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Old 07-07-2010, 07:11 AM
 
5,925 posts, read 5,837,276 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sciotamicks View Post
I never said anything about you or those who believe in UR.
That...is up to God. But He is clear about the wicked who die in their sins without Christ. VERY CLEAR.

You do not need to speak words for everything. The reason you have not said anything is because you cannot dispute someone who believes in Christ as being saved.

However, you maintain that someone who believes in Christ is sending others to hell through their teachings.

So we are either held accountable for that or not.

If not, you believe as some believe that once you accept Christ then no sinful action you take after that actually matters.

If so, then indeed redemption after death exists and you have only divided the word of God with a man made set of instructions for doing so.
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Old 07-07-2010, 08:18 AM
 
Location: Italy
6,387 posts, read 5,286,583 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sciotamicks View Post

Yes! Accept Christ and be put to death with Him.

"Accept Christ" is not in the NT.

You can't spiritually die twice.....

Who says so?

in some fairy tale lake of fire.....

Lake of fire is in the Bible.

you are already dead unless you accept Christ as YOUR PERSONAL SAVIOUR...now..in this life.

Please show me where it says, "in this life."




Man has no part whatever in regeneration.

Bravo!!

You have a duty to return to God, but you do not have the ability. Responsibility does not imply ability!

Try telling that to your employer some time!


Confession is your responsibility.

Not looking at what happened to Saul!

1 Corinthians 2:14-15 But the natural man does not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; nor can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned. But he who is spiritual judges all things, yet he himself is rightly judged by no one.

Natural man is dead and totally unreceptive to the gospel.

That's why he is not responsible for saving himself.


He must first be given life before he can understand the gospel.

What happened to Saul will happen to all!


It is not that God drags those who don't want to come.

No one "wants to come."

It is that God makes willing by his grace. In regeneration, God gives us spiritual life which includes a desire for him. If God gives us a desire for Christ, we will act according to that desire and we will choose Christ.

Agreed!




Those born under Grace are those that are regenerated in the spirit, and duly confess to Christ as Lord and Saviour. Hence...born again.

"Born under grace??"


Resurreciton of the dead...yes...and resurrection of Israel as a collective body judged on their works,

So works are important?


and the marriage of the church, the wife of Christ to Christ. Yet Revelation 21 speaks of a Post Parousia world, as well as many others text that John himself confirms in his book.

I can't find "Post Parousia world" in the Bible...

What you don;t accept, is that judgement in the New World exists, and eternal death exists, even when it is plainly in front of you in you Bible.

Couldn't find "eternal death" in the KJV. I did find this in the Amplified, however: "For the Son of man came to save [from the penalty of eternal death] that which was lost."
How many are lost? You mentioned elsewhere that "many" doesn't mean "all," so please clarify this for me.

You believe, that there is another...resurrection for the wicked that pay for their sins in the lake of fire, only to be resurrected again to life....

God is the eternal fire. That's where we're all going, brother.



Everyone is not in the covenant of grace.
Look around...or better yet...look in the mirror!

There's the condemnation attitude I used to have!! Jesus said that if we condemn, we ourselves will be condemned. Many fundamentalists are ALREADY condemned!




But He chooses to whom He shows that mercy to.

Romans 9:15 For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion.

18 Therefore hath he mercy on whom he will [have mercy], and whom he will he hardeneth.

32 Because [they sought it] not by faith...


You need faith to have God's mercy.

Just like Saul, who got an overdose of faith in the blink of an eye!


Any more?
Yes, there is more.
If we believe that we must "do something" of ourselves in order to be pleasing to God, then we have no need of the cross. The gift of salvation becomes unnecessary because we can save ourselves without His grace.
The Law, which was unable to save, is replaced by a Christ who also is unable to save.
14 For if they which are of the law be heirs, faith is made void, and the promise made of none effect: 15 Because the law worketh wrath: for where no law is, there is no transgression.
16 Therefore it is of faith, that it might be by grace; to the end the promise might be sure to all the seed; not to that only which is of the law, but to that also which is of the faith of Abraham; who is the father of us all,
17 (As it is written, I have made thee a father of many nations,) before him whom he believed, even God, who quickeneth the dead, and calleth those things which be not as though they were.
18 Who against hope believed in hope, that he might become the father of many nations, according to that which was spoken, So shall thy seed be.

But Christ is all and in all [everything and everywhere, to all men, without distinction of person]. He is in all humanity, and will rise in due time.

Repeat: any thing that "we" must "do" of ourselves brings us under the law again. And the message of "doing something" to please God returns us to the Law, and wrath.

No man has faith in himself. He cannot even understand his way.
The Father must draw the person against his will. (There was no one trying to "convince Saul" to "accept Jesus" on that road heading to Damascus. He was a-p-p-r-e-h-e-n-d-e-d by God.)

God most certainly does things against our will. Just take a look around you! Did you give God permission to create you?? Did you tell God where you should be born? what you should look like? which traits to have? talents? Did you?

Did God ask your permission in order to be born in Adam? No. That is why He put all mankind in Christ. Not all have faith yet, because He is not giving faith to all right now.

God is the potter. He doesn't ask the clay if it wants to be molded, nor what form it wants to be made into!


Blessings to all,
brian
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Old 07-07-2010, 10:21 AM
 
1,897 posts, read 1,770,732 times
Reputation: 264
Quote:
Originally Posted by ahigherway View Post
Yes, there is more.
If we believe that we must "do something" of ourselves in order to be pleasing to God, then we have no need of the cross. The gift of salvation becomes unnecessary because we can save ourselves without His grace.
The Law, which was unable to save, is replaced by a Christ who also is unable to save.
14 For if they which are of the law be heirs, faith is made void, and the promise made of none effect: 15 Because the law worketh wrath: for where no law is, there is no transgression.
16 Therefore it is of faith, that it might be by grace; to the end the promise might be sure to all the seed; not to that only which is of the law, but to that also which is of the faith of Abraham; who is the father of us all,
17 (As it is written, I have made thee a father of many nations,) before him whom he believed, even God, who quickeneth the dead, and calleth those things which be not as though they were.
18 Who against hope believed in hope, that he might become the father of many nations, according to that which was spoken, So shall thy seed be.

But Christ is all and in all [everything and everywhere, to all men, without distinction of person]. He is in all humanity, and will rise in due time.

Repeat: any thing that "we" must "do" of ourselves brings us under the law again. And the message of "doing something" to please God returns us to the Law, and wrath.

No man has faith in himself. He cannot even understand his way.
The Father must draw the person against his will. (There was no one trying to "convince Saul" to "accept Jesus" on that road heading to Damascus. He was a-p-p-r-e-h-e-n-d-e-d by God.)

God most certainly does things against our will. Just take a look around you! Did you give God permission to create you?? Did you tell God where you should be born? what you should look like? which traits to have? talents? Did you?

Did God ask your permission in order to be born in Adam? No. That is why He put all mankind in Christ. Not all have faith yet, because He is not giving faith to all right now.

God is the potter. He doesn't ask the clay if it wants to be molded, nor what form it wants to be made into!


Blessings to all,
brian
Another great post by Brian!
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