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Old 06-22-2010, 01:35 PM
 
Location: Out of Florida........
4,266 posts, read 3,512,870 times
Reputation: 874
Quote:
Originally Posted by ahigherway View Post
Hi Betsey!
I LOVE the color coding! I'd like to do it too, just that I'm a bit lazy.. But it's nice on the eyes!

Well, I think we agree more than you think we do. I agree that the Holy Spirit must woo the individual, and although we do in some way respond, I think it's more similar to Saul's "who art thou, Lord??"-type of response, not a "well, I sat down and made some calculations, and came up with the conclusion that it's better to follow Jesus Christ"-type response.
Unfortunately, many many Christians are so PROUD of "their" decision to "accept Christ." I don't know if you see the subtlety of this attitude, but it declares a type of pride. I know it well because I got sucked into it for a number of years, perhaps unconsciously. The result is that we start to believe that we "got our act together" while other people are just plain idiots for not doing so like we have. And this, I believe, is another work of the flesh/devil/son of perdition in man.
I don't believe the world is guilty of "judging" Christians, they are simply perceiving the arrogance of the "self-made Christian."
I can tell you without lying that I would not be here today if it were not for God intervening in my life.
That's why I asked you before (I know why you didn't answer) what the purpose of praying is, if man must be "free to choose Christ." It's obvious that it is God who does the work, choosing some, not choosing others at this hour.
We cannot obviously be praying for others if God somehow had His "hands tied" from saving. The saving work is His, and who is saved now if for Him to decide, just as the Jews are not being saved (for the most part) right now, either. They will be brought in later. All part of His plan...

Blessings,
brian
You asked me a question to which you stated "you already know the answer".....then why in the hell are you asking me again, if your mind's already made up? Brian....it's too late in the hour, okay. Play your games with somebody else.........I HAVE WORK TO DO! You got a problem with praying? How else are you suppose to talk to God? PRAY HARDER!

PS: If I was you, I would get my eyes off of the... how you put it...."self-made Christians", the "righteous Christians", the "arrogant Christians", and "whoever else" you deemed them to be, and fasten them to lost, the hopeless, the hurting, the weary, the hungry, the tired. It's for these that He came. If that's your assignment, by all means keep pointing YOUR finger, but word of advice, GO STAND IN THE MIRROR while you're doing it! I too have an assignment and your wasting my time! REALLY!

Last edited by Betsey Lane; 06-22-2010 at 01:47 PM..
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Old 06-22-2010, 06:06 PM
 
Location: Florida
5,261 posts, read 3,763,207 times
Reputation: 810
Quote:
Originally Posted by betsey lane View Post
you asked me a question to which you stated "you already know the answer".....then why in the hell are you asking me again, if your mind's already made up? Brian....it's too late in the hour, okay. Play your games with somebody else.........i have work to do! You got a problem with praying? How else are you suppose to talk to god? Pray harder!

Ps: If i was you, i would get my eyes off of the... How you put it...."self-made christians", the "righteous christians", the "arrogant christians", and "whoever else" you deemed them to be, and fasten them to lost, the hopeless, the hurting, the weary, the hungry, the tired. It's for these that he came. If that's your assignment, by all means keep pointing your finger, but word of advice, go stand in the mirror while you're doing it! I too have an assignment and your wasting my time! Really!
Amen Betsey!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Old 06-22-2010, 07:53 PM
 
Location: Washington State
3,371 posts, read 1,898,680 times
Reputation: 424
Quote:
Originally Posted by Betsey Lane View Post
You asked me a question to which you stated "you already know the answer".....then why in the hell are you asking me again, if your mind's already made up? Brian....it's too late in the hour, okay. Play your games with somebody else.........I HAVE WORK TO DO! You got a problem with praying? How else are you suppose to talk to God? PRAY HARDER!

PS: If I was you, I would get my eyes off of the... how you put it...."self-made Christians", the "righteous Christians", the "arrogant Christians", and "whoever else" you deemed them to be, and fasten them to lost, the hopeless, the hurting, the weary, the hungry, the tired. It's for these that He came. If that's your assignment, by all means keep pointing YOUR finger, but word of advice, GO STAND IN THE MIRROR while you're doing it! I too have an assignment and your wasting my time! REALLY!
Sometimes asking people questions and debating with them (even when we already know the answers) helps them open their eyes. Sometimes...

Jesus was good at it.
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Old 06-22-2010, 10:14 PM
 
1,897 posts, read 979,427 times
Reputation: 242
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jremy View Post

Any god that is a god of love only, is not the God revealed to us in Scripture. This UR argument has been used so much, and yet it is actually proof of the weakness of the position: an insistence upon incompleteness in this case, the insistence on a limited view of God's attributes. Statements like yours, "God is love. Love does not keep track of sins," are brought out in triumph as if they were the last word on the subject, while simultaneously refusing or failing to consider God's other attributes, namely, justice and holiness. A half-truth is a whole lie, as the saying goes.
God is not a "god OF love." GOD IS LOVE!

See red above. These statements "like yours" are statements in the bible. See red below.

1 Corinthians 13:

4Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. 5It is not rude, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. 6Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. 7It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres.
8Love never fails.

It gets old trying to explain to people that justice and holiness do not conflict with love. Justice is the administration of FAIR punishment. There is nothing FAIR about someone being set on fire consciously for eternity. That's not an opinion either. It's a fact! Anyone who thinks otherwise is foolish or brainwashed. The concept is just sick and twisted and a horrible degradation to the name of our Lord.
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Old 06-22-2010, 10:18 PM
 
Location: Vancouver, BC
823 posts, read 597,985 times
Reputation: 163
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bright Hope for Tomorrow View Post
God is not a "god OF love." GOD IS LOVE!

See red above. These statements "like yours" are statements in the bible. See red below.

1 Corinthians 13:

4Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. 5It is not rude, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. 6Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. 7It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres.
8Love never fails.

It gets old trying to explain to people that justice and holiness do not conflict with love. Justice is the administration of FAIR punishment. There is nothing FAIR about someone being set on fire consciously for eternity. That's not an opinion either. It's a fact! Anyone who thinks otherwise is foolish or brainwashed. The concept is just sick and twisted and a horrible degradation to the name of our Lord.
Very well said
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Old 06-22-2010, 10:27 PM
 
Location: Seattle, Wa
5,214 posts, read 3,126,568 times
Reputation: 401
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bright Hope for Tomorrow View Post

It gets old trying to explain to people that justice and holiness do not conflict with love. Justice is the administration of FAIR punishment. There is nothing FAIR about someone being set on fire consciously for eternity. That's not an opinion either. It's a fact! Anyone who thinks otherwise is foolish or brainwashed. The concept is just sick and twisted and a horrible degradation to the name of our Lord.
These are human emotions, bound by the nature in which it entails. These emotions are not of God's for God's emotions are beyond our capability of understanding. All we know is that He loves us, and He sent His son to die for us, so that we MAY have eternal life.

May have.....believe in Him and you will have it...don't, and you won't.
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Old 06-22-2010, 10:55 PM
 
Location: Washington State
3,371 posts, read 1,898,680 times
Reputation: 424
Quote:
Originally Posted by sciotamicks View Post
These are human emotions, bound by the nature in which it entails. These emotions are not of God's for God's emotions are beyond our capability of understanding. All we know is that He loves us, and He sent His son to die for us, so that we MAY have eternal life.

May have.....believe in Him and you will have it...don't, and you won't.
WHAT is real "LIFE" like? Who really has it? How many Christians do you know that live in STARK contrast to everybody around them? Do you know automatically who they are? I am NOT talking about those who don't drink or swear or what-have-you. There are just as many atheists as "Christians" who don't do those things. And there are plenty of people in our mental health systems and prison systems who say they are Christian because they believe in Jesus. But just what does BELIEF entail?

Maybe there really just aren't as many Christians as you think. Those who KNOW God are his elect and will be used in the future for his purposes. They will PUT ON immortality.
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Old 06-22-2010, 11:18 PM
 
1,897 posts, read 979,427 times
Reputation: 242
Quote:
Originally Posted by sciotamicks View Post
These are human emotions, bound by the nature in which it entails. These emotions are not of God's for God's emotions are beyond our capability of understanding. All we know is that He loves us, and He sent His son to die for us, so that we MAY have eternal life.

May have.....believe in Him and you will have it...don't, and you won't.
I'm not sure which sentence you think is human emotion. If it's the part about setting someone on fire for eternity not being fair, it's a fact and not an emotion. If you don't believe me, I suggest that you go stick your palm on the hot stove eye for a minute or two and see if the pain is an emotion or a fact. If it, in fact, hurts, try to imagine being forced to leave it there not just for a minute or two, and not just your hand, but your whole body, and not just for a week or two, or a year or two, but forever, and try to determine if it would be an emotion or a fact, that it's not fair. ET'ers don't really think it through. They just say, "Oh God is so holy and just!! He's going to torture people forever! He's so loving and kind and just and holy! He can't look upon sin. Oh no! That would be too hard for him to do. So instead he's so good that he's going to let people burn and burn and burn some more, and then burn forever! I love him so much! "

Come on people! Setting someone ablaze WOULD NEVER, WILL NEVER, COULD NEVER be fair or love in any way whatsoever. If you think God is going to do that, IMO, you do not KNOW the true and living God.

P.S. Before I'm reprimanded, I confess that I know there's no bible verse that says, "Stick your hand on the hot stove and you'll see that pain is a fact and not an emotion, and you'll understand why setting someone on fire for eternity is not fair."

Last edited by Bright Hope for Tomorrow; 06-22-2010 at 11:28 PM..
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Old 06-23-2010, 01:42 AM
 
Location: Seattle, Wa
5,214 posts, read 3,126,568 times
Reputation: 401
BHFT,

Who ever said the tormented will feel physical pain?
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Old 06-23-2010, 02:28 AM
 
Location: Texas
4,345 posts, read 3,531,001 times
Reputation: 816
Quote:
Originally Posted by sciotamicks View Post
May have.....believe in Him and you will have it...don't, and you won't.
Or: that which believes has life. That which doesn't believe perishes.

Just remove the ambiguous 3rd party from the equation.
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