Is East Garfield Park between Sacramento and Kedzie a bad area? (Chicago: 2009, crimes)

[Chi-town Native]

sure, but impoverished? that's a bit of a stretch in my opinion. we have some pretty crazy standards is all I can say - all but the worst-off Americans still have shelter, heat, running water, etc. Things that the majority of humanity has never enjoyed unless they were at the top of society.

[Chicagoland60426]

Originally Posted by Chi-town Native

sure, but impoverished? that's a bit of a stretch in my opinion. we have some pretty crazy standards is all I can say - all but the worst-off Americans still have shelter, heat, running water, etc. Things that the majority of humanity has never enjoyed unless they were at the top of society.

I check neighborhoods in rich suburbs like Glencoe and it said 95% of the residents are listed as high earners. So the data must be accurate.

America is a 1st tier country, poverty income here might make you at least blue collar in other countries.

[Actual Resident]

Originally Posted by Drover

In the last 2 years there have been 22 murders and 78 additional shootings in EGP. If EGP isn't a violent ghetto, then what is?

I've been trying to find your stats for quite a while here... There are lots of crime statistics websites out there... and lots of different distinctions (district / ward / neighborhood). But, if this is where you came up with the number 22, then I'd ask you to take a look at the map.

Crimes › East Garfield Park › Homicide | EveryBlock Chicago

Looks more like greater Garfield Park to me. 9 murders in East, and 13 in West. Of course that's not something to be exuberantly proud about... but if you're gonna spit out some statistics, better make sure they are accurate.

[Actual Resident]

Originally Posted by Lookout Kid

According to the CPD 2006 Annual Report, the East Garfield Park Community Area had 11,479 index crimes per 100,000 residents that year.

I can't find these numbers. Can you please post a link?

[Drover]

Originally Posted by Actual Resident

I've been trying to find your stats for quite a while here... There are lots of crime statistics websites out there... and lots of different distinctions (district / ward / neighborhood). But, if this is where you came up with the number 22, then I'd ask you to take a look at the map.

Crimes › East Garfield Park › Homicide | EveryBlock Chicago

Looks more like greater Garfield Park to me. 9 murders in East, and 13 in West. Of course that's not something to be exuberantly proud about... but if you're gonna spit out some statistics, better make sure they are accurate.

It's not greater Garfield Park, though their definition of EGP appears to follow the "neighborhood" boundaries (which are always fluid and subject to change) versus the official community boundaries which are fixed. Refer to CPD's CLEARMAP if you don't trust everyblock, even though everyblock culls its data from the exact same database as CLEARMAP. According to CPD, there's been 11 murders in EGP in just the last year, so your claim there's been "only" 9 in the last two years is, to say the least, a little dubious. And CLEARMAP uses the official community boundaries, not unofficial "neighborhood" boundaries.

11 murders in one year in a neighborhood of 20,000 people, a rate roughly 3 times the city average and 9 times the national average.... yeah, I'd say it's a violent ghetto.

[Lookout Kid]

Originally Posted by Actual Resident

I can't find these numbers. Can you please post a link?

I told you the publication where you can find it. Please find your own link. The CPD website has changed recently, and I can't find anything on it anymore. But they used to have PDFs available of each year's annual report, and I have the 2006 PDF stored on my computer.

[Lookout Kid]

Originally Posted by Drover

It's not greater Garfield Park, though their definition of EGP appears to follow the "neighborhood" boundaries (which are always fluid and subject to change) versus the official community boundaries which are fixed. Refer to CPD's CLEARMAP if you don't trust everyblock, even though everyblock culls its data from the exact same database as CLEARMAP. According to CPD, there's been 11 murders in EGP in just the last year, so your claim there's been "only" 9 in the last two years is, to say the least, a little dubious. And CLEARMAP uses the official community boundaries, not unofficial "neighborhood" boundaries.

11 murders in one year in a neighborhood of 20,000 people, a rate roughly 3 times the city average and 9 times the national average.... yeah, I'd say it's a violent ghetto.

In 2006, the East Garfield Park Community Area had 12 murders, but this is for a population of only 20,881 people! That's a rate of 57.5 murders per 100,000 residents. For comparison, that year Englewood had 37.3 murders per 100,000 residents. East Garfield Park is one of the most violent, gang-infested neighborhoods in a violent, gang-infested city. There's just no denying it.

[NearWestSider]

Originally Posted by Lookout Kid

I've spent plenty of time in East Garfield Park. Am I afraid to visit the neighborhood from time to time? No. Am I scared out of my wits to go to the conservatory on the "L"? No. Would I want to live my entire existence there on a day to day basis? No ****ing way.

I suppose. After all, why would anyone EVER want to leave Naperville North. Especially when, from the convenience of your easy chair, you can read crime statistics on a web site and make disparaging comments on a message board?

You probably won't, but seriously should, go down there, take a look, get a full grasp of the scope, and draw your own conclusions. You live in Chicago. Its not that far, and it really is a pleasant bike ride.

I am not saying you should move your family there, nor will you find the boulevards looking like Lincoln Park.

But as an architect, you should, at the very least, be able to acknowledge that SOME people (who, I should add, probably have more of a comittment to this city than you, I, and all the snooty-toots on this message board combined) are doing some VERY important historic preservation in that part of the world. I would also hope that you would realize that characterizing these restored areas as "dangerous ghettos" is not only false, it is a trivialization of some very good and very hard work.

FYI, I've been doing the exact bike ride I recommended once a week for the last six weeks (we have a project going on nearby). My reaction was "wow, I'd heard about EGP, but didn't know THIS MUCH was going on". I was quite impressed, and extremely happy to see it, expecially when you contrast what is happening there to what is happening on Chicago and Augusta, just a little ways to the North.

[Actual Resident]

Originally Posted by Lookout Kid

I told you the publication where you can find it. Please find your own link. The CPD website has changed recently, and I can't find anything on it anymore. But they used to have PDFs available of each year's annual report, and I have the 2006 PDF stored on my computer.

Perhaps you should update your maps and stats.

Let's be clear here. I am not arguing that East Garfield Park is all rainbows and peace and love. It has its share of problems.
But, I see a lot of loudmouthed yahoos spouting off on here, and it irritates me. I happen to like my neighborhood and I think many times people go way too far in disparaging it.

The thing about your 11+k number of crimes indexed for 100k residents caught my attention. That is because EGP is not a very densly populated area. There are only around 20k residents in EGP. This means that you can divide your number roughly by five to find the actual number of crimes for 2006.

You posted a map on another thread that shows EGP in red. Here's the link (in case you need a reminder).

http://www.city-data.com/forum/chica...orth-risk.html

This map is also indexed for 100k residents. EGP has 20k residents. Humboldt has +100k residents. HP is designated yellow 1500-2000. EGP is red which is 4000+. Since we don't know what that number actually is, lets use your other number: 11,479. Divide that by five and we have the actual number of crimes: 2295. Since HP has around 100k residents we don't have to adjust. So, if the map was shaded (with the same neighborhood borders) by actual number of crimes, then HP and EGP would be comparable.

We can parse the statistics all day long, but I think you might admit that using the 11k number is misleading at the very least.

[Actual Resident]

[quote=Lookout Kid;9119160]In 2006, the East Garfield Park Community Area had 12 murders, but this is for a population of only 20,881 people! That's a rate of 57.5 murders per 100,000 residents.quote]

Oh my God! Your're right! Let's see...

That's 574 murders per 1,000,000 residents!
That's 57,468 murders per 100,000,000 residents!

Oh my God! You can use a calculator!