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Old 06-20-2010, 09:25 PM
 
Location: Cleveland, Ohio
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How much influence does B.C. Zoroastrianism (or any pre-Yeshua religion) have on the Abrahamic religions? Is Zoroastrianism closer to traditional Christianity than Universal Reconciliation?

Here are a few of Zoroastrianism's beliefs:

Trinity.
Demonology.
Eschatology.
Everlasting hell.

It is my firm belief that traditional Christianity departed from the faith almost the minute it left the gate. I also believe that people who believe in the Restoration of ALL Things, who were heavily persecuted in the past, are much, MUCH closer to the truth than any other group on this planet.

How have the above beliefs (Everlasting hell, etc.) twisted the true message of the gospel and the reconciliation of ALL things?

Last edited by herefornow; 06-20-2010 at 10:40 PM..
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Old 06-21-2010, 04:14 AM
 
Location: Germany
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I don't know if Zoroastrianism believes in a trinity, I hear that for the first time, Zoroastrianism was a monotheist religion

it believes in a strong duality opposed to the original Jewish belief that God is the creator of both good and evil and Satan only God's tool (not a fallen angel)

it is not true that Zoroastrianism teaches everlasting damnation, as far as I know it teaches the salvation of all men (though after long and severe punishment of the sinners) and the annihilation of the devil and hell; other sources say that also the devil will ultimately be saved

Zoroastrianism teaches also a physical ressurection which is pretty unique for a "pagan" religion, some say Zoroaster learned from the prophet Daniel, others claim the way round, that Daniel borrowed from Zoroaster, there is generally only little known about Zoroastrianism, I think it is a very interesting religion, it also teaches a Savior to come; the 3 three wise men who visited Jesus after His birth are often said to have been Zoroastrianists

I think Zoroastrianism is closer to Judaism than Christianity as judgment is solely based on works and not on faith

the Catholic doctrine of hell is rather based on Egypt and Greek mythology and on Plato's idea of an immortal soul, I even read that Plato was the first to teach everlasting damnation (though for only a few), it is often claimed that universalism is derived from Plato which obviously cannot be true as Plato was no universalist but may have introduced the idea of everlasting punishment in Greek thought, though I cannot assure that this claim is true.

Last edited by svenM; 06-21-2010 at 04:28 AM..
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Old 06-21-2010, 04:48 AM
 
Location: Cleveland, Ohio
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Quote:
Originally Posted by svenM View Post
I don't know if Zoroastrianism believes in a trinity, I hear that for the first time, Zoroastrianism was a monotheist religion

it believes in a strong duality opposed to the original Jewish belief that God is the creator of both good and evil and Satan only God's tool (not a fallen angel)

it is not true that Zoroastrianism teaches everlasting damnation, as far as I know it teaches the salvation of all men (though after long and severe punishment of the sinners) and the annihilation of the devil and hell; other sources say that also the devil will ultimately be saved

Zoroastrianism teaches also a physical ressurection which is pretty unique for a "pagan" religion, some say Zoroaster learned from the prophet Daniel, others claim the way round, that Daniel borrowed from Zoroaster, there is generally only little known about Zoroastrianism, I think it is a very interesting religion, it also teaches a Savior to come; the 3 three wise men who visited Jesus after His birth are often said to have been Zoroastrianists

I think Zoroastrianism is closer to Judaism than Christianity as judgment is solely based on works and not on faith

the Catholic doctrine of hell is rather based on Egypt and Greek mythology and on Plato's idea of an immortal soul, I even read that Plato was the first to teach everlasting damnation (though for only a few), it is often claimed that universalism is derived from Plato which obviously cannot be true as Plato was no universalist but may have introduced the idea of everlasting punishment in Greek thought, though I cannot assure that this claim is true.
Thanks for the reply, Sven. It's 3:45 a.m. where I am, and I've got to get to bed, but I'll let you know where I was going with this, tomorrow.
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Old 06-21-2010, 05:58 AM
 
Location: Florida
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Quote:
Originally Posted by herefornow View Post
I also believe that people who believe in the Restoration of ALL Things, who were heavily persecuted in the past, are much, MUCH closer to the truth than any other group on this planet.
I believe that as well. The flock truly IS a 'Little Flock' indeed.

Don't be afraid, little flock. Your Father is pleased to give you the kingdom. - Luke 12:32

Heartsong
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Old 06-21-2010, 06:49 PM
 
Location: The western periphery of Terra Australis
24,683 posts, read 45,377,277 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by svenM View Post
I don't know if Zoroastrianism believes in a trinity, I hear that for the first time, Zoroastrianism was a monotheist religion

it believes in a strong duality opposed to the original Jewish belief that God is the creator of both good and evil and Satan only God's tool (not a fallen angel)

it is not true that Zoroastrianism teaches everlasting damnation, as far as I know it teaches the salvation of all men (though after long and severe punishment of the sinners) and the annihilation of the devil and hell; other sources say that also the devil will ultimately be saved

Zoroastrianism teaches also a physical ressurection which is pretty unique for a "pagan" religion, some say Zoroaster learned from the prophet Daniel, others claim the way round, that Daniel borrowed from Zoroaster, there is generally only little known about Zoroastrianism, I think it is a very interesting religion, it also teaches a Savior to come; the 3 three wise men who visited Jesus after His birth are often said to have been Zoroastrianists

I think Zoroastrianism is closer to Judaism than Christianity as judgment is solely based on works and not on faith

the Catholic doctrine of hell is rather based on Egypt and Greek mythology and on Plato's idea of an immortal soul, I even read that Plato was the first to teach everlasting damnation (though for only a few), it is often claimed that universalism is derived from Plato which obviously cannot be true as Plato was no universalist but may have introduced the idea of everlasting punishment in Greek thought, though I cannot assure that this claim is true.
I heard some sects of Zoroastrianism did actually teach ET, but yes, the gist of the ET teaching was from Greece in particular (Tartarus, Hades are of course Greek words, and it wasn't merely the words but the concepts that were borrowed).
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Old 06-21-2010, 07:04 PM
 
Location: New York City
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http://www.city-data.com/forum/relig...ity-islam.html

You're welcome.
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Old 06-21-2010, 10:44 PM
 
7,374 posts, read 7,401,731 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by svenM View Post
I don't know if Zoroastrianism believes in a trinity, I hear that for the first time, Zoroastrianism was a monotheist religion

it believes in a strong duality opposed to the original Jewish belief that God is the creator of both good and evil and Satan only God's tool (not a fallen angel)

it is not true that Zoroastrianism teaches everlasting damnation, as far as I know it teaches the salvation of all men (though after long and severe punishment of the sinners) and the annihilation of the devil and hell; other sources say that also the devil will ultimately be saved

Zoroastrianism teaches also a physical ressurection which is pretty unique for a "pagan" religion, some say Zoroaster learned from the prophet Daniel, others claim the way round, that Daniel borrowed from Zoroaster, there is generally only little known about Zoroastrianism, I think it is a very interesting religion, it also teaches a Savior to come; the 3 three wise men who visited Jesus after His birth are often said to have been Zoroastrianists

I think Zoroastrianism is closer to Judaism than Christianity as judgment is solely based on works and not on faith

the Catholic doctrine of hell is rather based on Egypt and Greek mythology and on Plato's idea of an immortal soul, I even read that Plato was the first to teach everlasting damnation (though for only a few), it is often claimed that universalism is derived from Plato which obviously cannot be true as Plato was no universalist but may have introduced the idea of everlasting punishment in Greek thought, though I cannot assure that this claim is true.
There were actually both ET and UR in Zoroastrianism.

Quote:
Dating is important for Zoroastrianism because it incorporates many elements that may have influenced more flourishing religions, such as Judaism and Christianity, and even Greek and Roman religions. However, even determining the dates for Zoroaster himself and for the era of his religion does not resolve the most intractable questions of influence, since there are few early archaeological or textual records. Most of the surviving materials are quite late, and it is impossible to determine with certainty the nature of their originals. We do know that Zoroastrianism went through at least two major transformations, once when it integrated elements of the old Indo-Iranian pagan religions and again when Zurvan (Time) rose to the top of Zoroastrian pantheon and Zurvanism modified the dualism that otherwise characterizes Zoroastrianism. These transformations over time further complicate research into the transmission of ideas from Zoroastrianism.
Consequently very influential ideas about the afterlife — like hell, heaven, individual judgment, resurrection of the dead, and last judgment — might originate here, or they might be later borrowings. We find the idea of the judgment of the individual at death as an element of the Egyptian afterlife, but there is no evidence of Egyptian influence on the ideas of Zoroastrianism. Zoroastrianism probably does introduce the idea of final judgment or Apocalypse (Frashegird or Frashokereti ). The fate of wicked souls after the Frashgird evolved in Zoroastrianism. Scholars of Zoroastrianism find that in earlier texts, the souls would be subjected to everlasting punishment in hell, later the belief was that they would be destroyed in the molten metal of the Apocalypse, and even later belief holds that the molten metal will actually purify everything, allowing even the wicked to proceed to heaven. However, the ultimate fate of the wicked is not conclusively explained in any of the hell texts themselves.


From Eileen Gardiner, editor; Hell-On-Line: Zoroastrian Hell

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Old 06-22-2010, 02:39 AM
 
Location: Cleveland, Ohio
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Ironmaw, you are correct. There was both ET and UR in Zoroastrianism. I just went to the library and found all the books I could on the subject. I'm still working a few things out in my mind, and I was out with my husband all day, but I'll try and post in this thread some more, as soon as I'm able to get on the computer again.
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Old 06-22-2010, 02:41 AM
 
Location: Cleveland, Ohio
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Quote:
Originally Posted by InsaneInDaMembrane View Post
Thanks, Insane. That should help. I'm gathering info from wherever I can.
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Old 06-22-2010, 09:31 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by herefornow View Post
Ironmaw, you are correct. There was both ET and UR in Zoroastrianism. I just went to the library and found all the books I could on the subject. I'm still working a few things out in my mind, and I was out with my husband all day, but I'll try and post in this thread some more, as soon as I'm able to get on the computer again.

Yep ... When you realize that Zoroastrianism was the mystery religion of Babylon around the time of the Babylonian captivity of Israel, it is easy to realize that the mystery Babylon of the book of revelations is in fact the religious (particularly the Pharisaic) traditions of the Hebrews before, during and after the times of Christ, and the various sects of traditional Christianity and Islam are in fact the many harlots which she did birth into the world.
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