of them in my existence on this earth. I highly doubt you have.You only visit the limited areas (well that are half way decent in the day at least) of the half way decent and a couple decent black areas of the city which equal probably 20% AT MOST of the total black areas of the city.
Again you say most of them are ok in "the day." I dispute this. Some are ok in the day and some are fine at any time of day or night, but a huge majority are not. I would love for you to name every single neighborhood that fits your claim of "There are many more that are lower, lower middle, or middle class low density residential where no one would ever pay any attention to you. These neighborhoods are all over the south side and I do most of my business in them."
I challenge you to go to 75% of all majority black neighborhoods at night and walk around for an hour or two. I want to see how long and how many you can get through without an incident happening if you are indeed a white man.
Walking contradiction anyone?
Yeah you know so much about what you are talking about that you allowed your house to get busted into because you do not know the proper ways to have your house secured. You thought Beverly is some sort of Utopia far from the crap areas of the city and that crap will never enter your Utopia. Sorry I had to bring this up but you left yourself open to it.
Again, I really do not have a problem with you. I am sure you are a great person but you really need to stop being so politically correct. I think you have a really bad case of white guilt. Stop being a conflicted apologist.
''We talk about perception and reality,'' Lovie Smith said. ''That may be the perception, but I don't know where it came from. It is not the reality at all. Just go with our track record. I keep hearing these things. It hasn't happened, so where does this come from?''
What a jem of a quote.
Great post. This fooilish man can argue these unrealistic points, but the facts are the facts. The majority of high dense black neighborhoods in the city and suburbs are not considered very safe, especially for a white man. I work in law enforcement and can honestly laugh when I hear white, dillusional liberals speak. Their street smarts are scary and I challenge this man to walk virtually any high dense black area at night and see if he is noticed. He will be harassed by residents or police. If a black man entered a white area in Edison Park for instance-he will also be noticed- but very unlikely he will robbed or hurt. This is reality2009-get with it naive liberals.
Let's see, two black kids broke into my house and I don't want to send my kids to a majority black school. Yet, I think there are both decent and bad black neighborhoods. That's a huge conflict. I need to see a therapist.
I agree that there are delusional liberals, and then there are also really ignorant closed-minded people who wildly exaggerate and extrapolate racial conflict and say things like "I can't go through most black neighborhoods without getting harassed". That's just completely ignorant. I shop in south shore, up and down stony island from 63rd to 95th, West Pullman (take the metra in the morning from 107th), up and down cottage grove, Auburn/Gresham, Woodlawn, Was Park, on and on. I know better than you that these neighborhoods have problems, so please don't say that I'm denying anything or in some Utopia. Still, thousands of people shop in these areas every day without incident. Most are black. If you are white nothing special will happen to you. No I don't want to live there and yes I can read the crime stats on everyblock, but it's naive to think there are animals looking to pounce on the first white dude that walks by.
And yes I know there are such areas. I lived near 60th and Ellis in 1983 and was told by a coworker to avoid the 63rd street L stop. He told me he used to hang out there as a kid waiting for white kids to accidentally wander onto the green line. The neighborhood kids would beat them up just for fun. I didn't listen, walked to Harolds on 64th and Cottage at 1am and got attacked with a baseball bat. Still, I can see that many residential black areas aren't like Woodlawn in 1983. I'm not being an apologist or politically correct, just stating a fact after 25 years of spending time in them.
Let's see, two black kids broke into my house and I don't want to send my kids to a majority black school. Yet, I think there are both decent and bad black neighborhoods. That's a huge conflict. I need to see a therapist.
I agree that there are delusional liberals, and then there are also really ignorant closed-minded people who wildly exaggerate and extrapolate racial conflict and say things like "I can't go through most black neighborhoods without getting harassed". That's just completely ignorant. I shop in south shore, up and down stony island from 63rd to 95th, West Pullman (take the metra in the morning from 107th), up and down cottage grove, Auburn/Gresham, Woodlawn, Was Park, on and on. I know better than you that these neighborhoods have problems, so please don't say that I'm denying anything or in some Utopia. Still, thousands of people shop in these areas every day without incident. Most are black. If you are white nothing special will happen to you. No I don't want to live there and yes I can read the crime stats on everyblock, but it's naive to think there are animals looking to pounce on the first white dude that walks by.
And yes I know there are such areas. I lived near 60th and Ellis in 1983 and was told by a coworker to avoid the 63rd street L stop. He told me he used to hang out there as a kid waiting for white kids to accidentally wander onto the green line. The neighborhood kids would beat them up just for fun. I didn't listen, walked to Harolds on 64th and Cottage at 1am and got attacked with a baseball bat. Still, I can see that many residential black areas aren't like Woodlawn in 1983. I'm not being an apologist or politically correct, just stating a fact after 25 years of spending time in them.
It seems like you have learned the hard way more than once-not listening to experienced advice. Well, maybe you will learn once again. Walk through Southshore at night and see if you are harassed by the police or robbed or mugged. You will be an easy target as you were in 1983. Just remember something. Just because Obama is our new president and its 2009- and we all chant the word change- does not mean the mentality of these neighborhoods have changed. In fact there is a great deal of hatred for a white man in most of these high dense black areas. If they do treat you with any respect at night in lets say Englewood,Southshore, or Lawndale, its because they think you are their next potential crackhead client.
In fact there is a great deal of hatred for a white man in most of these high dense black areas.
If not many whites are there and the locales have a lot of crime is this crime based on a simple hatred of humanity? Plus, if you avoid these areas, how can you be so sure? You are making a big leap.
Quote:
Originally Posted by promis1
If they do treat you with any respect at night in lets say Englewood,Southshore, or Lawndale, its because they think you are their next potential crackhead client.
You base this view on what? Particularly since you have very little experience with these areas?
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