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Old 04-22-2013, 02:02 PM
 
Location: Chicago
38,707 posts, read 102,751,145 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oakparkdude View Post
Will this even be possible given the parking meter privatization deal?
It's possible, but the city would have to reimburse the thieving vultur -- excuse me, "owners" of the parking meters for lost revenue. I'm not sure how much of Ashland is metered though; I guess I never thought much about it because the parts of it I tend to traverse are not.
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Old 04-22-2013, 02:54 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chi-town Native View Post
I'm a bit concerned that they haven't thought through the "bus sends beacon to get traffic signals to change to green" concept.

Doesn't this screw with traffic management in a larger, more holistic sense?
I doubt that one extra brief green light per traffic signal every 10-12 minutes (or however frequently the bus runs) is going to make things much worse than it already is. The pluses that come from the rapid transit bus would surely outweigh whatever small negative comes from that, I think. I agree with Drover that the loss of a traffic lane is a bigger negative, but I'm generally okay with things that encourage public transit use.
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Old 04-22-2013, 03:56 PM
 
Location: Nort Seid
5,288 posts, read 8,831,424 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChiNaan View Post
I doubt that one extra brief green light per traffic signal every 10-12 minutes (or however frequently the bus runs) is going to make things much worse than it already is. The pluses that come from the rapid transit bus would surely outweigh whatever small negative comes from that, I think. I agree with Drover that the loss of a traffic lane is a bigger negative, but I'm generally okay with things that encourage public transit use.
I wouldn't call disrupting traffic flow on major east-west arterial routes a small negative. According to CDOT, street lights are timed and monitored.

Yes, I am snickering at that concept as well, but I've heard multiple CDOT staff say this, and I imagine there is some truth to it.

I am 100% sure that buses randomly messing with traffic signals is going to have unintended negative consequences, but I suppose that aspect of this plan can simply be terminated if that's the case. I do find encouraging the speed at which the video shows the bus moving along, lord knows the real Ashland bus moves at a crawl quite often.
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Old 04-22-2013, 04:30 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chi-town Native View Post
I am 100% sure that buses randomly messing with traffic signals is going to have unintended negative consequences,
Don't ambulances do it already?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chi-town Native View Post
but I suppose that aspect of this plan can simply be terminated if that's the case.
I hope not. That would remove a significant portion of the "rapid."
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Old 04-22-2013, 05:04 PM
 
Location: Chicago
38,707 posts, read 102,751,145 times
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"Timed and monitored" in theory. In practice... I'm not so sure. I'm often out and about during off-peak hours and while my travels have made it fairly clear to me that the light sequencing does in fact prioritize inbound flow in the morning and outbound flow in the evening, I have serious doubts about the extent to which they do so efficiently. Ideally one should be able to set the cruise at a given speed and run a fair string of lights without hitting a red. I have yet to determine what that speed is. Add in the ebb and flow of good ol' fashioned gridlock and all bets are off.I don't think a bus turning a light green every 10 minutes or so long enough for the bus to clear through the intersection is going to have a measurable impact on traffic flow. But I certainly don't have any hard data to confirm that -- just a semi-educated guess.
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Old 04-22-2013, 06:05 PM
 
28,455 posts, read 84,971,395 times
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Chicago has done traffic studies of rush hour restriction for over 50 yrs -- Analysis of traffic flow capacity

Folks that try to use computer models to predict the effect of all kinds of crowd behavior on traffic flow often find their the results differ from empirical data. There are profound psychological behaviors of drivers that rarely respond as predicted by simple fluid flow--

Behavioral Theory of Traffic Flow

The Anti-Physics Behind Traffic Jams
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Old 04-22-2013, 06:22 PM
 
644 posts, read 1,181,840 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chet everett View Post
Chicago has done traffic studies of rush hour restriction for over 50 yrs -- Analysis of traffic flow capacity

Folks that try to use computer models to predict the effect of all kinds of crowd behavior on traffic flow often find their the results differ from empirical data. There are profound psychological behaviors of drivers that rarely respond as predicted by simple fluid flow--

Behavioral Theory of Traffic Flow

The Anti-Physics Behind Traffic Jams
That second link just made my day. I love the driving experiments section.
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Old 04-22-2013, 06:47 PM
 
28,455 posts, read 84,971,395 times
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Default Really applies more to stretches of road with exits...

Quote:
Originally Posted by JBVirtuoso View Post
That second link just made my day. I love the driving experiments section.
I have played around with "growing the empty space" and it does tend to work on roads like 294 and 355 where there are miles between exits. Harder to say it does any good on the Ike or other roads with too many exits per mile. I know there are traffic modelers that work for the toll authority and IDOT that make suggestions about how to space exits but they too often get over ruled by politicians in this state.

When it comes to stop light timing the systems that are in place in suburban Cook Co and the rest of the collar counties are far more flexible than the systems that too many parts of Chicago are saddled with -- the "emergancy vehicle premption system" that relies on 900mhz radio signals is already tied into some things like railroad crossings. The digital controls then recalculate new cycle timings and syncronize downstream signals so that you are not stuck in the crossing.
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Old 04-22-2013, 08:38 PM
 
Location: West Loop, Chicago, IL
240 posts, read 462,665 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChiNaan View Post
The same things that are wrong with most buses-- stops at nearly every block, has to stop at traffic lights, gets stuck in slow-moving traffic, etc. BRT would have none of those problems. Ashland is just a good place to do the first one, because the #9 has the highest ridership of any CTA bus line, and it can connect several El lines out away from the Loop.

This video, if you didn't see it imbedded in the story I posted, illustrates it well:


A Vision for Bus Rapid Transit on Ashland Avenue - YouTube
There it is! The "Citizen Kane" of Bus Rapid Transit videos. I also love the guy at the 1:25 mark. "This BRT is SO fast that I'm in no hurry to catch this bus. I will just take my sweet time getting my CTA card and catch the next smooth-riding BRT."
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Old 04-22-2013, 09:57 PM
 
2,918 posts, read 4,181,179 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ProgMichael View Post
There it is! The "Citizen Kane" of Bus Rapid Transit videos. I also love the guy at the 1:25 mark. "This BRT is SO fast that I'm in no hurry to catch this bus. I will just take my sweet time getting my CTA card and catch the next smooth-riding BRT."
That's an Oscar-quality performance for sure. I prefer talkies, though.
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