how is lansing IL (Chicago, Naperville: sale, apartment, low crime)

[skyeINIL]

Originally Posted by vester72

The problem with diversity, is areas on the south side normally do not remain diverse. They start caucasian, then minorities begin to move in, which is great and most caucasians could care less - but instead of a couple minority families moving in gradually, it seems as though the only people that are to moving into communities are minorities - and it happens so fast that caucasians do not even have the opportunity to buy houses that go on the market because anytime house that goes on the market is purchased by a minority quickly.

Then, the caucasians see this and figure they don't want to be the only caucasian in the area and move because in the time of a couple years, the number of minorities families that has moved in as grown and grown and continues to grow faster.

It is crazy, but that's how it happens - there is "white flight", but it would not happen as it does if a neighborhood became diverse in a slow, normal manner rather than a huge influx of a minority at the same time. This sudden change causes the "white flight" and causes areas to go from no diversity to diversity to no diversity again in a hurry.

While I am totally clueless on why it happens this way, but it is almost as if neighborhoods or towns are "targeted" for change, then instead of this promoting a diverse community, the manner in which minorties move in is so rapid, it scares current residents away - which I assume is not the intent, but who knows.

Hopefully someday it will not happen that way, but until that day comes, we'll see the same patterns across the south side, and soon the southwest burbs.

Oh I get now. White flight is the fault of minorities. I never knew that. So you mean white people do want to live around blacks and Latinos? They just don't get the chance because we move in so fast. I'll spread the word and let all my minority friends know to slow down on the moving thing.

Anyway, on the topic: I think Lansing is alright. I agree with a lot of previous posters. It is changing to a more "diverse" population (read:more blacks and Latinos), but whites are not moving out "in droves" as was mentioned. The area I live in is just about all white, with the exception of my family and two more. I also agree that it seems in some cases that when blacks move into an area en masse, the crime rate jumps and the area becomes less desirable to live in. That doesn't seem to be happening in Lansing. The police seem to be everywhere all at once and handle even the most minor problems quickly.

[vester72]

Originally Posted by skye1974

So you mean white people do want to live around blacks and Latinos?

Actually, yes - my sister-in-law is Latino (from Mexico) and my neighborhood in the city is about 50% black - I love it and would not live anywhere else and want that experience for my daughter.

However, if over the next year it turned out most whites moved out and only blacks moved in I may consider moving - not due to blacks moving in, but due to the fact that my area would NOT be diverse. I personally wouldn't feel as comfortable as I do in a diverse neighborhood (I do love diversity - but diversity does not mean all Latino or all African-American or all Asian) - it would have nothing to do with the race of the person.

That seems to be what a lot of people here do not get - diversity is a mix of races, cultures, ethnicities - not a concentration of one of the above.

[rubber duck]

Originally Posted by WildWestDude

Q: What makes one town more likely to except and admit more sectin 8's than another

The one thing that really hurts lansing is the vast amount of apartment buildings in town. If an apartment complex owner wants to turn his building into section eight housing there's very little a town can do against it, moreover, what does the town care who lives in the complex, they get their tax money whether its a yuppie condo or a section eight slum. Apartment building owners love the section eight status because it's a guaranteed rent check from Uncle Sam each month (i.e. no chasing down rent money).

I also think the idea that Lansing will be another Homewood is laughable at best. Name me an area of homewood with multiple section eight housing units, or where you can have the choice of a slew of bungalows and cape cods for around $140k? I also can't remember the last time Lansing has had under 300 houses for sale. People are moving for a reason. The influx of houses for sale over the last few years has increased dramatically. You can blame white people all you want for moving, but I didn't have bass rattling my windows at 3 in the morning 5 years ago. If you're used to living in a poor area of the south side, then Lansing is definitely a step up. If you're used to a town of what Lansing was 10 years ago, then it is a step down.

[TammiT]

[quote=vester72;1954278]I think the issue with this statement is that it is not a black and white issue - it is all about money.

I will guarantee you that if a neighborhood turns from predominantly white to predominantly black or latino - and the businesses in that area remain as profitable - or more profitable and rent, theft and insurance do not go up - none will leave. That is a fact.

For one reason or another, most of the time those conditions are not met, causing businesses to leave the neighborhoods. Unfortunately for those that want to bring race into it, it is that simple.[/quote

I would like to point out after performing research on this topic using scholarly data, there are conflicting research studies with findings indicating 1) business close because blacks move in, and 2)indicating businesses close as a result of financial constraints experienced when blacks move in. Whatever the reason the bottom line is they close. A professor once asked his class, "How do you create a ghetto?" His answer, "Close all the businesses." I believe for some people can be money and for other it's race.

[TammiT]

Originally Posted by rubber duck

The one thing that really hurts lansing is the vast amount of apartment buildings in town. If an apartment complex owner wants to turn his building into section eight housing there's very little a town can do against it, moreover, what does the town care who lives in the complex, they get their tax money whether its a yuppie condo or a section eight slum. Apartment building owners love the section eight status because it's a guaranteed rent check from Uncle Sam each month (i.e. no chasing down rent money).

I also think the idea that Lansing will be another Homewood is laughable at best. Name me an area of homewood with multiple section eight housing units, or where you can have the choice of a slew of bungalows and cape cods for around $140k? I also can't remember the last time Lansing has had under 300 houses for sale. People are moving for a reason. The influx of houses for sale over the last few years has increased dramatically. You can blame white people all you want for moving, but I didn't have bass rattling my windows at 3 in the morning 5 years ago. If you're used to living in a poor area of the south side, then Lansing is definitely a step up. If you're used to a town of what Lansing was 10 years ago, then it is a step down.

I guess it depends on which part of Lansing you live in. Houses where I live aren't selling for anywhere near $140k. They are well over that. There is an area in Lansing I could have moved to that would have definitely been a step down from the predominately black neighborhood I moved from, but that's not where I moved. So yes, it is a step up. The area I live in is quiet, with beautiful homes, no loud music. It is evident that people feel safe in my neighborhood. There are a lot of families playing and walking their pets, older people walking in the park and little children riding their bikes. Lansing is still a good community and it CAN be better than Homewood. In my opinoin, Homewood isn't as great as you think. I did my homework, drove around and looked at some old unkept homes, some looked like they were about to fall down. Then again, they had a section with nicer homes. I still preferred Lansing. Lansing is more diverse.

[rubber duck]

There are no doubt still safe areas in Lansing, from the way it sounds you must live on the south side. The areas I'm referring to are generally north of the expressway (apartments and cheap housing) and these areas coincide with most of the criminal activity that occurs in town. Also most crime goes unnoticed by your average citizen. Do you realize that there is a battle going on between the Latin Dragons and the Gangster Disciples over dealing territory in Lansing? Or that violent crime is up approximately 150% over last year (this includes homicide, criminal sexual assault, aggravated battery, armed robbery...)? Or that our police department is shrinking due to archaic village policies over residency, when crime is going up? Lansing is at a crossroads over how to deal with its current situation, if the village decides to continue down its current path Calumet City will continue to creep in. Harvey was a good town once too.

[TammiT]

Originally Posted by rubber duck

There are no doubt still safe areas in Lansing, from the way it sounds you must live on the south side. The areas I'm referring to are generally north of the expressway (apartments and cheap housing) and these areas coincide with most of the criminal activity that occurs in town. Also most crime goes unnoticed by your average citizen. Do you realize that there is a battle going on between the Latin Dragons and the Gangster Disciples over dealing territory in Lansing? Or that violent crime is up approximately 150% over last year (this includes homicide, criminal sexual assault, aggravated battery, armed robbery...)? Or that our police department is shrinking due to archaic village policies over residency, when crime is going up? Lansing is at a crossroads over how to deal with its current situation, if the village decides to continue down its current path Calumet City will continue to creep in. Harvey was a good town once too.

Yes, although I don't know the details, I do recall reading that the Lansing Police Department formed a new unit to combat drugs. I believe it is related to what you are speaking of. Yes, I moved to the southside during whiteflight in the 70's. I was a little girl then, but I did live through the change in the neighborhoods. I am hoping we have moved beyond that. We'll see.

[rubber duck]

Originally Posted by TammiT

Yes, although I don't know the details, I do recall reading that the Lansing Police Department formed a new unit to combat drugs. I believe it is related to what you are speaking of. Yes, I moved to the southside during whiteflight in the 70's. I was a little girl then, but I did live through the change in the neighborhoods. I am hoping we have moved beyond that. We'll see.

Your last couple of sentences is why Lansing has it's back against the wall. There's a history of segregation on the south side, the first white flight out of the city didn't happen that long ago, and look what happened to the majority of neighborhoods that underwent the transformation, they're ghettos now. There's quite a few people in Lansing that remember the first white flight, and are uneasy with the transformation the town is undergoing now. Quite a few of them aren't sticking around to see what will happen, and I really can't blame them, but it certainley doesn't promote a diverse town.

[TammiT]

People leaving do not promote a diverse town, but people staying do. And, many are staying. So far, that's an improvement over white flight. There are other mixed communities. Lansing isn't the first. We will be okay.

But aren't you curious as to why the first one happened? What was the reason then?

I agree with you Section 8 is outrageous. They pay ridiculously low rent i.e., $12 , $30 per month. There is no incentive to find employment because the money they make would be taken to help pay their rent, AND the government pay their rent forever. Can you believe, when they die, it can be transferred to another family member? When is the government going to get a grip?

[TammiT]

llllllllll