Chicago Finances/Ratings Downgrade (Detroit: 2014, condo, how much)

[Kamms]

Originally Posted by andrew61

Nah. All the stores I mentioned are big chains that can absorb higher rents far better than the little guy can.

Chains typically close locations when they underperform. I'm betting that is the case here.

Right, especially with Walgreens and Panera. This area was not great back in the late '80s-'90s; busy, but not great in terms of upscale or chain stores. The 90s reinvented the area and since the real estate crash of '06-the recent stabilizing/increases in some areas, this intersection has suffered from vacancies. I noticed this in the vast vacancies at this intersection in '08.

I agree that the ''chains'' only close locations when they underperform. Chains arriving indicate increased rental rates; chains leaving generally indicate decreased traffic. Let's face it, folks' spending power has diminished greatly since at least '08. This is just the long term effect of a large decrease in disposable income among lots of people, even in prosperous Lakeview/Lincoln Park.

We're recovering from a depression, which is not a p.c. term. Anything called a Great Recession is aka a depression. Not a Great Depression perhaps but since the '30s, you will never hear any economic calamity called a depression again. Too scary of a term with way too much of a psychological reaction on our part.

[Kamms]

Originally Posted by ForYourLungsOnly

It's a strange situation. All this doom and gloom yet downtown population is growing, 18 high rises are being built, and you hear news all the time of suburban companies relocating to the city and other out of state companies expanding or moving here. On another website I supposedly can't name, the Chicago Economics thread has a new story daily about some company moving here or expanding. Interesting.

Chicago is well known for its ''media'' focusing on good news. Downtown Chicago most likely is growing in terms of residents, perhaps jobs etc. Downtown lost a lot of jobs as well though.

Downtown residential and job growth is great as it increased the tax base and consumer spending in the city's core; points we all know.

However, Chicago continues to lose its middle class and the local and state debt issues are basically at emergency levels and cannot be offset by downtown population and job growth.

I want Chicago to do well economically as I have business there. However, while there are some ''green shoots'', these are not sufficient, currently, to dig the city and state out of a really deep financial hole. It's basically at an emergency level. Wonder how many still scoff that Chicago will never end up like Detroit, bankruptcy-wise. It is a real option.

I'm sure you know how to take all the only good news from the Chicago establishment; remember the origin of of Chicago's ''Windy City'' nickname.

[Chicago60614]

Originally Posted by andrew61

And then take a look at the "prosperous" North Side (e.g., Lincoln Park/Lakeview). Storefronts emptying out like crazy. I was standing at the corner where Clark, Broadway and Diversey come together this afternoon waiting for the light to change, and looked around me and had to catch my breath, realizing I was witnessing a once-thriving area quickly turning to crap. I counted no fewer than four empty storefronts in the immediate vicinity. Nothing has yet gone into the old Walgreens space, Hanig's is gone, Vitamin Shoppe is gone, and now Panera is gone. Something's going on, and it's not good..

I was actually just walking around yesterday noticing how much residential construction there is for the middle of winter. I've been in Lakeview for years. They overbuilt some crappy streetfront retail at the base of condo buildings from 2004 to 2007, but overall the neighborhood is doing just fine.

Hagins and Vitamin Shoppe said they're being hit very hard by internet sales. Apparently a Teavana is going to start building out the old Hagins in the next few weeks. There's a tenant lined up for the Vitamin Shoppe, but so far it's not been made public as they sort through the LOI between the landlord and the tenant.

The old Walgreens and Panera is being held up because that damn mid/highrise behind it that had plans to build over those spaces with a residential building on the corner needs to crap or get off the pot and stop dragging its feet on those spaces. Either rehab/gut it and get someone in there or follow through with your plans to bring the building down and build your residential mid-rise.

Jamba Juice also closed on the northwest corner of that intersection last year. Some donut shop is supposed to open there in the next 6 weeks.

That area looks tragic now, but hopefully just wait a bit!

[Chicago60614]

Originally Posted by Kamms

Chicago is well known for its ''media'' focusing on good news. Downtown Chicago most likely is growing in terms of residents, perhaps jobs etc. Downtown lost a lot of jobs as well though.

Downtown residential and job growth is great as it increased the tax base and consumer spending in the city's core; points we all know.

However, Chicago continues to lose its middle class and the local and state debt issues are basically at emergency levels and cannot be offset by downtown population and job growth.

I want Chicago to do well economically as I have business there. However, while there are some ''green shoots'', these are not sufficient, currently, to dig the city and state out of a really deep financial hole. It's basically at an emergency level. Wonder how many still scoff that Chicago will never end up like Detroit, bankruptcy-wise. It is a real option.

I'm sure you know how to take all the only good news from the Chicago establishment; remember the origin of of Chicago's ''Windy City'' nickname.

Of the places I've lived and visited I always felt like Chicago loved to point out the negative much more than others. It points out the positive too, but everywhere always jumps on the positive.

Downtown is certainly the bright spot, one of the only, in the city. It's a strange situation because it's not just a bright spot, it's really booming quite nicely. Jobs created just downtown since the recession ended in 2010 were counted up to be around 63,000 or 13% (compared to a loss of 39,000 in the rest of the city), on top of 52,000 created from 2000 to 2011. The downtown area might have lost some jobs during the recession from around 2008 to 2010, but it's EASILY at all-time record job counts currently.

Population increased by 50,000 downtown during the 2000's and they've been throwing up thousands of new apartment units every year. My company owns apartment highrises downtown and I do a ton of research on that market. Occupancy has absorbed everything they've put up so far, and rents keep creeping up.

The riverwalk, Maggie Daley Park, Northerly Island, transit improvements, revamping Navy Pier, Divvy, the Navy Pier flyover, literally THOUSANDS of new hotel rooms and over a dozen large new hotels, around 20 or whatever it is now highrises under construction.

It's a tale of two cities, downtown and the rest of the city (well not the north side, at least from downtown through Uptown, that's doing perfectly fine). I can see why people get frustrated with Rahm. Downtown is a dreamboat of change and development across so many fronts right now, while much of the rest of the city just kinda stands around.

[ForYourLungsOnly]

Top Metros: Strength in Diversity || Site Selection Online

[helena101]

Originally Posted by ForYourLungsOnly

Top Metros: Strength in Diversity || Site Selection Online

I'm not sure what to make of a list that gives Detroit a high ranking.

[ForYourLungsOnly]

Originally Posted by helena101

I'm not sure what to make of a list that gives Detroit a high ranking.

The numbers are what they are.

[Ace Rothstein]

Originally Posted by helena101

I'm not sure what to make of a list that gives Detroit a high ranking.

It is a metro ranking, not just the city.

[helena101]

Originally Posted by ForYourLungsOnly

The numbers are what they are.

Most lists that look at metro areas with an eye to things like job growth, in-migration of educated people, economic stability and growth, government/financial situation, etc- all rank the Chicago and Detroit metro areas poorly compared to other metro areas. So I'm not sure what "cities with the most projects" tells us.

[FAReastcoast]

Originally Posted by andrew61

And then take a look at the "prosperous" North Side (e.g., Lincoln Park/Lakeview). Storefronts emptying out like crazy. I was standing at the corner where Clark, Broadway and Diversey come together this afternoon waiting for the light to change, and looked around me and had to catch my breath, realizing I was witnessing a once-thriving area quickly turning to crap. I counted no fewer than four empty storefronts in the immediate vicinity. Nothing has yet gone into the old Walgreens space, Hanig's is gone, Vitamin Shoppe is gone, and now Panera is gone. Something's going on, and it's not good..

You are right, something is going on...The Walgreens and Panera are going to be torn down for a new Mid Rise Apartment Building; the grocery store across the street will also be torn down for a highrise.