moving from NY to Chicago (Lincoln, Roscoe: section 8, real estate, apartments)

[neonwattagelimit]

I'm a 23 y/o guy who will be moving to Chicago in January, both for my job and as a personal choice. I'm originally from a suburban area of NYC, and while I live there now, I went to college in the city and I'm quite familiar with it. I'd really like to get some questions about my move, where to find an apartment, all the usual stuff. If anyone who is intimately familiar with both NY and Chicago can help out, all the better. Anyway, a few more specific Qs:

In terms of neighborhoods, the Wicker Park/Bucktown area seems to appeal the most to me. I'm not that artsy, but prefer that sort of scene to the post-frat boy stuff that I've heard dominates Wrigleyville, plus the commute seems fairly simple (I'll be working in the Loop). How is Logan Square? I've seen lots of good deals there, as my roughly 750-800/month price range makes it harder to find a 1BR in Wicker Park/Bucktown. Also, what is the best North Side neighborhood of Lakeview, Lincoln Square, Roscoe Village, Uptown and Andersonville?

I've made an appointment with a broker through apartmentpeople.com. Is this service any good? I'll be in town this upcoming weekend to search for a place, so I'm obviously down to the wire here.

I hear a lot of things about certain 'hoods I've been checking out being "shady," particularly Logan Square and Uptown. I really want to know what's meant by this, 'cause frankly, I find that alot of the time this sort of advice assumes you have spent little or no time in an urban environment. So, what's wrong with these places? Is it just some shabby buildings and homeless people (for a point of comparison, every SF travel guide tells you to be wary of the Tenderloin, I walked through the area a few times when I was there last summer a didn't find it particularly threatening)? Or are these real slums with serious crime problems?

On a related note, I know Chicago has more crime than NY, but how much worse is it, really?

Is this CTA "doomsday" thing actually going to come to pass? Can I count on the CTA or is it just hopelessly dysfunctional?

How about are the winters? I saw the average high temp. in Jan. is about six degrees cooler than NY. Seems like a significant difference, but not something I'd find unbearable.

If you can provide any other advice, like the best ways to meet people, that would be cool, too. Also, if you have any other questions for me, just ask. Thanks very much!

[Lookout Kid]

If I were you, I'd start in Wicker Park or Bucktown--then you can decide if Logan Square or Uptown is good for you.

Logan Square was an alsmot solidly Latino neighborhood ten years ago--mostly Puerto Rican and Mexican--and it is in the process of controversial gentrification. The areas adjacent to Bucktown are almost 100% gentrified now. It has some gang problems, but is by no means the warzone you'd find in places like Lawndale or Englewood. The density is a bit lower than over by the lake, and there are many beautiful greystones and a broad planted boulevard.

Uptown is a different story. This is where I live now, so I can offer some perspective on it in its current state (it's changed a lot even in the past two years). Uptown is a dense lakefront neighborhood, and it's perhaps the biggest mixed bag in the city. There is a huge mix of incomes and ethnicities within a small area. Uptown had a really bad reputation from the 1960s until the 1990s, but has been changing quickly since then. The main problems in Uptown are small pockets of poverty and a large concentration of Homeless Shelters and social services. There are still a few gangbangers around who cause some trouble, but there are way more homeless people and SRO residents who sit around and drink and do drugs on the street.

Buena Park, the southern part of Uptown, is quite nice and is directly adjacent to Lakeview. In may ways, it now feels like a northern extension of Lakeview almost up to Montrose Ave. You still have some of the loitering problems along Broadway, but it's a pretty great neighborhood, you still have great access to Lakeview, and you don't pay Lakeview prices for real estate.

The northeastern part of Uptown is called Margate Park, and it is also a nice enclave adjacent to Edgewater. There are beatiful vintage condos directly on the lakefront parks.

Sheridan Park, the west-central part of Uptown, is where most of the recent gentrification has occured. The residential streets are absolutely gorgeous and tree-lined, but there are still re-hab centers and some section 8 housing sprinkled about. It would probably be a bit like living in Logan Square, actually. The gentrification of Sheridan Park has been controversial since the 80s, and Uptown is very politically polarized.

The east-central part of Uptown is where most of the poverty and crime trouble lies, but it is improving every year. If you live in Uptown, you will have the most trouble here (from Montrose north to Lawrence, from Broadway east to the lake). However, there are many great condos popping up all over the place in this area.

The northwest corner of Uptown is close to Andersonville, and feels more connected to that scene than the rest of Uptown. Between this and Margate Park on the east is a "little Viet Nam" or "little Laos". It is centered on Argyle street, and is the highest concentration of Southeast Asian immigrants in the city.

Uptown is quickly becoming a neighborhood of low-rise vintage condos and high-rise low-income housing. The lakefront is a safe bet on the north and south edges of the neighborhood--and the high-rises on Marine Drive are mostly condos--but the rest of Uptown isn't as integrated as people believe. Lot's of different groups live in close proximity to one another, but there isn't much mixing. The Alderman, Helen Shiller, is a very controversial figure who has largely based her career on fighting gentrification and affordable housing. Some have said that she maintains her political base by "dragging every wino she can find to a voting booth". She was a 60s radical socialist who has now succumbed to the Daley machine, and she has been very resilient politically.

[Attrill]

I think the entire area covered by the Blue Line from Logan Sq. to the Loop could work well for you. No matter what happens with the CTA funding situation the Blue Line will still run regularly, and they've completed repairs between Division and the loop. Some bus routes will be cut if they don't get the situation resolved (which they most likely will, but that's a whle other thread). There are plenty of great bars, restaurants, and concert venues that are along this stretch as well.

I don't know about "shady", but parts of Logan Sq. are "gritty" (think of some of the up and coming sections of Brooklyn). Other than a few sections in the far SW and W sides it is perfectly safe. Stay cose to the Blue Line and you'll be fine. The main problems are gangs, drugs, and prostitution. It varies from block to block in the sketchier areas, but like most "transitional" urban neighborhoods if you don't mess with anyone you won't have any problems. Check Chicagocrime.org for crime reports. The southern portion around Palmer Sq. (Western and California El stops) as well as the area around Logan Sq. proper are fine. There is a large Latino population (primarily Mexican immigrants) but there isn't as much opposition to gentrification as there is in Humboldt Park or other parts of the city.

West Town and Ukrainian Village are also good areas to check out, the strip of restaurants and bars along Division is great, and there are a lot of places opening up on Chicago Ave. as well. If you are taking the Blue line to the Loop every day you might want to avoid getting on at the Chicago stop at rush hour - the trains are usually packed by that point and you may need to wait for 2 or 3 trains to go by before you can get on.

[jessiegirl_98]

I would agree with the above posts. I just wanted to comment regarding the apartment people. You can search these threads to get more information on them and they do have a great selection of apartments, but are notrious for running hours behind. I would also make some appointments through craiglist and also possibly add a second search service (search this forum for more reviews and recommendations). I would also start in your prefered neighborhood (you can often find good deals) and then stretch out to some of the others: you might like Lincoln Square as well as Andersonville from your description. Again, I would search the forum for a lot of info on these neighborhoods.

[neonwattagelimit]

Thanks very much for your help! I'm leaning towards that, too, areas along the blue line up to the Logan Square stop. Of course, I consider the Western stop and/or the California stop preferable, as they are far closer to Wicker Park/Bucktown and, I'd imagine, a bit safer. Can I realistically find something decent in my price range (700-850/month for a 1BR) in those areas?

That said, I have friends that have lived in predominantly Latino areas of NY (East Harlem, Sunset Park), and never had any problems. "Grit" doesn't bother me in the least so long as there's not a real crime problem, and stuff in the neighborhood.

Ukranian Village looks cool, and from what I read about it it seems comparable to Brooklyn's Greenpoint, which is a neighborhood I like and am very familiar with. My only concern there is that it appears to be far from the train-how would I get to work from there?

[aragx6]

The lack of el service is the major con to Ukranian Village. You'll need to take a bus. Pretty much every major street has regular bus service.

[neonwattagelimit]

Originally Posted by jessiegirl_98

I would agree with the above posts. I just wanted to comment regarding the apartment people. You can search these threads to get more information on them and they do have a great selection of apartments, but are notrious for running hours behind.

"running hours behind" do they not keep appointments or something?

[Avengerfire]

Originally Posted by neonwattagelimit

Thanks very much for your help! I'm leaning towards that, too, areas along the blue line up to the Logan Square stop. Of course, I consider the Western stop and/or the California stop preferable, as they are far closer to Wicker Park/Bucktown and, I'd imagine, a bit safer. Can I realistically find something decent in my price range (700-850/month for a 1BR) in those areas?

That said, I have friends that have lived in predominantly Latino areas of NY (East Harlem, Sunset Park), and never had any problems. "Grit" doesn't bother me in the least so long as there's not a real crime problem, and stuff in the neighborhood.

Ukranian Village looks cool, and from what I read about it it seems comparable to Brooklyn's Greenpoint, which is a neighborhood I like and am very familiar with. My only concern there is that it appears to be far from the train-how would I get to work from there?

You should be able to find something around 700. I do not think I would pay 850 around there, however.

[jessiegirl_98]

Originally Posted by neonwattagelimit

"running hours behind" do they not keep appointments or something?

I attempted to use them 2 years in a row. Both times I had appointments and they were running hours (at least 2) behind the appointment times. That being said, I know other people who have used them without a problem. I would definitly keep your appointment as they do have a large selection, but have a back up in case that happens to you (and I wouldn't rely on them for your whole search). Also, this might not be as big of a problem since you are looking to move in the winter, rather than one of the prime moving times.

[Attrill]

Originally Posted by neonwattagelimit

Thanks very much for your help! I'm leaning towards that, too, areas along the blue line up to the Logan Square stop. Of course, I consider the Western stop and/or the California stop preferable, as they are far closer to Wicker Park/Bucktown and, I'd imagine, a bit safer. Can I realistically find something decent in my price range (700-850/month for a 1BR) in those areas?

That said, I have friends that have lived in predominantly Latino areas of NY (East Harlem, Sunset Park), and never had any problems. "Grit" doesn't bother me in the least so long as there's not a real crime problem, and stuff in the neighborhood.

Ukranian Village looks cool, and from what I read about it it seems comparable to Brooklyn's Greenpoint, which is a neighborhood I like and am very familiar with. My only concern there is that it appears to be far from the train-how would I get to work from there?

You should be able to find a 1br for $7-800 without much trouble. For $850 you might be able to get a 2 br or it might be worth looking into a 1 br in N. Bucktown as well (east of Western along Armitage). Around the Western Ave. stop stay east of Kedzie and you can easily walk to the Blue line. That area is really good, there is a decent bar right at the El stop (Green Eye), great Mexican places, and you're within 10-20 minutes walking distance of some of great places in Bucktown (Coast, LaGuardia, Map Room, a lot of other stuff around Damen/Armitage). You can also get to everything in Bucktown/Ukrainian village by the El, Western Ave. bus, or walking. There isn't a whole lot right around the California stop right now, but two places will be opening up in the next year (a brewpub from the guy who owns Handlebar and a second Northside) and there is plenty of stuff that is within walking distance or taking the El.

For Ukrainian Village and West Town look around the Division El stop - rent will probably be a bit cheaper heading east, in the area between Ashland and the expressway. I lived in Ukrainian Village for 10 years (Chicago and Damen) and usually walked downtown to get to work or walked to the Division stop. It was about 45 minutes to walk to the north end of the Loop or 15 minutes to walk to the Division stop. Getting further than that from the El could be a bit far. It's probably best to not count on the Chciago Ave. bus to get to the Blue line. My wife did it for years and it was nightmare - overcrowded and you have to wait for a few buses at rush hour. That said, it's a great neighborhood.