Does Chicago need its own Manhattan? (apartment, rent, insurance)

[coldwine]

Originally Posted by via chicago

Its a planned manufacturing district and has been permanently set aside for light-moderate industrial use. There are dozens of others throughout the city

http://www.ci.chi.il.us/webportal/CO...dust_10_07.pdf

I don't know why we can't get rid of manufacturing. It's dirty, pollutive, a complete waste of good land and besides. It's damn ugly.

Chicago doesn't need its own Manhattan. Nor does Chicago need to try and become Manhattan. Manhattan is its own very, very special case and should remain such.

Likewise, Manhattan is not Chicago, and there are more positives about that than I could mention right now.

Chicago needs to plan its public trans better (which is just god awful), to zone for higher densities, and in my personal opinion, to stop wasting space with manufacturing.

It would also help if the boundless patronage that permeates all aspects of civil service would end, if money wouldn't be misappropriated and if local politics would stop wasting their time on the most petty and ridiculous of issues.

None of this is going to happen until Chicago actually has the compete on a global level, because as things stand right now the isolated mindset of our hick politicians is retarding social progress. Nevertheless, although certain good things can be borrowed from Manhattan... One does need to be aware that instead of just replicating, a wiser course is to mimic the good and pay special attention to the bad.

[Irishtom29]

Originally Posted by coldwine

I don't know why we can't get rid of manufacturing. It's dirty, pollutive, a complete waste of good land and besides. It's damn ugly.

Well it creates wealth and lots of good jobs. Maybe it's your job that's a complete waste.

Originally Posted by coldwine

because as things stand right now the isolated mindset of our hick politicians is retarding social progress.

Let me get this straight; you want to rid the city of it's manufacturing and good working class jobs and at the same time you want social progress? What kind of reactionary fantasy is that?

[Milwaukee City]

I don't know why we can't get rid of manufacturing. It's dirty, polluted, a complete waste of good land and besides. It's damn ugly.

These are the same people that complain about our jobs going overseas.

[DC's Finest]

Coldflu,

First you don't want to pay your taxes to IRS and now you want to rid Chicago of manufacturing jobs? I'm really starting to get worried!

[chitown85]

We do have a Manhattan. It's located about 50 or 60 miles south/southwest of the city in Will County

[prairiestate]

Originally Posted by chitown85

We do have a Manhattan. It's located about 50 or 60 miles south/southwest of the city in Will County

[coldwine]

Originally Posted by Irishtom29

Well it creates wealth and lots of good jobs. Maybe it's your job that's a complete waste.





Let me get this straight; you want to rid the city of it's manufacturing and good working class jobs and at the same time you want social progress? What kind of reactionary fantasy is that?

Industry does not belong in the city, nor even near the city. At the very least, Goose Island would be better used as a major distribution center for Chicago. It's strategically located.

The idea of "good working class jobs" is interesting, but it does not at all sit well with me when these jobs involve grown men and women doing the same repetitive, mindless task. I am not comfortable with a bottling plant where human beings, in modern America, actually sit on an assembly line and screw bottlecaps onto bottles or drill bolts into the same piece of machinery again. And again. And again.

These jobs do not belong in the modern world, nor do they belong on valuable real estate.

Originally Posted by Milwaukee City

These are the same people that complain about our jobs going overseas.

See above.

Originally Posted by DC's Finest

Coldflu,

First you don't want to pay your taxes to IRS and now you want to rid Chicago of manufacturing jobs? I'm really starting to get worried!

My stance, publically and privately, has always been one of support for taxation. Certainly on this board, I've always supported taxation. Out of the belief that civilization has costs, and from the idea that taxation provides services and amenities I would like to see more of (and would pay more taxes for) then yes. That disclaimer is at the bottom of a page entitled "Coldwine Pays Her Taxes And Has Never Withheld So Much As A Penny From The Federal Government".

However, as a JD CPA MST, I do have issues with how the tax structure currently (fails) works.

With regards to manufacturing, see above. Goose Island has land that can easily house more valuable people than factory workers and more valuable industries than manufacturing.

You, DC's Finest, should indeed be worried. We've had our little tiffs before in the City vs. City section, but I was content previously to ignore your "city" like everyone else.

Now, though, I am finding that I have so much more free time. My curiosity is now piqued by your concern, and in the future I will dedicate more time to explaining the exact nature of DC and NoVA in the threads that are bound to come up.

In fact I have a scheduled drive down the country lane you call the 495. I'll be sure to take pictures of the charming little town it passes through

[softdev]

Originally Posted by Irishtom29

Well it creates wealth and lots of good jobs. Maybe it's your job that's a complete waste.

Let me get this straight; you want to rid the city of it's manufacturing and good working class jobs and at the same time you want social progress? What kind of reactionary fantasy is that?

It doesn't create wealth in this country anymore and that's the point. Manufacturing has moved from 28% of all workers in the 50s to 8% today. All the low end manufacturing jobs are gone and eventually even the high-end jobs will be replaced by overseas labor or robots.

It's time for us to recognize this fact and figure out what to do about it. These jobs aren't coming back as the economics of unskilled foreign labor is a no brainers for any business owner. No amount of protectionism (local or national) or bailouts or green jobs are going to staunch the bleeding. In fact, these measures will do just delay the inevitable and cause more pain later. How much better off would all these laid off auto factory workers be if they had read the writing on the wall earlier this decade (or long before...) and started on a new career path.

Progress is only going one way. Cities like Chicago (and NY) have benefited tremendously by cleaning up their city and removing dirty industrial sites. Yuppies have moved back, businesses have relocated to the downtown cores, and the quality of life has improved for the vast vast majority of residents. Some are left behind (see "good ole days" threads), but that will always happen with progress.

The reactionary fantasy is the belief that manufacturing jobs are good for the city.

[coldwine]

You said it much better than I did, softdev.

[Lookout Kid]

The reason that many are hopeful about a manufacturing revival is that most large cities have a HUGE pool of unskilled labor. And the service economy has done little to improve the plight of these people. It's hard to imagine a workable economy where one half of the population flips burgers for the other half.