Where are the mobsters? (Chicago, Lombard: neighborhoods, school, living)

[Milwaukee City]

Originally Posted by Dport7674

The smart ones invested their money and turned white collar. The rest went to prison or died.

There's plenty of loosely connected shady underground types still around. But the days of "families" are pretty much over.

The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was convincing the world he didn't exists

[Milwaukee City]

Much of the Chicago outfit remains in the city with the hierarchy transplanting out to the western suburbs mainly along the 294 corridor. The chicago outfit remains in control of NW Indiana and SE Wisconsin and still holds power over KC and STL. Work smarter not harder is exemplified here. The Loon cafe(River Grove) used to be a hangout/meeting place for the outfit as well Elgin, North Chicago and Melrose Park/Elmwood Park.

[jonnynonos]

Originally Posted by Milwaukee City

Much of the Chicago outfit remains in the city with the hierarchy transplanting out to the western suburbs mainly along the 294 corridor. The chicago outfit remains in control of NW Indiana and SE Wisconsin and still holds power over KC and STL. Work smarter not harder is exemplified here. The Loon cafe(River Grove) used to be a hangout/meeting place for the outfit as well Elgin, North Chicago and Melrose Park/Elmwood Park.

I'm not so sure. When was the last time anyone was arrested for anything? When was the last time anyone was killed? Without violence how do they 'control' anything?

The best assessments I've read from people who are relatively in the know are that they have the video poker thing and a limited amount of bookmaking, primarily from old men who are uncomfortable using the Internet. They may still have control/influence of a very, very small amount of unions, but I doubt it.

The Loon is closed.

[williepotatoes]

Originally Posted by Milwaukee City

Much of the Chicago outfit remains in the city with the hierarchy transplanting out to the western suburbs mainly along the 294 corridor. The chicago outfit remains in control of NW Indiana and SE Wisconsin and still holds power over KC and STL. Work smarter not harder is exemplified here. The Loon cafe(River Grove) used to be a hangout/meeting place for the outfit as well Elgin, North Chicago and Melrose Park/Elmwood Park.

The loon shut down a while back. It recently re-opened for a very short spell under a new owner who had clear and evident outfit connections. The outfit is so hapless these days that they can't even run a bar successfully. The FBI generally considers the syndicate to be a joke now. A collection of mostly drug addicts, burglars and petty thieves who have little or no structure. Recently a drug addicted west suburban "soldier" was busted for the heavy crime of shoplifting at a retail store. That's tells you how far they have fallen.

The oufit really only lives on in the dreamy, embellished fantasies of media blowhards like Chuck Goudie and John Kass.

[jonnynonos]

The My Way was owned by an old Marco D'Amico soldier. His brother in law, in fact.

If anyone is really interested in this stuff I recommend you read the interviews Joseph Fosco did with Michael Magnificci last year. That offers a fairly revealing look into the state of The Outfit.

[williepotatoes]

Originally Posted by jonnynonos

The My Way was owned by an old Marco D'Amico soldier. His brother in law, in fact.

If anyone is really interested in this stuff I recommend you read the interviews Joseph Fosco did with Michael Magnificci last year. That offers a fairly revealing look into the state of The Outfit.

I just wish that someone other than Fosco had done that interview. His too often outlandish, ridiculous claims and accusations defy credibility. Unfortunately we have few credible modern day outfitologists and that's a shame. One of the longest running criminal empires in history is over and so much is unknown about it's past. And even what we know is often just speculation.

It's been said about mob guys that most are insufferable braggarts and all of them are liars. The same can be said of many whom have reported on them.

[jonnynonos]

I agree Fosco was largely motivated out of vendetta and was probably way off on certain points of fact, nevertheless that was an interesting forum from 2008-2011; between him and a few of the commentators who were super knowledgable it was probably the prime source for getting street-level info on the Outfit and now there is nothing to replace it.

Of course you had to take everything with a grain of salt and there was a lot of misinformation and outright garbage, but I think ultimately most of the very knowledgable commentators who weren't biased (and there were several) were able to walk away with some reasonable conclusions about the state of the Outfit; mostly that it is almost dead, the old 'bosses' are all just sitting on their investments not wanting to go to jail; and that they still have certain, limited illegal operations. Actually, if you were following the forum you'll know this, there was kind of a blow-up between a couple of the most knowledgable guys, but a few months ago another guy surfaced, I forget his handle, but he really knew a ton too, and he also believed it is more or less dead, with guys like Adriacchi, D'Amico and DiFronzio most likely just serving in kind of advisory rolls, distancing themselves far away from any potential trouble.

Obviously with the site no longer posting about organized crime on a regular basis, those days are over.

You are right that much of the literature out there is not very good. Most recently I read Gus Russo's book, which I think was very sensationalized and I think you have to take everything with a grain of salt--he uses Chuck Giancana's book as a source, for example, and to anyone with an IQ over 20, you can tell, just by tone, the ridiculousness of the claims, etc., that that book is pure garbage. (That Giancana started the Vietnam War, was one absurdity, among dozens, that sticks out in my mind.)

I've heard Ovid Demaris' book is good. I want to read that. My favorite books on the Outfit are Family Secrets and When Corruption Was King. Frank Calabrese Jr.'s book also was not bad.

I think it's just a grey area where a lot of authors go to slum. Since little is proven or disproven, and no one is going to sue them or check for accuracy, they can be as outlandish as they want. For instance a book on Al Capone came out a couple years ago that was absolutely terrible and drew completely absurd conclusions, but it received a TON of play in national media nevertheless. But if you were to write a book that awful on, say, Theodore Roosevelt, people would nail your a** to the wall, but because it's the mob, they don't really care, and just repeat whatever he wrote.

[williepotatoes]

Yeah, that forum could be very interesting at times. Fosco might have been on to something good there, but his interference and silly rebukes spoiled it and probably scared off more and better witnesses. Had he stayed out of it, we might have seen more eager and genuine participants that had real knowledge and experiences. A blown opportunity in my opinion.

I regret every hour that I spent reading Gus Russo's book. Cooley on the other hand penned a convincing tale in my opinion. He too suffers from the braggert gene somewhat, but most of his depictions are plausible and very rational. And much of it is backed up on wire taps. Unlike many outfit guys, he is pretty well educated and makes conclusions regarding many of these syndicate characters that jive with much of what is considered mainstream outfit history.

The whole episode that was Family Secrets was very revealing and informative, but here too I have to believe that there was a fair share of BS beneath the surface. Much of what Nick and Frank jr. claim, is just based on what Frank sr. told them. Frank sr. is a convicted liar, and the poster child for mob style braggadacio. Probably psychotic as well.

[SpaceisforAce]

Theyre eating a sausage and pepper pie at Lou Malnati's.

[jonnynonos]

Originally Posted by williepotatoes

Yeah, that forum could be very interesting at times. Fosco might have been on to something good there, but his interference and silly rebukes spoiled it and probably scared off more and better witnesses. Had he stayed out of it, we might have seen more eager and genuine participants that had real knowledge and experiences. A blown opportunity in my opinion.

I regret every hour that I spent reading Gus Russo's book. Cooley on the other hand penned a convincing tale in my opinion. He too suffers from the braggert gene somewhat, but most of his depictions are plausible and very rational. And much of it is backed up on wire taps. Unlike many outfit guys, he is pretty well educated and makes conclusions regarding many of these syndicate characters that jive with much of what is considered mainstream outfit history.

The whole episode that was Family Secrets was very revealing and informative, but here too I have too believe their was a fair share of BS beneath the surface. Much of what Nick and Frank jr. claim, is just based on what Frank sr. told them. Frank is a convicted liar, and the poster child for mob style braggadacio. Probably psychotic as well.

Yes, when sentencing Judge Zagel actually (for some bizarre reason) bothered to point out redemptive qualities in mobsters such as Lombardo and Marcello, then went out of his way to call Calabrese Sr. a 'toxic creature.' He is truly a revolting human being.

There are a lot of lies in the mob and wild conclusions by mob writers, that's for sure; we'll never what really happened with most of the hits. I don't see much reason to doubt Nick Calabrese, though. His testimony seemed very consistent and plausible about the 15-plus hits he testified on. There was a small amount of physical evidence connecting Lombardo to the Seifert murder--the fingerprint on the car title, as well as other witnesses corroborating the story. We know he was telling the truth about Feccerota, as it was his glove they found.

Whether he switched details around to protect certain people, or to put other people away, who knows, but ultimately I don't think there is much question that everyone who went down for murder in that trial deserved it.