Chicago Infrastructure Thread (Cicero, Leland: houses, cost, mall)

[Irishtom29]

Originally Posted by Intergalactic

Finally, discounting Mike Royko as a source for this is to disparage all of the great journalists of the 20th century. Royko knew everybody, machine guys, mafiosi, and the technocrats. He published his book Boss when Daley was still alive and in power, and I defy you to find a contemporary account of anybody denying the claim.

ALL the great journalists of the 20th Century? You're throwing a pretty wide loop there pardner.

Besides, I met Royko in the late 1960s and was involved in a story he wrote about after superficial investigation and got wrong. Sometimes he was full of crap.

There's no doubt that old man Daley used public works to protect certain areas from Blacks. For instance the Circle campus was originally planned for the Garfield Park area but Daley had it moved to it's present site to guard the Loop from Blacks. If they had built Circle in Garfield Park I'd probably still be going to Mass at Resurrection.

But you're disregarding the evidence that the most sensible place for the Ryan is right where it is. "Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar", know what I mean?

[Intergalactic]

Originally Posted by Irishtom29

ALL the great journalists of the 20th Century? You're throwing a pretty wide loop there pardner.

Besides, I met Royko in the late 1960s and was involved in a story he wrote about after superficial investigation and got wrong. Sometimes he was full of crap.

There's no doubt that old man Daley used public works to protect certain areas from Blacks. For instance the Circle campus was originally planned for the Garfield Park area but Daley had it moved to it's present site to guard the Loop from Blacks. If they had built Circle in Garfield Park I'd probably still be going to Mass at Resurrection.

But you're disregarding the evidence that the most sensible place for the Ryan is right where it is. "Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar", know what I mean?

Parsing your statement, then, we have: You are old enough to know that reporters in those days were more important than most youngsters today can imagine, and it was to those youngsters I was directing my sweeping statement. Royko was an investigative reporter, and you were familiar with the details of something he was investigating. Daley used put in Circle Campus to keep the Blacks out. But the Dan Ryan needed to go somewhere.

I agree that Royko made mistakes, but he was not a nobody nor a clown to be ignored. Neither was Dan Walker and the academics whose books I linked to be ignored. And there is a lack of published opposition to the claim.

I'm not disregarding the idea that the Ryan is located in the best place. In fact, if I had been Daley I would have put it in approximately the same location. The reasons; the land values were cheapest and political opposition lowest where the poor Blacks lived. Not listening to my Irish constituents would have been politically dangerous. But all these reasons themselves have an underlying reason; pure racism. The very idea of neighborhood is based in race and class identity.

To the Whites of Bridgeport, there were only two choices; prevent any Black people from moving in, or move out en masse themselves. In the end, only the Whites from Hyde Park chose to integrate, and they were the target of anger from the other Whites in the city for showing it could be done. And don't even say it was the UofC that was behind it; the UofC people who made those decisions were White people from Hyde Park, supported by the whole neighborhood.

[Mr Downtown]

Unfortunately, when you dig into those books and look at the footnotes, you find that they're all just bringing forward the story from Boss, unquestioned, or they're simply saying that there was segregation and there were new superhighways. They never offer any evidence or causal link.

No one questions that Chicago suffered segregation, or that the Dan Ryan's final route reinforced a longstanding racial barrier (the NYC/Rock Island tracks). What I am questioning is the notion that the Ryan route was chosen solely for racial reasons, when it is so obviously superior for perfectly rational reasons such as cost, geometry, and less residential disruption.

[Lookout Kid]

Originally Posted by Carantini

actually, McCormik place is considered, even by the city government, to be one of the biggest mistakes ever made.

I'd agree that the design of it is a terrible mistake. But I'm still glad we have it. I just wish it wasn't such a conglomeration of crappy buildings that cut off the lakefront--and that it were better-connected to the Loop.

[Lookout Kid]

I took a class called something like "American Urban History: Civil War to Present" at a well-regarded university far removed from Chicago, and the professor of that class taught that the Dan Ryan was routed to protect white neighborhoods (i.e. Bridgeport, etc.) from the black belt. If this is a myth, it's a widely flung myth throughout America's academic circles. But of course, I've learned from experience in this city to take any arguments about race with a massive chunk of salt. I wonder if this has actually been studied in detail, or if it's just sloppy history? I could believe either if I saw good evidence.

[arinas123]

yes of course the infra structure should be better if in Obama's administration and city will hosts the Olympics games after 7 years if the plannning will be the best.

[oakparkdude]

Chicago area transit use jumps 9% over last 5 years, RTA says :: CHICAGO SUN-TIMES :: Transportation

Chicago area transit use jumps 9% over last 5 years, RTA says

April 29, 2009

BY MARY WISNIEWSKI Transportation Reporter
More area residents used public transit, and there was more public transit to use between 2003 and 2007, according to a Regional Transportation Authority report to be released today.

Both the number of miles of service available and the number of miles traveled by riders rose about 9 percent in those five years, the report found. The average number of annual rides taken per Chicago area resident also rose, from 69.6 in 2003 to 72.9 in 2007.

That's a huge uptick in ridership!

[oakparkdude]

Transit cash halted: About $1 billion worth of mass transit improvements may be in jeopardy -- chicagotribune.com

Transit cash halted: About $1 billion worth of mass transit improvements may be in jeopardy

Illinois Gov. Pat Quinn holds up transportation money recently approved for CTA, Metra and Pace under the state's mini-capital bill

By Jon Hilkevitch and Richard Wronski | Tribune reporters
April 30, 2009
About $1 billion worth of mass transit improvements recently approved under the state's mini-capital bill may be in jeopardy, but Chicago-area transit agencies are not yet shelving projects, officials said Wednesday.

Gov. Pat Quinn put a freeze on the transit projects -- but not on road and bridge repairs -- by holding back on the bonding necessary to finance the transit piece, said state Sen. Martin Sandoval (D-Chicago), chairman of the Senate Transportation Committee.

Not sure what's up with this. Its a little bit disconcerting.

[via chicago]

^^
wtf??

[Lookout Kid]

Quinn, you're ****ing OUT! I'm DONE WITH YOUR ****!!!

I'm starting to think this guy doesn't want to get a single vote...