Suburban schools in majority white towns (Chicago, Naperville: homes, high school, universities)

[ajolotl]

Don't feel too ripped off. You can always be a gentrifier. Anyhow, I'm sure the first african americans in any neighborhood have to make a good deal of sacrifices to get by.

[oakparkdude]

Originally Posted by ajolotl

that's actually not a bad point. Avoiding blacks is expensive.

Except that historically, real estate prices continue to fall due to white flight. This lets in poorer AA, resulting in rising crime, worsening schools, etc. There are exceptions, like Oak Park and Beverly, but they are few and far between, unfortunately. Eventually, as the African-American/minority middle class expands, there will be a time where the AA middle class is large enough to maintain high property values in the face of white flight.

[deechee]

Originally Posted by ajolotl

Your point isn't inconsistent with the OP, so I doubt his bubble is burst. The question is why white families would prefer plainjanefield to flossmoor. The OP's hypothesis is that racial demographics are part of it, particularly vis-a-vis the high school. There are other reasons too I'm sure. The appearance of the town certainly isn't one of them. Never thought I'd see the day when plainfield was considered more desirable than flossmoor!

Understood.

[Chicagoland60426]

Originally Posted by ajolotl

Your point isn't inconsistent with the OP, so I doubt his bubble is burst. The question is why white families would prefer plainjanefield to flossmoor. The OP's hypothesis is that racial demographics are part of it, particularly vis-a-vis the high school. There are other reasons too I'm sure. The appearance of the town certainly isn't one of them. Never thought I'd see the day when plainfield was considered more desirable than flossmoor!

Exactly. Funny about that is Homewood and Flossmoor are still majority white villages. So in a way both survived white flight, except the schools are soon to lean towards a black majority. Flossmoor reminds me of Beverly, except Flossmoor is probably more affluent. Then you have Olympia Fields that is directly south of H-F, which is probably the most desirable suburb for blacks in Cook County. I choose them two before planfield anyday.

[crbcrbrgv]

Originally Posted by Gioobag

At1Withnature: you of all people should understand Nature at work when it comes to schools and test scores, etc.

The reason schools like New Trier & Loyola have higher scoring students is not because of the schools themselves, but because the kids that attend have higher IQs gifted to them genetically by their parents, who also have high IQs, and that's why the parents work, have good incomes, and live on the North Shore in the first place.

I'm a teacher and I disagree. Guess what happens when a kid from New Trier or Loyola struggles at a subject? Their parents hire expensive tutors. Guess what happens when a kid from a poor family struggles? Let's just say they don't get dropped off at some expensive tutor's house in mommy's brand new Lexus.

[deechee]

Originally Posted by crbcrbrgv

I'm a teacher and I disagree. Guess what happens when a kid from New Trier or Loyola struggles at a subject? Their parents hire expensive tutors. Guess what happens when a kid from a poor family struggles? Let's just say they don't get dropped off at some expensive tutor's house in mommy's brand new Lexus.

Ah a fellow educator. Yes, very true. Sometimes the poor kids feel even worse about it, (which contributes to further bad grades and test scores) because they know they don't have many resources.

[noid_1985]

Originally Posted by Gioobag

Let's try to stay on track here, and not say that "tutoring" is the reason for the difference across entire student bodies. That's nowhere near large enough of a variable to explain the gap.

Do you disagree that the kids at New Trier and Loyola have higher IQs than the kids at say (take your pick: Senn, Gage Park, St. Rita, etc.)??

Ok I get it, so you are saying that wealthier whites have a higher IQ than inner city blacks. However, lets not act as if money doesn't play a factor in the equation when the average income for a child's family at St. Rita is 36k and Loyola it's 107k. Also St. Rita is only 32% black with a student body of all boys, your comparison of these two schools and any Chicago PS vs. New Trier school is ridiculous. A lot of the students that attend CPS don't even live in the same area.

I would just like to point out that I've met a few people with pretty high IQs and ACT scores and quite honestly some lacked common sense.

[cdc3217]

There's a stat out there that the two biggest determinants of a student's educational success are based on:

1) Up to age 5 - the mother's IQ
2) After age 5 - the father's income.

I'm sorry I can't cite anything as to where it came from. Just one of those tidbits lodged in my brain.

[deechee]

Originally Posted by cdc3217

There's a stat out there that the two biggest determinants of a student's educational success are based on:

1) Up to age 5 - the mother's IQ
2) After age 5 - the father's income.

I'm sorry I can't cite anything as to where it came from. Just one of those tidbits lodged in my brain.

First I want to say that I love the fact you live in Blue Island, I heard that some parts of it are really great.

Two, I'd just like to ask how a product of a single parent home (like myself) did without the father's income after age 5?

I'm also going to add that I don't really expect to find many single moms and dads out in the 'burbs. Especially not lily white ones.

[chet everett]

Originally Posted by cdc3217

There's a stat out there that the two biggest determinants of a student's educational success are based on:

1) Up to age 5 - the mother's IQ
2) After age 5 - the father's income.

I'm sorry I can't cite anything as to where it came from. Just one of those tidbits lodged in my brain.

I agree that mirrors my anecdotal experience both as former high school teacher and observer of many people. It also tracks well with other data that equates success of schools with parental demographics -- towns where people have kids later in life tend to have far better performing schools. The reason is related to age and income, more disposable income and time to spend with kids...

I don't think stats like this are necessarily racial either. My goodness look at President Obama and Michelle and their kids. Michelle's academic credentials are among the most impressive of any inhabitant of the WH. She was 34 when she had her first daughter, and Barack's books royalties were kicking in right about when the younger would have been hitting 5... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michelle_Obama