Why don't poor neighborhoods have Grocery Stores? (coupons, living in)

[Costa Rica Chica]

^I'm not disagreeing that unhealthy attitudes exist, that is certainly part of the problem. But it all stems from a lack of education - programs have to be started to change peoples' attitudes as well as making healthier food more accessible.

[GoCUBS1]

Originally Posted by skipcromer

Theres nothing healthy about a PBJ sandwich.

Ive never eaten straight tuna, isnt mayo usually added to it?

Egg Sandwich? Never ate one but it sounds pretty healthy and cheap.

For my PBJ, I use only all-natural PB (NEVER the processed, hydrogenated oil PB), homemade strawberry or blueberry fruit preserve - just fruit and pectin (from my grandma on the farm ), and Natural Ovens whole wheat bread. This is the only bread I'll eat as it is packed w/healthy flax and Omega-3. I disagree that my PBJ is unhealthy.

I detest mayo and may use a very small amt of Miracle Whip w/the tuna fish or no dressing at all.

I cook an over-easy egg (or scrambled eggs w/Oberweis skim milk) for the egg sandwich... I never use butter - only olive oil or canola. I often add my homemade salsa (only tomato, pepper, onion) to my egg sandwich and wrap it with a whole wheat tortilla. I usually add spinach leaf to all my sandwiches (often from my vegetable garden).

Any other diet questions? Many people tell me I am the healthiest eater they know...

[gussie]

Why do you think? We had lots of grocery stores go under in Waukegan.. there was just too much loss.. and I mean SHOPLIFTING!!!!

[desperad0stl]

hmm...depends who you're talking about...
Personally I come from poor families from 2 cultures...
My mexican half would go to mexican markets and buy lots of vegetables, rice, and cheap meats and cook big pots of food once or twice a week to eat all week...healthy and cheap.
My black half only had corner markets and pete's shur sav market to shop at and they ate what was available...there was no such thing as fresh fruits and vegetables...we had grape drink and frozen pizzas that tasted like candy + ramen noodles...i grew up eating lots of ramen noodles with vienna sausages mixed in.

Both sides are doing better now both are eating better as well. My mother can now afford to buy steaks, fresh vegetables, fresh chicken and fruit and thats what she and my little bro eat now.
Despite their solid financial status' today, my dad and grandmother still have the habit of cooking big pots for cheap today and I also have a healthy variety of quick things to eat when I visit.

When it comes to my Grandparents on my mom's side though, they've been in the same poor neighborhoods their entire lives and they've spent 70 years eating the same food...they crave bad food and they eat bad food. They're reluctant to try anything new because they never had the option. I always poke fun at them and try to get them to try new things but everything I present them with is strange, gross or nasty...since most of us grew up in fairly well off households we all had the means to try new things and money opens up doors to exposure.
Education may be a factor but both of my parents are High School drop outs, It seems that they had enough sense to buy healthy food and exercise once they had the means and time to do so.

I think big grocery stores don't make it in poor neighborhoods not because people are uneducated but because they've only had a few options and most of them have been unhealthy...Their minds and bodies crave that same crap that they've been eating their entire lives.
It's easy for most of us to grasp the concept of eating well no matter where we live because we've been exposed to healthy alternatives. If the same old crap is what's in demand then the same old crap is what poor people will be presented with.
There are plenty of dirt poor uneducated immigrants in Chicago but they brought their healthy cheap options with + they opened their own grocery stores as well.

I took after the culture that thinks grocery stores are stupid.. I do the giant pots and roasts thing on Sundays as I am a dirt poor college student...I go to restaurant depot and buy 10 lb bags of meat and vegetables and make big pots of stuff because that's the culture I was raised around...my cousin and I (aka roommate) eat healthier than most people for less than $200 a month combined.
Going to the corner store or gas station to buy a bag of doritos and ho hos + a soda could be my first choice, if that was the only culture i was raised in and formed habits from.

Therefore, I can come back and say...why do all of you make such poor choices and spend too much money on processed and pre-packaged products? Why do you buy coca cola with high fructose corn syrup from the grocery store instead of the coca cola from the mexican market with pure cane sugar?
Was it the culture you were raised in your whole lives and don't know any better? The grocery stores see this habit and they pounce on it...its all business and it's part of your culture.

The "grocery store" is the Asian, Mexican, African market equivalent for middle and upper class (and mostly white) America...it's your own market.
Trust me I'm not going to start buying your disgusting gringo salsa,gross (+ unhealthy) flour tortillas, weird americanized chinese food, and gross processed cheeses that are sold in the grocery stores...that stuff is catered to you guys. Sadly unhealthy food is part of poor urban american culture.

[desperad0stl]

oh and one more thing...grocery stores like valuable real estate.

[JanuaryGirl]

I haven't read through all ten pages, maybe this has already been mentioned...

Insurance costs are higher in higher-crime areas. This is a big reason major chains tend to stay away. Not only do they lost money from theft of items, but also vandalism and the insurance to cover these costs is higher. Also, their HR is more difficult; people from poor neighborhoods will travel to good neighborhoods to work, but not vice-versa.

[skipcromer]

Originally Posted by GoCUBS1

For my PBJ, I use only all-natural PB (NEVER the processed, hydrogenated oil PB), homemade strawberry or blueberry fruit preserve - just fruit and pectin (from my grandma on the farm ), and Natural Ovens whole wheat bread. This is the only bread I'll eat as it is packed w/healthy flax and Omega-3. I disagree that my PBJ is unhealthy.

I detest mayo and may use a very small amt of Miracle Whip w/the tuna fish or no dressing at all.

I cook an over-easy egg (or scrambled eggs w/Oberweis skim milk) for the egg sandwich... I never use butter - only olive oil or canola. I often add my homemade salsa (only tomato, pepper, onion) to my egg sandwich and wrap it with a whole wheat tortilla. I usually add spinach leaf to all my sandwiches (often from my vegetable garden).

Any other diet questions? Many people tell me I am the healthiest eater they know...

That would be one expensive PBJ sandwich for someone with little income.

[eevee]

Originally Posted by skipcromer

That would be one expensive PBJ sandwich for someone with little income.

all natural PB is pretty cheap when compared to regular national brands of PB. problem is, it's harder to find and may not go on sale as regularly. the Whole Foods I used to go to had all natural, unsalted, fresh ground PB for $2/lb, which, when refilling an old Skippy jar I had, came up to almost the same amount as the Skippy when not on sale (somewhere around $3, give or take). granted, one can find store brand PB for $1. healthy preserves can be made at home using fresh fruit for cheap.

of course, all of the above assumes that people know about these options and have access to them. I personally have NO clue how to make preserves (hope to learn this summer!) and only know about the cheap, fresh made PB b/c I used to work for Whole Foods. and of course, I had access to healthier by working at WF, something many low income people don't

so yes, while healthy foods can be fairly inexpensive in some cases, a lot of people may not know this or know how to use it to their advantage. thankfully, even many low income people know the benefits of a farmers' market (go to Haymarket in Boston on the weekends and you'll see people of all income levels shopping for cheap produce and meats there, some even dragging them miles back home on the bus/train)

as for the comparison of buying of buying 10 double cheeseburgers vs making sandwiches at home, I think another issue is that many low income people lack the ability to foresee their future needs. frankly, many suck at budgeting (*raises hand* though I have gotten better over the years), or simply don't know how (not all of them of course). so someone is sitting around, no food in the fridge, and have $10 to spend. they can either go to the supermarket and buy food items that will not only ease their current hunger, but take care of the next few meals, or they can spend $2 on a couple of cheeseburgers and forget about going to the store (which, again, is likely further away than a fast food joint). they'll likely opt for the latter and not worry about what they will eat later on. they likely live paycheck to paycheck, doing the same thing, worried about only satisfying their current needs (ie, getting a cheeseburger b/c they're hungry now) w/o thinking of long term solutions (ie, saving some money and buying enough food to make multiple burgers later on). I've actually done the same thing at times, putting off going to the supermarket when I had little to eat in the fridge and just getting fast food instead. now I keep enough food lying around to keep this from happening.

[GoCUBS1]

Originally Posted by eevee

as for the comparison of buying of buying 10 double cheeseburgers vs making sandwiches at home, I think another issue is that many low income people lack the ability to foresee their future needs. frankly, many suck at budgeting (*raises hand* though I have gotten better over the years), or simply don't know how (not all of them of course). so someone is sitting around, no food in the fridge, and have $10 to spend. they can either go to the supermarket and buy food items that will not only ease their current hunger, but take care of the next few meals, or they can spend $2 on a couple of cheeseburgers and forget about going to the store (which, again, is likely further away than a fast food joint). they'll likely opt for the latter and not worry about what they will eat later on. they likely live paycheck to paycheck, doing the same thing, worried about only satisfying their current needs (ie, getting a cheeseburger b/c they're hungry now) w/o thinking of long term solutions (ie, saving some money and buying enough food to make multiple burgers later on). I've actually done the same thing at times, putting off going to the supermarket when I had little to eat in the fridge and just getting fast food instead. now I keep enough food lying around to keep this from happening.

This is so true.... I agree that lack of advanced planning and "lack of ability to foresee future needs" can be a big issue w/low income people. Eating healthy is a learned lifestyle and takes a little more thought/work than just running to McDonalds. This is why these educational intervention programs are so important.

[GoCUBS1]

Originally Posted by skipcromer

That would be one expensive PBJ sandwich for someone with little income.

As eevee mentioned, my sandwich is a comparable price but may take a little more planning than just picking up a Whopper. It also takes "delayed gratification" to wait until you get home to get a sandwich. The ability to delay gratification may be lacking in people who choose to eat only fast food meals. I've seen studies about how the ability to plan and delay gratification is important for personal success - this is the same for your eating habits.